The Official Israel-Gaza Thread

[Mister Terrific]

Hamas has agreed multiple times to release the hostages if there is a permanent ceasefire. The head of the CIA brokered the most recent deal and netanyahu sabotaged it.

Link?

Don't be dense, this was never about the hostages

I agree. Israel is bent on Hamas eradication as I said.

You out conditions on aid, watch how fast those humanitarian corridors open up. Israel knows without our aid, Israel runs out of ammunition in less than a month.

Maybe. However, Netanyahu has said he’s willing to go it alone. Israel could just as easily close all crossings and start indiscriminate killing. I don’t mean 30,000 I mean 100,000-200.000.

 

[Sly Cookin]

Russia and China veto US resolution calling for immediate cease-fire in Gaza

The vote in the 15-member Security Council was 11 members in favor, three against and one abstention.

apnews.com

These guys just lie and lie and lie.

Of course you pull up the watered down bullshyt the US submitted. Never seen a poster, besides Pressure, that is this shameless

 

[Pull Up the Roots]

Russia and China veto US resolution calling for immediate cease-fire in Gaza

The vote in the 15-member Security Council was 11 members in favor, three against and one abstention.

apnews.com

These guys just lie and lie and lie.

You are so dishonest. You posted the same thing on March 22nd.

Middle East Crisis: Russia and China Veto U.S.-Led Cease-Fire Resolution at U.N.

The United States had vetoed three previous resolutions demanding a stop to fighting in Gaza. The measure it proposed on Friday called for an “immediate and sustained cease-fire.”

www.nytimes.com

k then

 

[LOST IN THE SAUCE]

Of course you pull up the watered down bullshyt the US submitted. Never seen a poster, besides Pressure, that is this shameless

You are so dishonest. You posted the same thing on March 22nd.

Right from his own link

A key issue was the unusual language that said the Security Council “determines the imperative of an immediate and sustained cease-fire.” The phrasing was not a straightforward “demand” or “call” to halt hostilities.

He lies as easily as he breathes.

Link?

‘No doubt’ Netanyahu preventing hostage deal, charges ex-spokesman of Families Forum

Haim Rubinstein claims Israel rejected early Hamas offer to free all civilians if IDF didn't enter Gaza, lays out PM's alleged political meddling that led him to quit last month

www.timesofisrael.com

“We left the meeting very disappointed because Netanyahu talked about dismantling Hamas as the goal of the war. He didn’t promise anything regarding the demand to return the hostages. He merely said a military operation in Gaza was needed to serve as leverage for the hostages’ release.

“We later found out that Hamas had offered on October 9 or 10 to release all the civilian hostages in exchange for the IDF not entering the Strip, but the government rejected the offer.”

Israel strikes targets in Rafah, hours after Hamas agrees to a cease-fire

The high-stakes diplomatic moves and military brinkmanship left a glimmer of hope alive — but only barely — for an accord that could bring at least a pause in the 7-month-old war that has devastated the Gaza Strip.

www.pbs.org

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/hamas-chief-says-movement-sticking-ceasefire-conditions-including-israeli-2024-04-03/#:~:text=%22We%20are%20committed%20to%20our,achieving%20an%20honourable%20prisoner%20exchange

 

[Mister Terrific]

‘No doubt’ Netanyahu preventing hostage deal, charges ex-spokesman of Families Forum

Haim Rubinstein claims Israel rejected early Hamas offer to free all civilians if IDF didn't enter Gaza, lays out PM's alleged political meddling that led him to quit last month

www.timesofisrael.com

A couple days after slaughtering 1200 people Hamas says they will release the hostages if Israel doesn’t invade AND releases hundreds of prisoners.

No nation in history is taking that deal. Evil or not.

Israel strikes targets in Rafah, hours after Hamas agrees to a cease-fire

The high-stakes diplomatic moves and military brinkmanship left a glimmer of hope alive — but only barely — for an accord that could bring at least a pause in the 7-month-old war that has devastated the Gaza Strip.

www.pbs.org

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/hamas-chief-says-movement-sticking-ceasefire-conditions-including-israeli-2024-04-03/#:~:text=%22We%20are%20committed%20to%20our,achieving%20an%20honourable%20prisoner%20exchange

"We are committed to our demands: the permanent ceasefire, comprehensive and complete withdrawal of the enemy out of the Gaza Strip, the return of all displaced people to their homes, allowing all aid needed for our people in Gaza, rebuilding the Strip, lifting the blockade and achieving an honourable prisoner exchange deal," Haniyeh said in a televised speech marking Al-Quds (Jerusalem) Day.”


