What could black conservatives do to earn therespectof black America

[The Real]

They would have to stop buying into anti-Black nonsense as part of their entry ticket into the conservative institutions they frequent. Instead of being patronizing and elitist about Black suffering, they could actually go into the hood and try and lead by example or engage the community. A lot of the organizing the Black Panthers did, for example, was completely compatible with conservatism- teaching personal responsibility, the value of families, self-defense, learning your constitutional rights so you can't be abused, educational programs that teach you about your history and people, and concrete initiatives to build and keep families and communities together. They could also help with creating and maintaining Black businesses a la Garvey's program. You won't see most of these Black conservatives doing anything like that, though. Instead, they spend all their time blaming Black people for all their problems and parroting or enabling white racist ideas and free market garbage that will only further deracinate the same institutions (community, family, etc.) they claim to want to "conserve." The dishonest ones are just in it for themselves- they make the trade-off because they want successful careers, and find them in the niche market for Black mouthpieces for white racism. Anyway, no amount of moral chastising will change the Black community.

 

[Dusty Bake Activate]

They would have to stop buying into anti-Black nonsense as part of their entry ticket into the conservative institutions they frequent. Instead of being patronizing and elitist about Black suffering, they could actually go into the hood and try and lead by example or engage the community. A lot of the organizing the Black Panthers did, for example, was completely compatible with conservatism- teaching personal responsibility, the value of families, self-defense, learning your constitutional rights so you can't be abused, and concrete initiatives to build and keep families and communities together. They could also help with creating and maintaining Black businesses a la Garvey's program. You won't see most of these Black conservatives doing anything like that, though. Instead, they spend all their time blaming Black people for all their problems and parroting or enabling white racist ideas and free market garbage that will only further deracinate the same institutions (community, family, etc.) they claim to want to "conserve." The dishonest ones are just in it for themselves- they make the trade-off because they want successful careers, and find them in the niche market for Black mouthpieces for white racism. Anyway, no amount of moral chastising will change the Black community.

Yeah J. C. Watts said he got disillusioned with the GOP because they had zero for black communities. Wouldn't engage at all.

I remember at that 2008 Republican presidential debate where some black dude asked the candidates what could be done about violence in the hood and Romney just said "God bless Bill Cosby for telling the truth."

 

[NZA]

forgetting black people for a moment, most self-reporting conservative and independent americans of all colors are more liberal than they think they are. if they are white, some will suffer from a schism where they like social safety nets for themselves and hate it when they imagine lazy black people benefiting from it. the cognitive dissonance of a cac brain is fierce. they are willing to vote against it, but if their candidate or bill loses at the ballot box, they will happily enjoy those safety nets and might threaten the "2nd amendment solution" if you are too slow in dispensing them.

back to black folks...

INTRACTABLE ISSUES:
most favor social safety nets
most favor adequate minimum wages
most favor an expansion of jobs in the public sector
most favor civil rights legislation pertaining to voting, discrimination, and targeted violence
most do not favor neocon style diplomacy

the issues i mention above are simply too important for most black people to let go of in favor of voting for any party that cant deliver on them.contrary to the racist slurs against our thought process, we actually make parties at least pay lip service to our agenda. if democrats dont always keep up their end of the bargain, that is nothing unique only to blacks. show me a political party that did not attract sleazy candidates or compromise on values out of political opportunity. we never say white people are slaves to anybody even if those white people are being lied to, fleeced, and sent to have their legs blown off in foreign countries.

SO-SO ISSUES:
multiculturalism
affirmative action
drug war
gay rights

as we all know, blacks are very culturally southern and christian, so gay rights support of all blacks is not as strong as the most liberal wing of the democratic party as a whole. ultimately, gay rights never come at a cost to black people, so blacks and gays can stay in the same side of the political spectrum with little turbulence. affirmative action really doesnt seem like a major issue for rank and file black people. i think white people deal with it, get pissed off about it, and ironically benefit from it more than anybody else. most blacks wont miss AA as it gets increasingly minimized. i dont think most have drawn the conclusion that the war on drugs is destabilizing the community yet, but as more lily white states legalize weed, there will be a push to demilitarize the cops in our communities as well, and it will be because of the changing attitudes on drugs. support for inclusive education and government accommodations for people of all races and religions doesnt seem to be that strong. texas routinely marginalizes nonwhite history and other studies in the public school system and blacks pretty much havent raised peep. black conservatives can maintain a right wing position on these issues and probably not turn too many black people off, although i think attacking multiculturalism too much can make you look very rac00nish...

