Religion/Spirituality Theism Discussion (Abrahamic Religions, Religious Philosophy, etc.)

[88m3]

in before "bu bu you dont understand the quran because every time someone tries to interpret it they take it out of context"

what a disgusting book of lies @Slaimon come in and address this you feeble minded dikkrider

fukking mods bounced it

 

[ShadowViper]

 

[Dafunkdoc_Unlimited]

the First Council of Nicaea called by Constantine in 325 is really what ruined Christianity and turned it into the complicated mess that it is today... that's where they had a pow wow and decided that Christianity was going to consist of a Trinity and instilled Easter and other Pagan traditions into Christianity

Wrong. See, the problem is people are still under the impression that what the Catholic Church did applied to ALL Christians when that has never been the case. That's why there are hundreds of different Christian denominations to this day. If you think things are a 'mess' now, you have NO clue.

There were THOUSANDS of denominations in the first few hundred years of the Church some of which are documented in the NT. Matter of fact, historians don't refer to it as 'Christianity', but 'Christianities'.

Oh, and the thing about 'Christians worshipping multiple dieties' is a misunderstanding due to some Christians in Arabia who worshipped Mary. Has nothing to do with Nicea and Trinity Doctrine or any other denomination of Christians that currently exist.​

 

[GMOGMediaTV]

At the request of - Real Talk of NY.

I'll start off by saying this. I find it wild and uncivilized to see some christians call out Islam to be this big bad religion when they have little to no knowledge of their own religion. What's yall beef? Have we not proven 9/11 was done by Israel, and the Christian US gov? Here's a chart comparing the 2.

Islam: Christianity:

One God ------ One god(supposedly)
Prays to god ------- Prays to god(supposedly)
Believes god is righteous ------ Believes god is righteous
Practice Rituals -------- Practice Rituals
Have a place of worship ------ Have a place of worship

what's the differences?

Islam: Christianity:

Women are covered ------- Women dress however
Don't eat pork ------ Eat Pork
Are high on education ------ Rather party than study
Fast ---------No fast

Which one is the wicked one again?

So what's causing the hatred between the 2?

Islam: Christianity:

Ignorance-------Ignorance

And the governments taking advantage of the situation loves ignorance

So what's the beef?

I've been telling these religions folks of Christian or Islamic sect that understanding language from where their Holy Books are translated from is more important then there religion.

 

[Dafunkdoc_Unlimited]

I've been telling these religions folks of Christian or Islamic sect that understanding language from where their Holy Books are translated from is more important then there religion.

More than that, they need to understand the times and the audiences those books were intended for. The authors of all three had specific goals when writing these down. While many things can be applied to present day, MANY other things are specific to the time-period and make more sense when read in a historical rather than theological context.
​

 

[GMOGMediaTV]

More than that, they need to understand the times and the audiences those books were intended for. The authors of all three had specific goals when writing these down. While many things can be applied to present day, MANY other things are specific to the time-period and make more sense when read in a historical rather than theological context.
​

Exactly which goes back to my original point. Once they understand these languages they will begin to connect the dots as you pointed out.

 

[50CentStan]

I don't think I've ever seen two videos with more lies than those lol @ anyone who would believe some demonic Irish guys YouTube video talking about nwo.

 

[ShadowViper]

I don't think I've ever seen two videos with more lies than those lol @ anyone who would believe some demonic Irish guys YouTube video talking about nwo.

So Mohammed didn't marry a 9 year old girl?

Islam doesn't have numerous quotes advocating violence?

Are you saying "Allah" wasn't used by pagans before Mohammed?

 

[Constantine]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/dr-david-liepert/islamic-pedophelia_b_814332.html
http://chnm.gmu.edu/cyh/primary-sources/24

 

[50CentStan]

So Mohammed didn't marry a 9 year old girl?

Islam doesn't have numerous quotes advocating violence?

Are you saying "Allah" wasn't used by pagans before Mohammed?

There are various records to what age the prophets wife was, the 9 year old thing is what the west has ran with to try and undermine the message.

No, there are no quotes advocating violence just like that, those surahs were revealed during war time, and Islam has instructions for every aspect of life.

The moron in the video tried to say Allah doesn't mean God, dude needs to take a class on language. That's like saying Hola in Spanish doesn't mean Hello in English. The video was a typical white western brainwash attempt, that these types of people have been attempting to stop the spread of the word of God, won't work buddy.

 

[ShadowViper]

There are various records to what age the prophets wife was, the 9 year old thing is what the west has ran with to try and undermine the message.

No, there are no quotes advocating violence just like that, those surahs were revealed during war time, and Islam has instructions for every aspect of life.

The moron in the video tried to say Allah doesn't mean God, dude needs to take a class on language. That's like saying Hola in Spanish doesn't mean Hello in English. The video was a typical white western brainwash attempt, that these types of people have been attempting to stop the spread of the word of God, won't work buddy.

