What could black conservatives do to earn therespectof black America

[ghostwriterx]

he's kinda right hip hop was used as revolutionary music once upon a time....message just got lost somewhere....It seems like a fantasy that a group like Public Enemy was once mainstream

Come on breh, you really co-signing him blaming recent bouts of violence on Hip-Hop?

 

[DEAD7]

Hip hops role is both understated, and overstated. It plays its part, but isnt solely to blame.

 

[ghostwriterx]

Hip hops role is both understated, and overstated. It plays its part, but isnt solely to blame.

You're half right.

 

[teacher]

Come on breh, you really co-signing him blaming recent bouts of violence on Hip-Hop?

It's not black and white, there are shades of grey....that's usually the case when dealing with human beings , I remember a time when dudes would throw the hands when there was beef....rap music evolving into the brain dead state it is, isn't helping and probably is contributing. East/West beef.....not liking someone cuz they from another coast again the media glamorizes it, but niccas are still dumb enough to fall for it, which is the real issue.

 

[bzb]

it annoys me that conservatism and liberalism are constantly associated with a political party. it's not that simple, but the republicans have created parallels where they don't really fit. let them tell it conservative = republican and liberal = democrat. never mind that social conservatism and fiscal conservatism don't always sync up with each other much less political conservatism.

adding insult to injury for the gop was their gamble on aligning with the tea party which promoted an environment of political anger to mobilize their base. what they didn't count on was all the thinly veiled racial anger came along with it. they hated democrats (liberals) and they hated the non-white president and they hate illegal immigrants aka brown latinos whether they were illegal or not. they're seeing the damage it's going to cause them in the long run which is why there's such a fight in the gop right now.

the argument that democrats take minority votes for granted might have some weight in national elections, but the argument holds no weight when it comes to state and local elections. it's a fact that democratic representatives at the state and local level do more for their minority constituents than republicans do. case in point is georgia. we have a republican gov who could care less about minority constituents vs local democratic reps who actually do care about minority constituents and do their best to provide our communities the services and funding we need. it's a constant battle between the local and state level to have funds/services evenly distributed. that perception/experience then rolls up into the national elections. let's also keep in mind that republicans long ago gave up on the black/minority vote. we can talk about lip service, but they don't sincerely court our people or even try to relate to the issues we face.

a third party would be nice, but that would likely bleed off from frustrated people who lean republican anyway.

 

[Mr. Somebody]

Not much. Its hard to get the vote when you're speaking about conservative values and its hard to get the vote when you're talking about taking something away from Americans.

 

[Dusty Bake Activate]

I disagree with you there.

Most black people I know, if it weren't for the overt racism of the GOP, would vote republican on the notion of fiscal and social conservatism.

Remind you, if its not basic racism, issues like gay rights or religion still lean "conservative" in most black circles i'm aware of.

The vast majority of black people do not agree with the GOP on public policy...no way. Even when they weren't this odious and overt with their cism like during Bush Sr. two runs and Bob Dole's run, they still got single digit black support. It's more than just racism. Modern Republican policy has been about doling out corporate welfare and neoliberalization of labor, healthcare, education, and macroeconomic policy. Those aren't policies that black people generally tend to be fond of. Black people like Lyndon Johnson better than Reagan.

That gay marriage stuff is neither here nor there because it's a not an issue black people vote on, nor is "putting God back in America," prayer in school, keeping Christ in Christmas, promoting "family values," having a "faith-based leadership," abortion or any of this other bullshyt the right is always screaming about (abortion isn't a bullshyt issue, but it is settled law). Nobody cares about that shyt when it comes to voting really except for white people.

Making personal values and social taste prominent issues to sublimate one's identity into expression via the vote is largely a product of political right's merging with the religious right for the past 35 years or so. Even aside from the religious stuff, they just use these buzzwords and memes that appeal to common values pretty much everyone share: Strong family values. Personal responsibility. Education. Hard work. Limited government. Low taxes. Fiscal responsibility. Personal freedom.

Everyone agrees with those ideas in principle at a basic level. But they're just hollow, empty statements against the backdrop of Republican policy because their policy is all about corporate welfare, a fiscal policy of two words: tax cuts, and neoliberalization of everything. There's no real connection between the rhetoric and the policy. Black people see through that shyt better than white people do. Probably because we're too jaded from being sold shyt in this country by the government since day one.

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

The vast majority of black people do not agree with the GOP on public policy...no way.

They do. I don't think you've really gotten to know a lot of your friends.

A lot of them are pro-gun.

A lot of them are pro-states rights.

A lot of them are anti big government.

A lot of us are fiscally conservative.

A lot of us are socially conservative.

I don't know who you're sampling but if you let a lot of black people I KNOW take a test, they'll come out as conservatives.

TRUST me on that.

