Whips-n-Chains
Chi
True detectives?
The Sopranos Series - Re-Watch (Spoilers!!!)
- Thread starter jay211
- Start date
True detectives?
Yezzirrr
Neo. The Only. The One.
THE ONE
random but idk how I forgot about this scene
Forgot about this too
It's actually a wonder that Phil wasn't trying to kill him for this alone after becoming boss.
louisvandross
the lesbian converter
Something new I noticed on a rewatch was that agent Harris was sleeping with that police chick to get info on where the Shah of Iran was. I also never noticed Tony's mini smirk while holding Chris' nose.
For anyone that don't know Boardwalk Empire is a top 7 HBO show. Created by one of the Soprano writers and starring most of the Soprano cast. Would've been top five if they didn't fumble the last two seasons.
For anyone that don't know Boardwalk Empire is a top 7 HBO show. Created by one of the Soprano writers and starring most of the Soprano cast. Would've been top five if they didn't fumble the last two seasons.
You can add junkies, informants, and animal abusers to that list
Vegas, and all legal poker rooms take a rake. They even take a rake in jail poker games
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Neo. The Only. The One.
THE ONE
The reason I dont buy yalls theories about Tony being killed at the end is cause it doesn't make sense. Paulie was both afraid and devoted to Tony and loved him almost as if he was his own son. Nowhere in the series was it even hinted that Paulie would turn on Tony.
As far as ole boy whose twin got killed, yeah he was mad about it in s2 but he never brought it up again or even hinted that he was angry with Tony past that season. And if that was still an issue that he had, there would have been plenty of opportunities for him to take advantage. He could have even have taken advantage during the last 2 episodes when NY was trying to find Tony. He could have easily told them where he was.
Which leaves only the possibility that the Little Guy in NY lied when he told Tony that they were okay with him taking out Phil and that the beef was squashed.
Which I don't believe. One thing that has been shown on the show time and again is that the mafia for the most part keep their word if they make an agreement. Not saying the agreement can't be broken but there has to be something that precipitates that, and there was no such thing. Plus Tony's fbi friend would have told him if there was chatter about still taking him out.
Tony survived. Chase ended it that way to make ppl debate it for 20 years but following the logic of the show, there is no one who has a reason to kill Tony at the series end.
As far as the Chase remark about that "death scene", people do and say things when they want discussion to pick up. I believe he was lowkey trolling when he said that. Plus he went on to explain that the original idea was for Tony to die. Original idea meaning, he changed his mind and went in another direction.
As far as ole boy whose twin got killed, yeah he was mad about it in s2 but he never brought it up again or even hinted that he was angry with Tony past that season. And if that was still an issue that he had, there would have been plenty of opportunities for him to take advantage. He could have even have taken advantage during the last 2 episodes when NY was trying to find Tony. He could have easily told them where he was.
Which leaves only the possibility that the Little Guy in NY lied when he told Tony that they were okay with him taking out Phil and that the beef was squashed.
Which I don't believe. One thing that has been shown on the show time and again is that the mafia for the most part keep their word if they make an agreement. Not saying the agreement can't be broken but there has to be something that precipitates that, and there was no such thing. Plus Tony's fbi friend would have told him if there was chatter about still taking him out.
Tony survived. Chase ended it that way to make ppl debate it for 20 years but following the logic of the show, there is no one who has a reason to kill Tony at the series end.
As far as the Chase remark about that "death scene", people do and say things when they want discussion to pick up. I believe he was lowkey trolling when he said that. Plus he went on to explain that the original idea was for Tony to die. Original idea meaning, he changed his mind and went in another direction.
welcome to to the twilight zone of debate.
argue alll you want but I def think Members Only guy blasted Tony. look forward to arguing with you for the next two decades
I think Tony died 
even if he didnt. Bobby dead.... Sil almost dead, Chrissy dead, Patsy still wanted Tony dead, Carlo snitching... Paulie, looking out for number one. NY rly needed to make an example out of him The boss off a glorified crew killing a ny boss in front of his wife? no way.
even if he didnt. Bobby dead.... Sil almost dead, Chrissy dead, Patsy still wanted Tony dead, Carlo snitching... Paulie, looking out for number one. NY rly needed to make an example out of him The boss off a glorified crew killing a ny boss in front of his wife? no way.
Regarding Paulie, let's not forget that Johnny Sacks straight up told him they might have to take out Tony in S4 - and Paulie shrugged his shoulders.
I do think, unlike Hesh or some other mobsters, that Paulie had love for Tony - but he was a survivor first.
He also believes in the supernatural, and the last scene we see between them is Tone manipilating him into taking on a "cursed" position while the "Christopher-cat" is watching him, instead of when he was staring at Chris picture.
I do think, unlike Hesh or some other mobsters, that Paulie had love for Tony - but he was a survivor first.
He also believes in the supernatural, and the last scene we see between them is Tone manipilating him into taking on a "cursed" position while the "Christopher-cat" is watching him, instead of when he was staring at Chris picture.
The Devil's Advocate
Call me Dad
I disagree... You get to see exactly what Tony's childhood was like and why Uncle Junior is how he is
Wasn't amazing... But it was a good watch if you're a fan
Whips-n-Chains
Chi
Read that master of Sopranos joint. It explains all this in insane detail.
Paulie and patsy were pretty chummy the final season…paulie had already crossed Tony before, and hes one of the most self serving guys on the show.