Quran (2:191-193) - "And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah [disbelief] is worse than killing...
but if they desist, then lo! Allah is forgiving and merciful. And fight them until there is no more Fitnah [disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allah] and worship is for Allah alone. But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zalimun (the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.)" The historical context of this passage is not defensive warfare, since Muhammad and his Muslims had just relocated to Medina and were not under attack by their Meccan adversaries. In fact, the verses urge offensive warfare, in that Muslims are to drive Meccans out of their own city (which they later did).


Quran (8:12) - "I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them"


Quran (8:39) - "And fight with them until there is no more fitna (disorder, unbelief) and religion should be only for Allah" Some translations interpret "fitna" as "persecution", but the traditional understanding of this word is not supported by the historical context (See notes for 2:293, also). The Meccans were simply refusing Muhammad access to their city during Haj. Other Muslims were allowed to travel there - just not as an armed group, since Muhammad had declared war on Mecca prior to his eviction. The Meccans were also acting in defense of their religion, since it was Muhammad's intention to destroy their idols and establish Islam by force (which he later did). Hence the critical part of this verse is to fight until "religion is only for Allah", meaning that the true justification of violence was the unbelief of the opposition. According to the Sira (Ibn Ishaq/Hisham 324) Muhammad further explains that "Allah must have no rivals."



Quran (9:5) - "So when the sacred months have passed away, then slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captive and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush, then if they repent and keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate, leave their way free to them." According to this verse, the best way of staying safe from Muslim violence is to convert to Islam (prayer (salat) and the poor tax (zakat) are among the religion's Five Pillars). This popular claim that the Quran only inspires violence within the context of self-defense is seriously challenged by this passage as well, since the Muslims to whom it was written were obviously not under attack. Had they been, then there would have been no waiting period (earlier verses make it a duty for Muslims to fight in self-defense, even during the sacred months). The historical context is Mecca after the idolaters were subjugated by Muhammad and posed no threat. Once the Muslims had the power, they violently evicted those unbelievers who would not convert.


Quran (9:29) - "Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued."


Quran (9:123) - "O you who believe! fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness."


Quran (17:16) - "And when We wish to destroy a town, We send Our commandment to the people of it who lead easy lives, but they transgress therein; thus the word proves true against it, so We destroy it with utter destruction."


Quran (61:4) - "Surely Allah loves those who fight in His way"


Bukhari (52:177) - Allah's Apostle said, "The Hour will not be established until you fight with the Jews, and the stone behind which a Jew will be hiding will say. "O Muslim! There is a Jew hiding behind me, so kill him."


Muslim (1:33) - the Messenger of Allah said: I have been commanded to fight against people till they testify that there is no god but Allah, that Muhammad is the messenger of Allah


Bukhari (8:387)- Allah's Apostle said, "I have been ordered to fight the people till they say: 'None has the right to be worshipped but Allah'. And if they say so, pray like our prayers, face our Qibla and slaughter as we slaughter, then their blood and property will be sacred to us and we will not interfere with them except legally."


Muslim (1:30) - "The Messenger of Allah said: I have been commanded to fight against people so long as they do not declare that there is no god but Allah."


Bukhari (11:626)- [Muhammad said:] "I decided to order a man to lead the prayer and then take a flame to burn all those, who had not left their houses for the prayer, burning them alive inside their homes."


Muslim (19:4294) - "When the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) appointed anyone as leader of an army or detachment he would especially exhort him... He would say: Fight in the name of Allah and in the way of Allah. Fight against those who disbelieve in Allah. Make a holy war... When you meet your enemies who are polytheists, invite them to three courses of action. If they respond to any one of these, you also accept it and withhold yourself from doing them any harm. Invite them to (accept) Islam; if they respond to you, accept it from them and desist from fighting against them... If they refuse to accept Islam, demand from them the Jizya. If they agree to pay, accept it from them and hold off your hands. If they refuse to pay the tax, seek Allah's help and fight them.


Tabari 7:97 The morning after the murder of Ashraf, the Prophet declared, "Kill any Jew who falls under your power."



And the video doesn't say Allah doesn't mean God. It said that before Mohammed's time it was used to refer to the Moon God in that area's pagan religion. This is historical fact.

 

[ShadowViper]

 

[50CentStan]

Quran (2:191-193) - "And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah [disbelief] is worse than killing...
but if they desist, then lo! Allah is forgiving and merciful. And fight them until there is no more Fitnah [disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allah] and worship is for Allah alone. But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zalimun (the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.)" The historical context of this passage is not defensive warfare, since Muhammad and his Muslims had just relocated to Medina and were not under attack by their Meccan adversaries. In fact, the verses urge offensive warfare, in that Muslims are to drive Meccans out of their own city (which they later did).


