Top 15 Quarterbacks, since 2000?

[livindajetlife]

My list wasn't a longevity thing, nor a peak thing, nor a "who has the most awards" thing. It's all of those things combined, strictly about who was the best players...

Steve McNair is nowhere close to one of the 15 best since '00. Not even close...

Cam and McNabb really aren't that close, either...

Ryan is close though, he was more consistently good than any of the above three guys, for a longer period of time. His peak was higher than all three guys...

But he'd be the first guy out, in my Top 15. I think Luck and Rivers were better players, lack of Super Bowls and awards be damned...

It's why Josh Allen is #7 to me. He's clearly better than almost everybody else, the lack of awards or Super Bowls isn't a negative here...

Matt Ryan peak was higher than cams? lol what

 

[murksiderock]

I dont know man. They gotta count for something. An All Pro, Mvp, or Superbowl appearance. Give me one at least.

Oh for sure, they definitely matter. I think First Things First over-weighted those awards, you can tell by how low they ranked Allen. At the same time, this very board goes to the other extreme and habitually undervalues awards and deep playoff runs; we hear nikkas on here all the time downplay guys who are decorated, because of the decorations...

I'm more in the middle. The awards are a snapshot that tell the story of a league in any era. For people who come later and want to learn what an era was like, you can read off the list of All-Pros, MVPs, and MVP finalists, and give an excellent blueprint to the elite players of an era (sub DPOYs and OPOYs for MVPs for non-QBs)...

You can fill in that blueprint just by adding in, a)statistical leaders during the era, meaning yards leaders, touchdown leaders, sack leaders, etc; and b)Super Bowl champs, Super Bowl runner-ups, and deep playoff runs to the conference championships...

All of the above will tell you 95% of what you need to know about an era, and this works for any league. In the NBA, it's All-NBAs, MVPs and MVP finalists, league statistical leaders, champions, runner-ups, and deep playoff runs. Same thing...

The other 5% you can fill in with the great players who werent on great teams, or who had careers cut short due to injury (think Derrick Rose here, who actually had a long career, but we know injuries robbed him of his ceiling if being a historically great guard)...

So yes, the accolades absolutely matter, i just think people gotta be careful using them or downplaying them to any extreme. In Allen's case, he's better than almost every guy who has played in the last 25 years...

@murksiderock Your 16-25 is too partial to the modern era. Eli, Goff nor Hurts, nor Cam, nor Herbert deserve to be over McNabb. I can argue that Luck doesnt, either. Too biased toward those who started in the pinball era than the old school era

This is fair, and you know what, I do think McNabb should be higher. I don't think he quite makes the Top 15, but I could see arguing him with Luck and Ryan's spots...

I could probably nitpick things but this is about right. You probably did Cam a tad bit dirty lol.

I still have my own unique problem with Pat over Peyton lol but I know I'm by myself.

You're not alone. I don't personally believe any QB I've ever seen peaked as high as Manning, including Mahomes. I think Manning was a more refined passer and more dominant when he was on; and there simply was nothing like dude when he came along...

But, at this point Mahomes' playoff success is hurting Manning in All-Time rankings, and if he doubles him up in championships, in less than half the time, I don't think even I could justify him over Mahomes anymore...

I still think Manning peaked higher, though! Manning was unbelievable and I think he's becoming underrated with time...

And bruh, Cam wasn't that great he's always been overrated...

 

[murksiderock]

Romo is better than Stafford, Russ, Rivers , Eli, Ryan and Luck

He was definitely a more exciting player to watch than most of these other cats. I don't really disagree with this, I'm well documented with how I feel about Padford and Eli. Both are grossly overrated...

I don't think Romo was better than Russ. Russ had a 6-year run from 2015 thru 2020 that clearly put him as a Top 5 QB in that stretch, he's becoming underrated with time. Seattle Russ for 6-7 years was an elite player...

I'll buy an argument of Romo over Luck and Rivers. Its not definitive for me, but it's certainly arguable!

Bress

Brees is number 3 he beat Manning in the Super bowl, owned Eli and Dominated Rodgers.alsonthe 1st QB to sweep Brady in b2b seasons

Brees was not better than Manning, just better than him for a game...

I can and still would argue that Brees and Rodgers is debatable...

Matt Ryan peak was higher than cams? lol what

Yes nikka ...

 

[premier58]

What “elite” defenses?

Mcnabb also never beat a great team. This is why putting 5 nfc title games in context is so important

The 2004 eagles beat an 8-8 team to get the nfc title game lol.

2000 Bucs, 2001 Bucs, 2001 Bears

 

[premier58]

Yeah there is nothing special about the 10-6 Packers. I would put them in line with the best teams that other QBs have beaten.