So not a unilateral release of hostages but imposing conditions on Israel still such as rebuilding the strip (UN “60 billion dollars and 16 years) and prisoner exchange.


Again, accuracy in language matters.

 

[LOST IN THE SAUCE]

So not a unilateral release of hostages but imposing conditions on Israel still such as rebuilding the strip (UN “60 billion dollars and 16 years) and prisoner exchange.


Again, accuracy in language matters.

Gaza being rebuilt is your hang up?

Head of CIA helped broker the latest deal, yep. Netanyahu sabotaged the deal, also true. Hamas demanding a permanent ceasefire over a temporary pause to the genocide, another fact. Hamas been willing to negotiate hostage release for a ceasefire for the entire length of the conflict, correct. But the rebuilding of Gaza? That's where you think the line was drawn?
Netanyahu out here saying shyt like this:

Netanyahu vows to raid Rafah ‘with or without’ hostage deal

Mediators renew efforts to secure a truce ahead of invasion of city, where more than 1 million people are sheltering

www.theguardian.com

Then this guy goes "Wait a second... they think Gaza should be rebuilt? And Israel should have a part in helping to fix the pointless, indiscriminate destruction they've inflicted on the people and to the human infrastructure of Gaza during their genocide? Nice try, Hamas!" Like Israel wouldn't just make the US and the rest of the world pay for it anyway.









It's moments like this that I have to once again remind myself. These people aren't being disingenuous, they're just morons. The guy writes a lot of horseshyt, constantly gets called out for lying, for trying to move the goalpost, twisting the narrative, for petty trolling, and he just keeps on going. Moves right on to the next post full of bullshyt. Has the nerve to be condescending with his bullshyt too.
He probably doesn't even know he's full of shyt.

 

[Mister Terrific]

Gaza being rebuilt is your hang up?

Head of CIA helped broker the latest deal, yep. Netanyahu sabotaged the deal, also true. Hamas demanding a permanent ceasefire over a temporary pause to the genocide, another fact. Hamas been willing to negotiate hostage release for a ceasefire for the entire length of the conflict, correct. But the rebuilding of Gaza? That's where you think the line was drawn?

Hamas had zero leverage in this conflict besides the lives of its own people. No military allies, completely surrounded, losing territory every day.

What exactly in your mind leads you to believe that Israel would be coerced into paying money to rebuild Gaza? Is Hamas in Jerusalem? Is Netanyahu and his cabinet prisoners of war?


That’s not the only thing either. The freeing of 4 times the number of Palestinian prisoners and the inability to vet anyone returning to the zone of conflict. Can you perhaps use the little bit of logic you have why Israel would balk at that?


Btw I suggest you do more research into why the CIA proposal broke down

https://edition.cnn.com/2024/05/21/politics/sources-say-they-were-duped-by-egypt-changing-ceasefire-terms-for-hamas/index.html

You live in a world of emotions and not reality.

 

[LOST IN THE SAUCE]

Hamas had zero leverage in this conflict besides the lives of its own people. No military allies, completely surrounded, losing territory every day.

What exactly in your mind leads you to believe that Israel would be coerced into paying money to rebuild Gaza? Is Hamas in Jerusalem? Is Netanyahu and his cabinet prisoners of war?


That’s not the only thing either. The freeing of 4 times the number of Palestinian prisoners and the inability to vet anyone returning to the zone of conflict. Can you perhaps use the little bit of logic you have why Israel would balk at that?


Btw I suggest you do more research into why the CIA proposal broke down

https://edition.cnn.com/2024/05/21/politics/sources-say-they-were-duped-by-egypt-changing-ceasefire-terms-for-hamas/index.html

You live in a world of emotions and not reality.

What does any of this have to do with Hamas' willingness for return of the hostages in exchange for a permanent ceasefire? Something you asked a link for, which I provided. What are we talking about?

Do you think this has anything to do with the ceasefire negotiations breaking down?

Netanyahu vows to raid Rafah ‘with or without’ hostage deal

Mediators renew efforts to secure a truce ahead of invasion of city, where more than 1 million people are sheltering

www.theguardian.com

No?
Weird.
You know what, you got this one bro. Whatever you think you're arguing, you win. Congrats little man. Proud of you.



This place is so unserious. This guy really has no idea he's full of shyt. Can't make a coherent point, just has raw determination to win. Look at him go.

 

[mastermind]

Two more US officials resign over Biden administration’s position on Gaza war

The officials accuse the administration of not telling the truth about Israel’s obstruction of aid to Palestinians in Gaza

www.theguardian.com

According to the Washington Post, Gilbert took issue in particular with a formal state department report to Congress on 10 May, noting that Israel “did not fully cooperate” in the first months of the Gaza war but that it had “significantly increased humanitarian access” more recently. In fact, after a spike in humanitarian deliveries in late April and early May, they have fallen to near zero in the weeks since.