Quran (8:12) - "I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them"

Quran (8:39) - "And fight with them until there is no more fitna (disorder, unbelief) and religion should be only for Allah" Some translations interpret "fitna" as "persecution", but the traditional understanding of this word is not supported by the historical context (See notes for 2:293, also). The Meccans were simply refusing Muhammad access to their city during Haj. Other Muslims were allowed to travel there - just not as an armed group, since Muhammad had declared war on Mecca prior to his eviction. The Meccans were also acting in defense of their religion, since it was Muhammad's intention to destroy their idols and establish Islam by force (which he later did). Hence the critical part of this verse is to fight until "religion is only for Allah", meaning that the true justification of violence was the unbelief of the opposition. According to the Sira (Ibn Ishaq/Hisham 324) Muhammad further explains that "Allah must have no rivals."

Quran (9:5) - "So when the sacred months have passed away, then slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captive and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush, then if they repent and keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate, leave their way free to them." According to this verse, the best way of staying safe from Muslim violence is to convert to Islam (prayer (salat) and the poor tax (zakat) are among the religion's Five Pillars). This popular claim that the Quran only inspires violence within the context of self-defense is seriously challenged by this passage as well, since the Muslims to whom it was written were obviously not under attack. Had they been, then there would have been no waiting period (earlier verses make it a duty for Muslims to fight in self-defense, even during the sacred months). The historical context is Mecca after the idolaters were subjugated by Muhammad and posed no threat. Once the Muslims had the power, they violently evicted those unbelievers who would not convert.

Quran (9:29) - "Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued."

Quran (9:123) - "O you who believe! fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness."

Quran (17:16) - "And when We wish to destroy a town, We send Our commandment to the people of it who lead easy lives, but they transgress therein; thus the word proves true against it, so We destroy it with utter destruction."

Quran (61:4) - "Surely Allah loves those who fight in His way"

Bukhari (52:177) - Allah's Apostle said, "The Hour will not be established until you fight with the Jews, and the stone behind which a Jew will be hiding will say. "O Muslim! There is a Jew hiding behind me, so kill him."

Muslim (1:33) - the Messenger of Allah said: I have been commanded to fight against people till they testify that there is no god but Allah, that Muhammad is the messenger of Allah


Bukhari (8:387)- Allah's Apostle said, "I have been ordered to fight the people till they say: 'None has the right to be worshipped but Allah'. And if they say so, pray like our prayers, face our Qibla and slaughter as we slaughter, then their blood and property will be sacred to us and we will not interfere with them except legally."

Muslim (1:30) - "The Messenger of Allah said: I have been commanded to fight against people so long as they do not declare that there is no god but Allah."

Bukhari (11:626)- [Muhammad said:] "I decided to order a man to lead the prayer and then take a flame to burn all those, who had not left their houses for the prayer, burning them alive inside their homes."

Muslim (19:4294) - "When the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) appointed anyone as leader of an army or detachment he would especially exhort him... He would say: Fight in the name of Allah and in the way of Allah. Fight against those who disbelieve in Allah. Make a holy war... When you meet your enemies who are polytheists, invite them to three courses of action. If they respond to any one of these, you also accept it and withhold yourself from doing them any harm. Invite them to (accept) Islam; if they respond to you, accept it from them and desist from fighting against them... If they refuse to accept Islam, demand from them the Jizya. If they agree to pay, accept it from them and hold off your hands. If they refuse to pay the tax, seek Allah's help and fight them.

Tabari 7:97 The morning after the murder of Ashraf, the Prophet declared, "Kill any Jew who falls under your power."


And the video doesn't say Allah doesn't mean God. It said that before Mohammed's time it was used to refer to the Moon God in that area's pagan religion. This is historical fact.

Why didn't you list when and around what events these were revealed? In the context they were meant to be taken there is nothing wrong with those verses. And yes the video says a person worshiping Allah is not Worshiping God, which means the man didn't consider the word Allah the same. Allah being used to describe the main idol doesn't take away from the meaning of the word, people call their idols God as well, the cow is God to some, etc. Doesn't take away from the one true God., your videos are 100% bs, friend. And that's me being nice.

If Islam taught to slay everyone why when Muslims took Damascus they prayed Friday prayers at st John the Baptist church and let Christians have their Sundays there too? how come when Muslims took Jerusalem they didn't kill anyone but took it peacefully? How come the crusaders killed women and children in Jerusalem? Oh how cruel those Muslims must be. But you can believe your false YouTube clips if you want, remain ignorant.

 

[Dafunkdoc_Unlimited]

u really gonna argue that religion doesnt retard intellect breh

Religion has no bearing on intelligence anymore than atheism.​

 

[lini...]