At the end of the day this is a business enterprise with murderous employees, they’d be willing to betray just like butchie betrayed phil. If NY is going to make a move on Tony, there’s not shyt paulie of all ppl will be able to do to stop them
Jersey was a shell of itself by the end. All the big earners (Ralphie, vito, Sil) we’re dead, and all the hitters or loyal guys were gone too (Richie, Ralphie, Chrissy, furio, Sil, Bobby). You don’t think paulie saw the writing on the wall?
VegetasHairline
Veteran
There is symbolism first..if you rock with that theory or not..when Tony is in the hideout and the opening shot is him laying in bed on white pillow...made to resemble a man in a casket...atleast the camera angle.
(NOTE I RECONIZE THIS MIGHT BE A REACH
)You gotta take into account the way Phil was wacked..and remember the optics...it was only sanctioned in a backroom deal...to take out a NY BOSS from what I understand takes the decision of alot more people.
Then the curb stomping of Coco....
Could've been anyone in the NY FAMILY who took out Tony and remember Butchie publicly would be on some "THAT SON OF A bytch HIT OUR BOSS WITH NO APPROVAL
".So Butchie wouldn't stop a hit on Tony after making a deal...it would benefit him.
Neo. The Only. The One.
THE ONE
There is symbolism first..if you rock with that theory or not..when Tony is in the hideout and the opening shot is him laying in bed on white pillow...made to resemble a man in a casket...atleast the camera angle.
(NOTE I RECONIZE THIS MIGHT BE A REACH
You gotta take into account the way Phil was wacked..and remember the optics...it was only sanctioned in a backroom deal...to take out a NY BOSS from what I understand takes the decision of alot more people.
Then the curb stomping of Coco....
Could've been anyone in the NY FAMILY who took out Tony and remember Butchie publicly would be on some "THAT SON OF A bytch HIT OUR BOSS WITH NO APPROVAL
So Butchie wouldn't stop a hit on Tony after making a deal...it would benefit him.
Remember when Ralphie killed that whoooare and Tony put hands on him and Sil pulled him to the side and said: "She wasn't related to you by blood or marriage." He pretty much told him he was out of line. That tells us that if a woman IS related to you by blood or marriage, you are within your rights to do what you need to do.
Phil was wrong to put the hit on Tony because of the Coco situation, cause Coco disrespected Tony's daughter and pretty much threatened her. And truthfully that wasnt the real reason Phil did it. That was his excuse. It was a combination of situations that made him want to take Tony out. The Coco situation was just what he used as the straw that broke the camel's back.
I do agree with you that Tony and them was supposed to get the approval of the other families before whacking Phil. But the way to rationalize that is... Phil put a hit out on Tony. So that could be seen as self-defense, which I'm sure is okay.
People get too into the weeds on the final scene, Chase wasn't thinking about 80% of that mafia palace intrigue shyt, intricate alliances, he plays way more down the middle than that on the show, and there is no doubt he both created the tension purposefully, and the idea that Tony could be killed. And a lot of the symbolism is straight up fan fiction and seeing things that aren't there.
I think there's do doubt he was intentionally ambivalent, about the way it's shot, but I think if he really was being truthful, in his version, Tony doesn't get murdered, but he will let someone see it that way. He has never really said what HIS INTENT was.
He has said he didn't want to do the typical ending, and look at how well he did that.
For me, it's a weak ending if he gets murdered, it's cheesy and over the top, and I think the idea that it goes on and on -----is so much more powerful, exactly as Chase himself wanted. Him getting killed it exactly the kind of morality tale that Chase didn't want to tell and didn't want to make.
and David Chase being who he is, you can get a lot out of his interviews, and on the record answers, but he's not 100% truthful, he's avoidant on that, and that's his right as an artist. He did mention another ending where Tony goes to NY for a sit down with Johnny, and the last shot is the credits sequence in reverse, as he goes into NYC through the Lincoln tunnel. That would have been dope. But, him getting killed in Holsetens, is too melodramatic, Macbeth type shyt.
People make so much of the foreshadowing about you never see it coming, but it foreshadows the VERY next episode or the one after, where it's Sil who doesn't see it coming, I'm not saying you can't see it both ways.
I think there's do doubt he was intentionally ambivalent, about the way it's shot, but I think if he really was being truthful, in his version, Tony doesn't get murdered, but he will let someone see it that way. He has never really said what HIS INTENT was.
He has said he didn't want to do the typical ending, and look at how well he did that.
For me, it's a weak ending if he gets murdered, it's cheesy and over the top, and I think the idea that it goes on and on -----is so much more powerful, exactly as Chase himself wanted. Him getting killed it exactly the kind of morality tale that Chase didn't want to tell and didn't want to make.
and David Chase being who he is, you can get a lot out of his interviews, and on the record answers, but he's not 100% truthful, he's avoidant on that, and that's his right as an artist. He did mention another ending where Tony goes to NY for a sit down with Johnny, and the last shot is the credits sequence in reverse, as he goes into NYC through the Lincoln tunnel. That would have been dope. But, him getting killed in Holsetens, is too melodramatic, Macbeth type shyt.
People make so much of the foreshadowing about you never see it coming, but it foreshadows the VERY next episode or the one after, where it's Sil who doesn't see it coming, I'm not saying you can't see it both ways.
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Nah, don't forget that we see that scene twice - which is pretty rare for this show.
At the very end of the penultimate episode when Tony goes to sleep in the safe house we get a flashback to Bobby saying this. Tony is staring at the gun that Bobby gave him.