The UK’s CMA has expressed concern that Microsoft‘s Activision merger could “significantly weaken” PlayStation (Updated with lawyer breakdown)

CoolinInTheCut

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Sony=/=The Market.

The market thinks the deal is fine, even a good thing.

Only sony is complaining.

Sony is the only one complaining because Sony is the only one at risk here.

Again, if MS bought third party support from Nintendo like Pokemon, then Nintendo would likely be the only one complaining because they're the only ones at risk.

None of this is complicated but you guys are being intellectually dishonest out of fanboyism for MS.
 

winb83

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It is the regulators job to protect the market from anti-competitive practices, such as hindering direct competitors for self gain.

Buying away third party support to put behind your own walled garden is anti-competitive.
What are the alternatives? How does Sony get a legitimate competitor? They can make deals to keep major third party games off rival platforms almost at will. If a competitor can’t acquire brands and IPs people care about how else does that happen. Because today Sony and Nintendo each have their own sector of the market and operate with impunity for any decisions they make. Nobody will ever really challenge Nintendo. Sony and Nintendo have a seemingly unofficial non-confrontation clause where they purposely avoid infringement on the other’s primary customers. Lack of competition has a negative impact on consumers. Look as Nintendo and their online infrastructure. Look as Sony’s attitude towards physical backwards compatibility pre-PS4.

Microsoft buying Activision is a necessary evil to build more competition.
 

Gizmo_Duck

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What are the alternatives? How does Sony get a legitimate competitor

I don’t get this argument. Are you saying there is no possible way Microsoft can compete with sony offering gamepass and owning the 23 studios it currently does? Which is 5 more than Sony and about 11 more than Nintendo if you include their partner studios like intelligent systems.

Nintendo already does compete and a lot of times out competes sony without call of duty, the same argument can be used in reverse to them not caring about it.

If not, don’t you think thats more of a Microsoft problem and not an industry problem?
 

MeachTheMonster

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Sony is the only one complaining because Sony is the only one at risk here.

Again, if MS bought third party support from Nintendo like Pokemon, then Nintendo would likely be the only one complaining because they're the only ones at risk.

None of this is complicated but you guys are being intellectually dishonest out of fanboyism for MS.
That’s fine. The purchase Doesn’t make the market anti-competitive. Is the point.
 

winb83

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I don’t get this argument. Are you saying there is no possible way Microsoft can compete with sony offering gamepass and owning the 23 studios it currently does? Which is 5 more than Sony and about 11 more than Nintendo if you include their partner studios like intelligent systems.

Nintendo already does compete and a lot of times out competes sony without call of duty, the same argument can be used in reverse to them not caring about it.

If not, don’t you think thats more of a Microsoft problem and not an industry problem?
They can’t secure games like Call of Duty for Game Pass without paying fees so high it doesn’t make sense to pay them vs buy the company that makes the game. New IPs and old ones with indie games only will take their service so far. They also have to contend with a competitor leveraging their dominant market share to create contracts that exclude games from their service or platform at will.

What you seem unwilling to admit is baring some black swan event there is no way to compete with Sony the way things are now. By black swan event like Sony deciding to put out a $600 home console and handicap themselves half a generation trying to leverage market share to push Blu-Ray.

In the history of console gaming no company has ever toppled a market leader without the assistance of taking advantage of a black swan event. Not even Sony reached their level without that.
 

Gizmo_Duck

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They can’t secure games like Call of Duty for Game Pass without paying fees so high it doesn’t make sense to pay them vs buy the company that makes the game. New IPs and old ones with indie games only will take their service so far. They also have to contend with a competitor leveraging their dominant market share to create contracts that exclude games from their service or platform at will.

What you seem unwilling to admit is baring some black swan event there is no way to compete with Sony the way things are now. By black swan event like Sony deciding to put out a $600 home console and handicap themselves half a generation trying to leverage market share to push Blu-Ray.

In the history of console gaming no company has ever toppled a market leader without the assistance of taking advantage of a black swan event. Not even Sony reached their level without that.

So giving games away for practically free with gamepass and buying 15+ studios in the past 5 years (and supposedly having far superior and cheaper hardware) still isn’t enough to compete with Sony?



You’re telling me the only way they can gain any type of competitive leverage on sony is to further spend another 70 billion dollars on top of the 100’s of millions they’ve already spent securing content?

Why doesn’t nintendo have to spend this much money to compete? They generate more profit every year than both of them
 

winb83

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What Sony doesn’t want is COD $70 on Playstation and free on Gamepass because it will look bad with the optics but we are past that point.
This is why Sony will likely never agree to any deal to let this merger happen. They'll probably just continue to make noise and try and get it to fail. Every year millions of people buy that game and spend effectively 7 months (60% of a year) of a base Game Pass subscription on it. If you can add a second game like say MLB The Show to that you're over a year's of Game Pass on just those two games. You're right they can't compete with the optics on that especially with cross platform multiplayer.