 

[acri1]

forgetting black people for a moment, most self-reporting conservative and independent americans of all colors are more liberal than they think they are. if they are white, some will suffer from a schism where they like social safety nets for themselves and hate it when they imagine lazy black people benefiting from it. the cognitive dissonance of a cac brain is fierce. they are willing to vote against it, but if their candidate or bill loses at the ballot box, they will happily enjoy those safety nets and might threaten the "2nd amendment solution" if you are too slow in dispensing them.

back to black folks...

INTRACTABLE ISSUES:
most favor social safety nets
most favor adequate minimum wages
most favor an expansion of jobs in the public sector
most favor civil rights legislation pertaining to voting, discrimination, and targeted violence
most do not favor neocon style diplomacy

the issues i mention above are simply too important for most black people to let go of in favor of voting for any party that cant deliver on them.contrary to the racist slurs against our thought process, we actually make parties at least pay lip service to our agenda. if democrats dont always keep up their end of the bargain, that is nothing unique only to blacks. show me a political party that did not attract sleazy candidates or compromise on values out of political opportunity. we never say white people are slaves to anybody even if those white people are being lied to, fleeced, and sent to have their legs blown off in foreign countries.

SO-SO ISSUES:
multiculturalism
affirmative action
drug war
gay rights

as we all know, blacks are very culturally southern and christian, so gay rights support of all blacks is not as strong as the most liberal wing of the democratic party as a whole. ultimately, gay rights never come at a cost to black people, so blacks and gays can stay in the same side of the political spectrum with little turbulence. affirmative action really doesnt seem like a major issue for rank and file black people. i think white people deal with it, get pissed off about it, and ironically benefit from it more than anybody else. most blacks wont miss AA as it gets increasingly minimized. i dont think most have drawn the conclusion that the war on drugs is destabilizing the community yet, but as more lily white states legalize weed, there will be a push to demilitarize the cops in our communities as well, and it will be because of the changing attitudes on drugs. support for inclusive education and government accommodations for people of all races and religions doesnt seem to be that strong. texas routinely marginalizes nonwhite history and other studies in the public school system and blacks pretty much havent raised peep. black conservatives can maintain a right wing position on these issues and probably not turn too many black people off, although i think attacking multiculturalism too much can make you look very rac00nish...

I mostly agree, but I'd say black people are a little more anti- drug war than your thinking. For example, according to polls African Americans are more likely than whites to support marijuana legalization.

Democrats, (59 percent), males (57 percent), African Americans (56 percent), and those respondents between the ages of 18 and 29 (64 percent) were most likely to favor legalizing marijuana. Female respondents (48 percent), Republicans (37 percent), and those age 65 and over (33 percent) were least likely to back legalization.

I'd also say that rather than black people being "very culturally southern and christian", it's more like "slightly more culturally southern and christian than average". But I don't think black people (or most people) really care about stuff like gay rights all that much either way, certainly not enough to vote based on it. I remember when Republicans deluded themselves into thinking that Obama would lose the black vote because he said he supported gay marriage.

Then the election came and he still got like 95% of the black vote.


And I'm not sure multiculturalism is a political issue, seems more like something Republicans bytch about from time to time.

 

[No_bammer_weed]

You're really not challenging me here.

I'm sticking to my argument.

Remove the racism from the GOP and you get more black republicans. HANDS. DOWN. A lot of minorities I know DO NOT support social safety nets...but you'd never know beacuse you don't ask them.

A lot of the GOP's policies aren't even THAT racist, but the fact that so many of them ARE, blacks are just distanced from the party.

It takes time for entire demographics to shift voting habits. Post 1960s, there havent been major issues to push people to one side or another like racism...not even abortion could do that.

Thats why your arguments about dole/bush don't make any sense.

Naw this isnt right. You have to be careful with conservative/progressive labeling as standalone explanations for things. Removing "racism" out of the GOP is a non-sequitur, because removing racism from policy and ideas rearranges the molecular structure of arguments. Let me explain: Had bush sr. passed the ACA, ideas shaped by the heritage foundation, it would have been considered a centrist/right leaning solution to healthcare reform via expansion of the marketplace, and not the SOCIALIST MARXIST GOVT. TAKEOVER OF HEALTHCARE because it was passed under Obama. Also, remember how wiretapping and surveillance drew howls of protest from the left under Bush Jr., but now draws yawns from progressives under Obama? Changing variables changes the chemistry of an idea, and response --- sometimes completely. Most arguments aren't easily reified as conservative/liberal.

Cons are comfortable with surrogate expressions as neutral policy because they know the end result will be of benefit to white people. They would not make policy suggestions that would explicitly benefit black people at the expense of whites (black folks know this). Cons are acutely aware that capitalism, as most anything else, latently acts with hostility and prejudice towards people of color and the poor. If black men were over represented as a racial distribution in the higher echelons of corporate America, conservatives would change their arguments on a dime. If black people do disfavor social safety nets (I call complete b.s on this), its for completely different reasons than why conservative white males disfavor it, so we're almost talking about different conversations and arguments.

