HTXBreh
Superstar
CP3 is still the Batman of this team past his prime you should respect that.
murksiderock
Superstar
He plays the 4 in most of Mke's lineups...
Giannis is getting his due across the board bro, I'm just not willing to overrate him...
Longevity matters to me. Harden has been an elite player in this league a good bit longer than Giannis, and his MVP finishes reflect that (Top 5 6x compared to 3x for Giannis). We got 8 years of Harden as a #1 in Houston, having one 60-win season, 5 50-win seasons, winning ~52.4 games/season; made the playoffs all of those years and got to two conference finals, and did all of that in the tougher conference...
Harden was the leading MVP candidate at the onset of his injury this year, in the same conference as Giannis...
Bringing up Harden's playoff resume is faulty on two points because it's not as if Giannis is carrying around this elite playoff background himself---->he has chokes in b2b postseasons where he was eliminated and tried to choke away the series vs the Nets this year; everytime there's a superstar on the other side he gets outplayed. Harden has several series that he was great in, and sure he has more than a few chokes but we're comparing him to Giannis here, not some guy who just dominates each playoffs after playoffs...
There are people that would rank Kawhi Top 25 but I'm not there yet. Regardless he's ahead of Giannis...
Giannis winning it this year would be terrific on a legacy that is growing even without a ring this year, I wanna stress that he's ascending regardless. This one title run isn't going to jump him over guys who were great for longer, though...
Diondon
Thanks to the lawyers uh, I marbled the foyer
NBA top 3
KD, AD, Kawhi
Giannis somewhere outside that
KD, AD, Kawhi
Giannis somewhere outside that
ISO
Pass me the rock nikka
U are under the assumption that the Hawks have to beat those past teams to be worthy. That’s not how it works and we don’t have a magic ball to see how they would have fared against those other teams. Hawks just beat 2021 Philly so why can’t they take 2019 Philly?
The Heat were like this years Hawks, teams that made “unexpected” runs but were two of the hottest teams coming into the playoffs. The Hawks aren’t lacking talent but they’re getting underrated for the purpose of the narrative.
I also disagree that the Bucks have all the best players after KD this is how I rank them (players who at least averaged 15 minutes) not factoring in Kyrie and Harden (who again played in the series).
Middleton
Jrue
Lopez
Harris
Griffin
Brown
Green
Shamet
Connaughton
Tucker
It’s also not about the Nets being a championship level team without Kyrie and Harden but rather being an extremely tough out even without them. shyt if they beat the Bucks I’m not sure what makes you think KD has no chance of going all the way. Most players and teams would fold with Durant playing on a god tier level so yeah Giannis should get credit for beating the Nets and having a 40 point game in the close out. I also don’t know where this silly narrative came that the Nets don’t have depth. A guy like Bruce Brown isn’t a big name but is solid all-around and super efficient and a versatile player and I recall him killing the Bucks with floaters. Somehow P.J. Tucker’s old ass is better because he has a bigger name and defended Durant.
I don’t have Giannis leapfrogging KG. KG is close to top 15. Also, CP3 ring hold weight because he’s still a premier PG and the best player and leader on his team. I was going to make a thread on where he ranks too.
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ISO
Pass me the rock nikka
Giannis hasn’t choked he’s lost series as an underdog and lost series where he faced wall defenses. He lost fair and square and limitations hampered him these aren’t mental chokes where he’s grossly underperforming.
Harden chokes. It’s a difference between losing a series and choking a series. Giannis worst performances cannot stack up to the things Harden has done.
10 points, 7 assists, 6 turnovers, 2 of 11 shooting, loses by 39 points at home to a Kawhi-less Spurs team
That is choking and Harden has a nice list of similar performances.
Harden was never going to win MVP. Jokic had that sewn up. Giannis not getting MVP love is voter fatigue. He actually won MVP over Harden twice. Harden also played in D’Antoni’s offense with 40% usage rates racking up stats. Giannis over Harden all day bro, Harden has too many unexplainable, egregious choke jobs and they don’t compare on defense.
murksiderock
Superstar
Giannis hasn’t choked he’s lost series as an underdog and lost series where he faced wall defenses. He lost fair and square and limitations hampered him these aren’t mental chokes where he’s grossly underperforming.