Even when they weren't this odious and overt with their cism like during Bush Sr. two runs and Bob Dole's run, they still got single digit black support. It's more than just racism. Modern Republican policy has been about doling out corporate welfare and neoliberalization of labor, healthcare, education, and macroeconomic policy. Those aren't policies that black people generally tend to be fond of.

It IS racism.

Blacks currently don't support the GOP because of the overt racism of a lot of the party...remove the racism and you get the reasons why whites support the GOP...their ideals.

That gay marriage stuff is neither here nor there because it's a not an issue black people vote on, nor is "putting God back in America," prayer in school, keeping Christ in Christmas, promoting "family values," having a "faith-based leadership," abortion or any of this other bullshyt the right is always screaming about (abortion isn't a bullshyt issue, but it is settled law). Nobody cares about that shyt when it comes to voting really except for white people.

Again, i think you have a limited perspective, especially on the following:

"putting God back in America," prayer in school, keeping Christ in Christmas, promoting "family values," having a "faith-based leadership," abortion or any of this other bullshyt the right is always screaming about (abortion isn't a bullshyt issue, but it is settled law).

Most black people I know support these aims.

Making personal values and social taste prominent issues to sublimate one's identity into expression via the vote is largely a product of political right's merging with the religious right for the past 35 years or so. Even aside from the religious stuff, they just use these buzzwords and memes that appeal to common values pretty much everyone share: Strong family values. Personal responsibility. Education. Hard work. Limited government. Low taxes. Fiscal responsibility. Personal freedom.

...things most black people I know support.

Everyone agrees with those ideas in principle at a basic level. But they're just hollow, empty statements against the backdrop of Republican policy because their policy is all about corporate welfare, a fiscal policy of two words: tax cuts, and neoliberalization of everything. There's no real connection between the rhetoric and the policy. Black people see through that shyt better than white people do. Probably because we're too jaded from being sold shyt in this country by the government since day one.

You're not even disagreeing with me.

A LOT minorities of color I know (not all) are DEFINITELY closet republicans...its that the face of the party doesn't allot for them.

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

it annoys me that conservatism and liberalism are constantly associated with a political party. it's not that simple, but the republicans have created parallels where they don't really fit. let them tell it conservative = republican and liberal = democrat. never mind that social conservatism and fiscal conservatism don't always sync up with each other much less political conservatism.

adding insult to injury for the gop was their gamble on aligning with the tea party which promoted an environment of political anger to mobilize their base. what they didn't count on was all the thinly veiled racial anger came along with it. they hated democrats (liberals) and they hated the non-white president and they hate illegal immigrants aka brown latinos whether they were illegal or not. they're seeing the damage it's going to cause them in the long run which is why there's such a fight in the gop right now.

the argument that democrats take minority votes for granted might have some weight in national elections, but the argument holds no weight when it comes to state and local elections. it's a fact that democratic representatives at the state and local level do more for their minority constituents than republicans do. case in point is georgia. we have a republican gov who could care less about minority constituents vs local democratic reps who actually do care about minority constituents and do their best to provide our communities the services and funding we need. it's a constant battle between the local and state level to have funds/services evenly distributed. that perception/experience then rolls up into the national elections. let's also keep in mind that republicans long ago gave up on the black/minority vote. we can talk about lip service, but they don't sincerely court our people or even try to relate to the issues we face.

a third party would be nice, but that would likely bleed off from frustrated people who lean republican anyway.

This paragraph is why I say a lot of minorities would support the GOP if their shyt wasn't so overtly racist.

 

[Blackking]

They mainly disagree with the GOP on Foreign policy.. not public policy.

We mainly went left due to the attraction of civil rights progressives. That's kinda like when a piece of food is on the knife and a wolf will keep eating because he sees more blood ( I know that's unfair but we've historically have been on the bottom of the socialeconomic latter and that's what people do in that spot w/o thinking) and eventually kill himself.

People who think blacks are inline with all of the liberal platform... don't know many black people.. or are confusing 'agreeing' with limited choices.

And yeah we are speaking on the majority of blacks who vote.

And yeah that vote is probably the most taken for granted vote in the history of democracies.

 

[Dusty Bake Activate]

They do. I don't think you've really gotten to know a lot of your friends.

A lot of them are pro-gun.

It doesn't matter. Guns are not an issue black people care enough to vote on. Black people vote on jobs, retirement, disposable income, schools, healthcare. Nobody gives a fukk about a gun laws enough for it to be voting issue.

A lot of them are pro-states rights.

lol...

A lot of them are anti big government.

A lot of us are fiscally conservative.

A lot of us are socially conservative.

All of those statements are empty and meaningless. It seems you're not following what I'm saying and you're buying into the bullshyt narrative the right has allowed to dominate.