The governing variable in american politics is racial resentment. Ethnic and racial cleavages shape principles. New deal policies were very popular among the same sorts of people who now call it communism and socialism, because of the appeal of racial fears (give nikkers opportunities they will take your job, your wife, and mistreat you the way they were mistreated says GOP coding)

 

[NZA]

I mostly agree, but I'd say black people are a little more anti- drug war than your thinking. For example, according to polls African Americans are more likely than whites to support marijuana legalization.


I'd also say that rather than black people being "very culturally southern and christian", it's more like "slightly more culturally southern and christian than average". But I don't think black people (or most people) really care about stuff like gay rights all that much either way, certainly not enough to vote based on it. I remember when Republicans deluded themselves into thinking that Obama would lose the black vote because he said he supported gay marriage.

Then the election came and he still got like 95% of the black vote.


And I'm not sure multiculturalism is a political issue, seems more like something Republicans bytch about from time to time.

at this point, black people are still receptive to "tough on crime" and "we need more cops on the beat" styled politics in cities with high violence rates, and as more excons are disenfranchised, the black voting base is being whittled down to the kind of people that dont use a lot of drugs anyway, so the call to legalization among blacks is very anemic looking. it will be white places that lead the way on this issue, and black locales will really only follow on this issue. in the link you provided, black support for weed was even lower than democrats as a whole.

it's hard to quantify the "southernness" of people spread across the nation, but if gay rights ever were in conflict with other issues, or had to survive on their own and need public votes, i bet black votes nationwide would be more in line with rural and southern whites. but you are right, gay rights really are a non issue since they go along with civil rights or are matters for the courts to decide most of the time.

multiculturalism has been an issue since the late 1960s, i think. off the top of my head i can recall it first spiked when various student movements were becoming conscious, like black panthers, brown berets, etc. the vanguard of these movements were college students, prone to communism, intellectualism, and anti colonialism in a manner not like many of the civil rights movements before it. the history of and complete dominance of the european culture is seen as a form of oppression, so the pushback had to come from getting ethnic studies classes in more schools, and more funding for those classes which is where the government comes in. later that turns into making sure the government can offer its services to people who speak english as a second language. since its importance is not constant, it isnt much of an issue to non-whites right now, but it offends cacs deerly and makes them think western civilization is declining. we even have some guy named odyssey here who specializes in posting about it.

 

[acri1]

at this point, black people are still receptive to "tough on crime" and "we need more cops on the beat" styled politics in cities with high violence rates, and as more excons are disenfranchised, the black voting base is being whittled down to the kind of people that dont use a lot of drugs anyway, so the call to legalization among blacks is very anemic looking. it will be white places that lead the way on this issue, and black locales will really only follow on this issue. in the link you provided, black support for weed was even lower than democrats as a whole.

In the link I provided, black support for marijuana legalization (56%) was slightly lower than for Democrats (59%), but still higher than white people (52%) or Latinos (51%) overall. So it wouldn't be correct to say that blacks are conservative on that issue when they're more likely than other ethnic groups to support legalization. Now you are right in that white areas will lead the way on this issue, but it's not because white voters are actually more likely to support legalization. It's more along the lines of white voters that live in places with a significant number of black people being more receptive of anti-drug/tough on crime stances.

multiculturalism has been an issue since the late 1960s, i think. off the top of my head i can recall it first spiked when various student movements were becoming conscious, like black panthers, brown berets, etc. the vanguard of these movements were college students, prone to communism, intellectualism, and anti colonialism in a manner not like many of the civil rights movements before it. the history of and complete dominance of the european culture is seen as a form of oppression, so the pushback had to come from getting ethnic studies classes in more schools, and more funding for those classes which is where the government comes in. later that turns into making sure the government can offer its services to people who speak english as a second language. since its importance is not constant, it isnt much of an issue to non-whites right now, but it offends cacs deerly and makes them think western civilization is declining. we even have some guy named odyssey here who specializes in posting about it.

I'd agree that the idea of multiculturalism offends a good portion of white/oonservative voters, I'm just not sure it's much of an issue in terms of actual policy. You have some people complaining about illegal immigrants having access to govt services and bathrooms having spanish signs on them, but I can't see it being too much of a national issue. Especially with the GOP attempting to get the Hispanic vote these days.

 

[NZA]

In the link I provided, black support for marijuana legalization (56%) was slightly lower than for Democrats (59%), but still higher than white people (52%) or Latinos (51%) overall. So it wouldn't be correct to say that blacks are conservative on that issue when they're more likely than other ethnic groups to support legalization. Now you are right in that white areas will lead the way on this issue, but it's not because white voters are actually more likely to support legalization. It's more along the lines of white voters that live in places with a significant number of black people being more receptive of anti-drug/tough on crime stances.