Im well aware that the 03 Packers are nothing to write home about. They need a 4th and long miracle by Arizona vs Minnesota to even make the playoffs. I asked you, what impressive teams has Lamar beat in the offs? Before this season,.Josh Allen had no impressive playoff scalps on his resume,unless you are high on the 2020 Ravens

 

[premier58]

What “elite” defenses?

Mcnabb also never beat a great team. This is why putting 5 nfc title games in context is so important

The 2004 eagles beat an 8-8 team to get the nfc title game lol.

This is true. He never did beat a great team in the playoffs. Two of the five times that he got there, he had to win 2 playoff games to get there. That is still impressive, poor conference or not. Especially when you consider all the one and dones, by all time greats. What great team was Buffalo beating during their 4 yeae SB run? The 92 Dolphins?

 

[premier58]

2000 Bucs, 2001 Bucs, 2001 Bears

Not historically great, but good, solid defense. TB was 7th and 8th in pts allowed, while Chicago was 1st in ppg allowed. McNabb has 3 road playoff wins. Lamar Jackson has 1. Josh Allen has 0. Peyton has 2, Big Ben has 4. Montana has 3, I believe also.

Mcnabb wasn’t winning those games they lost either unless you think beating the 2008 Giants is the same as beating the 2007 patriots on the road

Why are you referencing the 07 Patriots, as if thats the only road game he had in the playoffs? The 08 Steelers, who barely scraped by over the Cardinals. Who were on the weakest teams to ever make a Superbowl. The 2018 Patriots werent some juggernaut. 2nd weakest NE championship squad. Why are you acting like the Chargers were some litlle engine that could? Their core was there, w Brees, when they spanked the Pats in Foxboro. 2006 team was a 14-2, dominating team. The Chargers teams from 06-08 were overall more talented than every McNabb squad, aside from 04.

 

[Rekkapryde]

Rodgers over Manning in the Top 4.

 

[cobra]

trash allen over russ, matty ice and rivers


actually im taking rivers over every new gen QB other than mahomes

 

[cobra]

romo, mcnabb, vick?

 

[Bigblackted4]

I like this thread and will make a list for the fukk of it, off the top

Mahomes
Brady
Manning
Rodgers
Ben
Brees
Lamar
Favre
Russ
Ryan
Allen
Cam
Warner
Stafford
Rivers

First three out
Luck
McNabb
Burrow

 

[Shadow King]

Im with you. Manning was otherworldly dominant. He played the QB position at a higher level than Mahomes, does. He also faced way better competition.

To be fair, he had Brady but didn't have the AFC Mahomes is dealing with now.

My thing is 1) time put in and 2) Mahomes is a talent thrown in a perfect storm. It's difficult for me to catapult you into your own stratosphere for luck breaking your way, and that goes for his contemporaries not just an All-Tme or post-2000 list.

 

[Street Knowledge]

Im well aware that the 03 Packers are nothing to write home about. They need a 4th and long miracle by Arizona vs Minnesota to even make the playoffs. I asked you, what impressive teams has Lamar beat in the offs? Before this season,.Josh Allen had no impressive playoff scalps on his resume,unless you are high on the 2020 Ravens

Neither have beaten impressive teams, that’s why putting 5 NFC title games needs to be put in context especially when Lamar is gonna have 3 MVPs something Mcnabb never got.

Mcnabb has essentially no individual accolades. So his team success is gonna be analyzed.

 

[VegetasHairline]

trash allen over russ, matty ice and rivers


actually im taking rivers over every new gen QB other than mahomes

What has Rivers ever won?

 

[Street Knowledge]

Not historically great, but good, solid defense. TB was 7th and 8th in pts allowed, while Chicago was 1st in ppg allowed. McNabb has 3 road playoff wins. Lamar Jackson has 1. Josh Allen has 0. Peyton has 2, Big Ben has 4. Montana has 3, I believe also.

Why are you referencing the 07 Patriots, as if thats the only road game he had in the playoffs? The 08 Steelers, who barely scraped by over the Cardinals. Who were on the weakest teams to ever make a Superbowl. The 2018 Patriots werent some juggernaut. 2nd weakest NE championship squad. Why are you acting like the Chargers were some litlle engine that could? Their core was there, w Brees, when they spanked the Pats in Foxboro. 2006 team was a 14-2, dominating team. The Chargers teams from 06-08 were overall more talented than every McNabb squad, aside from 04.

1.)Yeah the only great or pantheon defense Mcnabb faced was the 2002 Bucs. The rest were nothing special. Again, who were those road playoff wins against?

2.)The 2008 Steelers are one of the greatest defenses of all time. Mcnabb ain’t beating them either

3.)What team did Rivers lose to, than Mcnabb is beating?