Harden chokes. It’s a difference between losing a series and choking a series. Giannis worst performances cannot stack up to the things Harden has done.
10 points, 7 assists, 6 turnovers, 2 of 11 shooting, loses by 39 points at home to a Kawhi-less Spurs team
That is choking and Harden has a nice list of similar performances.
Harden was never going to win MVP. Jokic had that sewn up. Giannis not getting MVP love is voter fatigue. He actually won MVP over Harden twice. Harden also played in D’Antoni’s offense with 40% usage rates racking up stats. Giannis over Harden all day bro, Harden has too many unexplainable, egregious choke jobs and they don’t compare on defense.
Fair enough, I mean you have your definition of what matters abd what choking is, and I have mine. I dig it though, bruh...
We aren't talking about someone with this steel postseason resume in Giannis to be bringing up Harden's chokes. Giannis' play routinely dips when facing quality competition, while he just beasts all over teams like '19 Boston, '20 Orlando, '21 Miami. His play against equal or better teams is unbecoming of the kind of credibility you're issuing him; I know what his numbers say. I also watched him play in these series to see he's consistently a lesser version of himself and choking (how I define it) when you need this nikka to play like a fukking 2x MVP and DPOY...
I'm not taking Giannis over Harden at this stage of their careers. Giannis won two MVPs over everyone, not just Harden. There's a strong consensus that Harden should probably have an extra MVP, with most people pointing to '17. Regardless, Harden has finished Top 5 six times to Giannis' three---->Giannis was in the NBA when Beard was finishing ahead of him in '14, '15, '17, and '18...
In the five straight years Mke has made the playoffs, which virtually align with Giannis' ascension as an elite, Top 10 level player, he's led the Bucks to an average of ~52.2 wins/year, a Finals appearance, two ECFs, and two Rd1 losses. His effect on winning and floor-raising to me aren't proven to be greater than Beard's, and again I think a W in The Finals and his appearance in general are noteworthy, but he's not skipping over Harden with it simply because in my estimation it's clear he isnt a better basketball player, doesn't have a stronger impact on winning, and hasn't been great for as long as Harden has...
Go ahead and do the CP3 thread like this one, I have similar viewpoints!
There's no Top 25 option so I voted Top 30.
ISO
Pass me the rock nikka
Giannis play is typical of an elite guy who hasn’t gotten over the hump typical growing pains in my opinion
If you feel that way on Harden I won’t debate you on it I like Harden’s skills but he is just
That man is indefensible as far as I’m concerned.
CP3 thread is up...
Where would CP3 rank after championship?
murksiderock
Superstar
Giannis play is typical of an elite guy who hasn’t gotten over the hump typical growing pains in my opinion
If you feel that way on Harden I won’t debate you on it I like Harden’s skills but he is just
That man is indefensible as far as I’m concerned.
CP3 thread is up...
Where would CP3 rank after championship?
I do wanna reiterate that Giannis is only ascending to me. He's climbing the boards, and he's young enough that we could still see another level of play unlocked. I'm not sure I see him ever getting inside of Top 20, because most of those guys walked in the door as superstars destroying The League, so he's playing catch up. But he still has plenty of time and the acceleration of his ascent will be determined on what he does going forward...
So for me currently in the 50-75 range, which is damn impressive considering this league been around 75 years and he's only 8 years in. A win makes him a Top 50 lock for me after 8 years, and regardless he's still climbing the boards pretty quickly...
Career is still way too young but he’s already in the top 50
RennisDeynolds
I am untethered and my rage knows no bounds!
Everyday we talk about how his skillset is minimal compared to others in the league. I want him to win just so the media pushes the narrative that he is the best player in the world 
RadaMillz
Superstar
I read the title wrong
I thought it was top 10 right now
Giannis at this point of time in his career is top 30
I thought it was top 10 right now
Giannis at this point of time in his career is top 30
It's to early to start this type of discussion honestly but he's in my top 30 somewhere with a ring considering how his resume would look at this point. But I still think we should wait until he hits at least 30 to start these all time discussions and who he may or may not surpass in his career.