I'd agree that the idea of multiculturalism offends a good portion of white/oonservative voters, I'm just not sure it's much of an issue in terms of actual policy. You have some people complaining about illegal immigrants having access to govt services and bathrooms having spanish signs on them, but I can't see it being too much of a national issue. Especially with the GOP attempting to get the Hispanic vote these days.

considering that libertarians are now trying to pull the republican party to legalization, this issue is getting more complicated. either way, when you are dealing with a slight majority and differences of single digits on polling, drugs are simply not a priority. it's just on the periphery right now. states that are legalizing the most are not black or liberal bastions either. when it comes to real life, states with smaller black populations, and higher conservative or libertarian populations are the ones decriminalizing or going the medical route. it's mostly the white west; the south and northeast (not surprisingly where most blacks are) are the least hospitable to weed and blacks are doing apparently nothing about it there.

well, my original point was that multiculti was just a "so-so" issue. it doesnt mean much to black people right now, but it still works on some white people at all times, and as american dog whistle politics goes, if you can get white people angry, you can get them to vote, so it's an issue, just not a huge one. if conservatives feel they can get more votes with it, they will use it, offend blacks, and gain white support. i think a lot of blacks will overlook in favor of more meat and potatoes issues, but it will cost "some" black support. so it's another one of those moderately important issues with limited interest.

 

[Insensitive]

It's not black and white, there are shades of grey....that's usually the case when dealing with human beings , I remember a time when dudes would throw the hands when there was beef....rap music evolving into the brain dead state it is, isn't helping and probably is contributing. East/West beef.....not liking someone cuz they from another coast again the media glamorizes it, but niccas are still dumb enough to fall for it, which is the real issue.

Music's influence is ridiculously overstated and in Rap's case it's pushed to the point
that the historical wronging that blacks faced in this country is swept under the rug and any
issues they currently face as a result of that is from adopting a degenerate culture of violence and ignorance or what some ignorant conservative would consider Hip Hop.

If Music had that much power then young whites should've been storming the white house
when Hardcore was at it's most popular or we all should of been peace loving atheists
after lennon dropped "Imagine".

AS for the topic of the thread @Mephistopheles @The Real and @No_bammer_weed
have already touched on pretty everything I would say.
There is a lot of anti black rhetoric on that side and some of the black conservatives
that get backed are very blatant in their disgust with black people.
Conservative Black Chick, Jesse Lee Peterson, Larry Elders, Hermain Cain etc.

 

[TLR Is Mental Poison]

fukk both parties

Start a black party and stop fukking bootlicking, showing out and compromising to the point that we don't get anything

Black conservatism... what does that even mean? Why can't we have our own ideology?

 

[Blackking]

fukk both parties

Start a black party and stop fukking bootlicking, showing out and compromising to the point that we don't get anything

Black conservatism... what does that even mean? Why can't we have our own ideology?

well, That should be it's own ideology.... just like Black power =/= any other type of power.

Black people do have certain values and agendas.... they support some liberal shyt, but mainly because Dems and liberals play racial politics on our side (we think).

For example, the group economics and self reliance talks Mainly come from 'black conservatives'.

 

[Blackking]

Black conservatives only know two words. You can quote me. "Yes Master".

You do not see the irony in your statement

I guess you are correct for the most part. Black Liberals only know two words. You can quote me. "Yes Daddy!!" That pretty much sums up the relationship... raping, using, but whispering.."I love you.. call me daddy"

 

[Serious]

lynch themselves....

 

[TLR Is Mental Poison]

well, That should be it's own ideology.... just like Black power =/= any other type of power.

Black people do have certain values and agendas.... they support some liberal shyt, but mainly because Dems and liberals play racial politics on our side (we think).

For example, the group economics and self reliance talks Mainly come from 'black conservatives'.

I just dont think we should even call it conservatism. Because then it just seems like an offshoot of "mainstream" conservatism. If we are going to stand alone we need our ideologies to stand alone. Re-appropriating white political ideologies just says to me we are incapable of operating without the guidance or thought process of "mainstream" ideologies.

 

[Blackking]

I just dont think we should even call it conservatism. Because then it just seems like an offshoot of "mainstream" conservatism. If we are going to stand alone we need our ideologies to stand alone. Re-appropriating white political ideologies just says to me we are incapable of operating without the guidance or thought process of "mainstream" ideologies.

Well we are here... speaking a foreign cac language so the word is just the word... I didn't mean it like a offshoot of cac conservatism which obviously would have us back in chains.

But you're probably right.