"Fiscal conservative." What does that mean? It sounds good in principle. Now do black people want tax cuts and subsidies for the rich, slashing and privatizing of social security, Medicare, Medicaid, and cuts to Pell grants, SNAP, education, etc. and privatization of schools? fukk no.

"Anti-big government." What does that mean? It sounds good in principle. Now do black people want to repeal the reforms of the New Deal and the Great Society and less money for education. fukk no.

"Social conservative." I've already explained that nobody gives a shyt about "social conservatism" as a voting issue except for some white people.

Those are just vacuous, focus-group tested terms that appeal to people at a visceral level but do not define conservatism or Republican party policy.

I don't know who you're sampling but if you let a lot of black people I KNOW take a test, they'll come out as conservatives.

TRUST me on that.

Well you must hang around a bunch of Larry Elders and Herman Cains because most black people do not have mostly conservative views and that is a fact.

It IS racism.

Blacks currently don't support the GOP because of the overt racism of a lot of the party...remove the racism and you get the reasons why whites support the GOP...their ideals.

No it isn't. You sound like someone who is extremely naive and hasn't been following politics very long of researched in depth. Black people vote for Democrats because of economic/domestic policy issues, first and foremost. Black people vote based on jobs, schools, disposable income, retirement, etc. and generally tend to see the Dems as the better of the two choices. Racism is definitely tied in there, but saying it's just racism is absurdly simplistic. If that were the case, you'd see it manifested in state and local races. Black people still vote overwhelmingly Dem in local and state races even when the Repub candidates say nothing racist and bend over backwards to not appear racist. Why is that? Policy.

Again, the right wing media and political movement was not this overtly racist during Bush Sr.'s first run and Dole's run, yet they still got single digit black support. There was no tea party then and outrageous racist statements being made every week. They still couldn't make a dent in the black vote because black people don't agree with their economic/domestic policy agenda.

Again, i think you have a limited perspective, especially on the following:
"putting God back in America," prayer in school, keeping Christ in Christmas, promoting "family values," having a "faith-based leadership," abortion or any of this other bullshyt the right is always screaming about (abortion isn't a bullshyt issue, but it is settled law).

Most black people I know support these aims.

...things most black people I know support.

Bruh, are you illiterate or something? This is like the 4th time I'm saying this. I said black people are socially conservative. They just do not CARE about these bullshyt social wedge issues the GOP has tried to push. You're buying into the ridiculous GOP narrative that gay marriage, prayer in schools, and all that bullshyt are relevant voting issues.

You're the only one with the limited perspective here. You sound like you need to get out and talk to some people and learn some political history.

You're not even disagreeing with me.

A LOT minorities of color I know (not all) are DEFINITELY closet republicans...its that the face of the party doesn't allot for them.

You can talk whatever anecdotal stuff you want, but black people do not support the Repubs on the major issues more than Dems, and their voting patterns are based on more than just being turned off by GOP racism.

 

[88m3]

They mainly disagree with the GOP on Foreign policy.. not public policy.

We mainly went left due to the attraction of civil rights progressives. That's kinda like when a piece of food is on the knife and a wolf will keep eating because he sees more blood ( I know that's unfair but we've historically have been on the bottom of the socialeconomic latter and that's what people do in that spot w/o thinking) and eventually kill himself.

People who think blacks are inline with all of the liberal platform... don't know many black people.. or are confusing 'agreeing' with limited choices.

And yeah we are speaking on the majority of blacks who vote.

And yeah that vote is probably the most taken for granted vote in the history of democracies.

Black conservatives only know two words. You can quote me. "Yes Master".

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

It doesn't matter. Guns are not an issue black people care enough to vote on. Black people vote on jobs, retirement, disposable income, schools, healthcare. Nobody gives a fukk about a gun laws enough for it to be voting issue.

lol...



All of those statements are empty and meaningless. It seems you're not following what I'm saying and you're buying into the bullshyt narrative the right has allowed to dominate.

"Fiscal conservative." What does that mean? It sounds good in principle. Now do black people want tax cuts and subsidies for the rich, slashing and privatizing of social security, Medicare, Medicaid, and cuts to Pell grants, SNAP, education, etc. and privatization of schools? fukk no.

"Anti-big government." What does that mean? It sounds good in principle. Now do black people want to repeal the reforms of the New Deal and the Great Society and less money for education. fukk no.

"Social conservative." I've already explained that nobody gives a shyt about "social conservatism" as a voting issue except for some white people.

Those are just vacuous, general concepts that do not define conservatism or Republican party policy.



Well you must hang around a bunch of Larry Elders and Herman Cains because most black people do not have mostly conservative views and that is a fact.