This isn't as much about Sony possibly losing CoD which seems unlikely as much as it's about them trying to protect the status quo that enshrines them as the overwhelming market leader and makes it very difficult for them to be toppled. CoD drastically changes the math on the worth of a service like Game Pass for a lot of people.

Even Microsoft owning CoD makes it into a bargaining chip and gives leverage.
 

Legal

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They can’t secure games like Call of Duty for Game Pass without paying fees so high it doesn’t make sense to pay them vs buy the company that makes the game. New IPs and old ones with indie games only will take their service so far. They also have to contend with a competitor leveraging their dominant market share to create contracts that exclude games from their service or platform at will.

What you seem unwilling to admit is baring some black swan event there is no way to compete with Sony the way things are now. By black swan event like Sony deciding to put out a $600 home console and handicap themselves half a generation trying to leverage market share to push Blu-Ray.

In the history of console gaming no company has ever toppled a market leader without the assistance of taking advantage of a black swan event. Not even Sony reached their level without that.

Breh, this is so overly dramatic that it's crazy.

This idea that that gaming market is completely unshakable is crazy, because companies fukking up and blowing their market position is a basic part of business. And even if it was a "black swan" type event for that to happen, you could argue that it's happened incredibly often:

Nintendo miscalculates cartridges vs CD-Roms, Sega completely mishandles the Saturn, Playstation is the unlikely winner of the generation.

Sony clearly dominates the next generation, but again, only by being the most stable option. Dreamcast dies early. GameCube does well, but is the weird console where Nintendo seemed to not be sure who their audience was. Xbox is new, but starts to establish its footing.

Sony gets arrogant, botches pricing and games for the PS3 launch, XBox 360 launches earlier and has a better launch window. Microsoft establishes a huge lead that Sony spends and entire generation chipping away at. Both are ultimately outsold by the Wii, so it doesn't really matter.

Nintendo completely and utterly botches the Wii U, and increasingly isolates themselves from a third party standpoint. Microsoft looks at what Sony did with the PS3, says "Yeah. I like that. :jawalrus: " and basically does the same shyt. Sony's investment in studios in the early days of the PS3 cycle pays off, PS4 wins almost by default.

This generation, Nintendo has accepted that being a niche/exclusive platform works perfectly for them, and have been INCREDIBLY successful. Microsoft has the money and infrastructure to not just compete with Sony, but actually won, if we're being honest. Only problem is that they need games.

This idea that Microsoft cannot compete with Sony and never truly has is preposterous. They're just doing what any smart company would do, and using their most abundant resource to compete: money.

It's only natural for their direct competitors to not just sit back and let them acquire that large of an asset.
 

winb83

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So giving games away for practically free with gamepass and buying 15+ studios in the past 5 years (and supposedly having far superior and cheaper hardware) still isn’t enough to compete with Sony?



You’re telling me the only way they can gain any type of competitive leverage on sony is to further spend another 70 billion dollars on top of the 100’s of millions they’ve already spent securing content?

Why doesn’t nintendo have to spend this much money to compete? They generate more profit every year than both of them
Nintendo and Sony don't compete with each other. They cater to different sectors of the market. Sony used to try to compete with Nintendo. They used to make portables, games like Modnation Racers and PlayStation All Stars and things like the PS Move to be in direct competition with Nintendo. They've since stopped doing that. It's pretty clear both decided to just let the other do their own thing. The GameCube was really the list time Nintendo put any effort into competing with Sony and the PS3 for Sony competing with Nintendo.

Almost nobody is walking to a store and choosing between a Switch or a PS5. In contrast Microsoft and Sony are after almost the exact core customer. Also putting games on your subscription based service isn't giving them away for free just like Spotify doesn't give away music and Netflix isn't giving away films. It's a service being sold.
 

winb83

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Breh, this is so overly dramatic that it's crazy.

This idea that that gaming market is completely unshakable is crazy, because companies fukking up and blowing their market position is a basic part of business. And even if it was a "black swan" type event for that to happen, you could argue that it's happened incredibly often:

Nintendo miscalculates cartridges vs CD-Roms, Sega completely mishandles the Saturn, Playstation is the unlikely winner of the generation.

Sony clearly dominates the next generation, but again, only by being the most stable option. Dreamcast dies early. GameCube does well, but is the weird console where Nintendo seemed to not be sure who their audience was. Xbox is new, but starts to establish its footing.