No it isn't. You sound like someone who is extremely naive and hasn't been following politics very long of researched in depth. Black people vote for Democrats because of economic/domestic policy issues, first and foremost. Black people vote based on jobs, schools, disposable income, retirement, etc. and generally tend to see the Dems as the better of the two choices. Racism is definitely tied in there, but saying it's just racism is absurdly simplistic. If that were the case, you'd see it manifested in state and local races. Black people still vote overwhelmingly Dem in local and state races even when the Repub candidates say nothing racist and bend over backwards to not appear racist. Why is that? Policy.

Again, the right wing media and political movement was not this overtly racist during Bush Sr.'s first run and Dole's run, yet they still got single digit black support. There was no tea party then and outrageous racist statements being made every week. They still couldn't make a dent in the black vote because black people don't agree with their economic/domestic policy agenda.



Bruh, are you illiterate or something? This is like the 4th time I'm saying this. I said black people are socially conservative. They just do not CARE about these bullshyt social wedge issues the GOP has tried to push. You're buying into the ridiculous GOP narrative that gay marriage, prayer in schools, and all that bullshyt are relevant voting issues.

You're the only one with the limited perspective here. You sound like you need to get out and talk to some people and learn some political history.


You can talk whatever anecdotal stuff you want, but black people do not support the Repubs on the major issues more than Dems, and their voting patterns are based on more than just being turned off by GOP racism.

You're really not challenging me here.

I'm sticking to my argument.

Remove the racism from the GOP and you get more black republicans. HANDS. DOWN. A lot of minorities I know DO NOT support social safety nets...but you'd never know beacuse you don't ask them.

A lot of the GOP's policies aren't even THAT racist, but the fact that so many of them ARE, blacks are just distanced from the party.

It takes time for entire demographics to shift voting habits. Post 1960s, there havent been major issues to push people to one side or another like racism...not even abortion could do that.

Thats why your arguments about dole/bush don't make any sense.

 

[ghostwriterx]

It's not black and white, there are shades of grey....that's usually the case when dealing with human beings , I remember a time when dudes would throw the hands when there was beef....rap music evolving into the brain dead state it is, isn't helping and probably is contributing. East/West beef.....not liking someone cuz they from another coast again the media glamorizes it, but niccas are still dumb enough to fall for it, which is the real issue.

East/West beef? What year is this?

The Remarkable Drop in Crime According to NYPD Statistics
Record-setting drop in homicide rate, 1990-1998 .
Up to 1990, the record forconsecutive-year declines in the number and rate of homicide was the 4-year declinefrom 1981 to 1985. Those two records were broken from 1990 to 1998. Over thatperiod, homicides in New York City went from 2,245 (the most ever recorded) to 633(Appendix table 1). The last time the city saw fewer than 633 homicides was 1965! The633 represent the culmination of a record 8 consecutive years of drops in the number ofhomicides. Similarly, over that same period, the homicide rate fell a record 8 years in arow to .086 per 1,000 population (figure 1 and Appendix table 2).

http://www.scribd.com/doc/322928/Langan-rel

New York City had fewer murders in 2013 than any year in its recorded history, according to a statement from the mayor's office.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/12/30/new-york-city-murder-rate-2013_n_4520192.html

I guess cats just stopped listening to hip-hop in NYC.

 

[Dusty Bake Activate]

You're really not challenging me here.

I'm sticking to my argument.

Remove the racism from the GOP and you get more black republicans.

I don't disagree with that statement. Where you went bonkers was saying MOST black people would vote Republican if it wasn't for the racism. That's untrue and unsupportable with reason.

HANDS. DOWN. A lot of minorities I know DO NOT support social safety nets...but you'd never know beacuse you don't ask them.

You keep talking this anecdotal stuff that's meaningless. I know a lot of black people who complain about Shaquinesha and her 8 kids in a Section 8 housing getting food stamps too. That doesn't mean they support privatization of social security, Medicare, and Medicaid, which is what the GOP wants.

A lot of the GOP's policies aren't even THAT racist, but the fact that so many of them ARE, blacks are just distanced from the party.

Racist or not, most black people feel their policies don't serve black peoples' interests better than the Democrats. That's why they vote 90% Democrat and have been for decades.

It takes time for entire demographics to shift voting habits. Post 1960s, there havent been major issues to push people to one side or another like racism...not even abortion could do that.

Thats why your arguments about dole/bush don't make any sense.

lol...what doesn't make any sense is you chalking up black peoples' overwhelming support of the Democrats for the past 50 years to voting demographic shifts taking time, when black peoples' support for Democrats is at an all time high and we just had the most lopsided presidential election in favor of Democrats in American history last year with 96% of black people voting for the Dem. The trend is only growing Yeah the Dem candidate was black. But Clinton, Kerry, Gore, Mondale, Dukakis, and Carter weren't.

You think black people would vote for fukking Alan Keyes or Herman Cain?

Sorry man, you're wrong on this one.