Sony gets arrogant, botches pricing and games for the PS3 launch, XBox 360 launches earlier and has a better launch window. Microsoft establishes a huge lead that Sony spends and entire generation chipping away at. Both are ultimately outsold by the Wii, so it doesn't really matter.

Nintendo completely and utterly botches the Wii U, and increasingly isolates themselves from a third party standpoint. Microsoft looks at what Sony did with the PS3, says "Yeah. I like that. :jawalrus: " and basically does the same shyt. Sony's investment in studios in the early days of the PS3 cycle pays off, PS4 wins almost by default.

This generation, Nintendo has accepted that being a niche/exclusive platform works perfectly for them, and have been INCREDIBLY successful. Microsoft has the money and infrastructure to not just compete with Sony, but actually won, if we're being honest. Only problem is that they need games.

This idea that Microsoft cannot compete with Sony and never truly has is preposterous. They're just doing what any smart company would do, and using their most abundant resource to compete: money.

It's only natural for their direct competitors to not just sit back and let them acquire that large of an asset.
Really since Nintendo rose to prominence there's only been maybe 2 black swan events.

The Nintendo cartridge over CD decision.
The Sony $600 Blu-Ray decision.

Those are the only 2 times the market leadership position changed places since Nintendo took it. In the 2nd event's case at that point Nintendo said fukk it and went Blue Ocean so while Microsoft was far more competitive they still came up short. Outside of that either Nintendo or Sony has ruled with an iron fist.

The fact of the matter is this. If a customer is in your ecosystem and you don't give them a reason to leave they won't. Most people don't want to buy 2 and 3 home consoles. They want to spend the $500 on a single box and be done with it. Building new IPs there is nothing Microsoft will ever be able to do when on Sony you're getting all major third party games, some major third party exclusives, and Sony first party games.

Microsoft doesn't need games as a vague concept like yall talk. They need games people actually care about. Hence they're buying publishers that make those.
 

Legal

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Really since Nintendo rose to prominence there's only been maybe 2 black swan events.

The Nintendo cartridge over CD decision.
The Sony $600 Blu-Ray decision.

Those are the only 2 times the market leadership position changed places since Nintendo took it. In the 2nd event's case at that point Nintendo said fukk it and went Blue Ocean so while Microsoft was far more competitive they still came up short. Outside of that either Nintendo or Sony has ruled with an iron fist.

The fact of the matter is this. If a customer is in your ecosystem and you don't give them a reason to leave they won't. Most people don't want to buy 2 and 3 home consoles. They want to spend the $500 on a single box and be done with it. Building new IPs there is nothing Microsoft will ever be able to do when on Sony you're getting all major third party games, some major third party exclusives, and Sony first party games.

Microsoft doesn't need games as a vague concept like yall talk. They need games people actually care about. Hence they're buying publishers that make those.

First off, with the bolded, what do you think people mean when they say they need Microsoft needs games?

And your argument about not being able to build new IPs is invalidated because Sony did it in the PS3 generation. Uncharted, and the Last of Us are the main two still going, but there were plenty of new IP that Sony brought to the table that sold well enough. And they did it while Microsoft was crushing them on the third party front. So, it's complete doable.

Where people, and Sony take issue with this thing is that just buying Activision is taking a shortcut to not only having huge IP in house, but forcing Sony to have to work with them going forward solely based off of purchasing power, not merit.
 

winb83

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First off, with the bolded, what do you think people mean when they say they need Microsoft needs games?

And your argument about not being able to build new IPs is invalidated because Sony did it in the PS3 generation. Uncharted, and the Last of Us are the main two still going, but there were plenty of new IP that Sony brought to the table that sold well enough. And they did it while Microsoft was crushing them on the third party front. So, it's complete doable.

Where people, and Sony take issue with this thing is that just buying Activision is taking a shortcut to not only having huge IP in house, but forcing Sony to have to work with them going forward solely based off of purchasing power, not merit.
As a Sony customer why do I care what Microsoft does? I'm getting all major third party games, some major third party exclusives, and Sony first party titles. In order for them to grab my attention they need something I actually value not some abstract "games" new IP that doesn't exist because even if that new IP comes into existence why should I care? I'm good here.

Your suggestion that some new IPs are going to get me and other gamers to drop PlayStation is laughable to me. There has never been a time in my life I've ever purchased a Microsoft console without either the intent or actual ownership on a Sony one and TBH I never will. There is nothing Microsoft could ever do with a new IP to get me to purchase an Xbox over a PlayStation. Xbox is always a second or third choice to me and I'm not in the minority here.

Satisfied customers aren't looking to jump ship over new IPs no matter what you say.
 

CW99

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:blessed:#xbrehs watering the garden with DecaystationBoys tears.
 
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