Smith said that the breaking point for his career as a state department contractor came last week, when he had been scheduled to present a paper to an internal USAID conference about maternal and child mortality in Gaza and the West Bank.

It had been cleared for publication by the conference organisers but when it came to the attention of USAID’s Middle East section on 20 May, Smith was asked to make redactions. He said those edits included removing a slide outlining applicable international humanitarian law, and any language implying recognition of a Palestinian state, including references to agencies which have Palestine in their title, like the UN Family Planning Association (UNFPA) Palestine.

After 24 hours of discussing edits, the USAID leadership changed its mind and ordered Smith’s talk to be cancelled altogether, deleting mention of it from the conference website.

“USAID has always prided itself on our programs supporting democracy, human rights, and rule of law,” Smith wrote in his resignation letter. “In Ukraine, we call for legal redress when people are victimised, and name perpetrators of violence … We boldly state “Slava Ukraini” in peppy promotional videos.”

“When it comes to the Palestinians, however, we avoid saying anything about their right to statehood, the abuses they’re currently suffering, or which powers have been violating their basic rights to freedom, self-determination, livelihoods, and clean water,” he said.

 

[Robbie3000]

Two more US officials resign over Biden administration’s position on Gaza war

The officials accuse the administration of not telling the truth about Israel’s obstruction of aid to Palestinians in Gaza

www.theguardian.com

It’s disgusting the levels that this administration will go to protect a rogue fascist state.

 

[ADevilYouKhow]

Israel troops push into central Rafah — AFP News

The Israeli army said Friday its troops pushed into central Rafah, escalating its nearly eight-month war with Hamas despite international objections over any offensive in the southern Gaza city.

apple.news

 

[Mister Terrific]

What does any of this have to do with Hamas' willingness for return of the hostages in exchange for a permanent ceasefire? Something you asked a link for, which I provided. What are we talking about?

Hamas is tying freeing of the hostages with other stipulations. 1 of which is absurd from any perspective imaginable. What state in the history of mankind has paid reparations for a war they are winning? Why would you think Israel would agree to that as a condition for release of hostages? What way do you think the U.S. forces Israel to agree to that.

So yeah you hand Netanyahu a layup to end negotiations when you do shyt like that. We are all aware Netanyahu wants to destroy Palestine.


Here let’s do a thought experiment. Say Taiwan launched an attack on China where they kill 1200 people and capture 200 hostages. China launches an attack on Taiwan, blockades the island, complete isolation from the outside world. International mediators come to negotiate and end to the conflict and Taiwan says “we will end this conflict on 4 conditions, permanent cease fire, release of 500 prisoners held in Chinese jails, free movement of all citizens of Taiwan both combatant and non-combatant without any vetting for affiliation, and you have to pay us $16 billion for damages.”

What do you think China would say? Now change out the names of any government in history and ask yourself again

 

[acri1]

It’s disgusting the levels that this administration will go to protect a rogue fascist state.

It's hard to even understand why

If it was good for Biden politically, it would still be evil and deplorable regardless, but it would at least be rational from a self-interest perspective. But it's not even that, all this does is hurt his chances of getting reelected. And Netanyahu is just trying to drag the war out to help Trump anyway.

It's incomprehensible that he's willing to throw the election (and tens of thousand of lives) away for Netanyahu.

 

[mastermind]

Here let’s do a thought experiment. Say Taiwan launched an attack on China where they kill 1200 people and capture 200 hostages. China launches an attack on Taiwan, blockades the island, complete isolation from the outside world. International mediators come to negotiate and end to the conflict and Taiwan says “we will end this conflict on 4 conditions, permanent cease fire, release of 500 prisoners held in Chinese jails, free movement of all citizens of Taiwan both combatant and non-combatant without any vetting for affiliation, and you have to pay us $16 billion for damages.”

The US media and politicians would portray this as a fair deal and you would be in agreement.

 

[Sly Cookin]

Hamas is tying freeing of the hostages with other stipulations. 1 of which is absurd from any perspective imaginable. What state in the history of mankind has paid reparations for a war they are winning? Why would you think Israel would agree to that as a condition for release of hostages? What way do you think the U.S. forces Israel to agree to that.

So yeah you hand Netanyahu a layup to end negotiations when you do shyt like that. We are all aware Netanyahu wants to destroy Palestine.


Here let’s do a thought experiment. Say Taiwan launched an attack on China where they kill 1200 people and capture 200 hostages. China launches an attack on Taiwan, blockades the island, complete isolation from the outside world. International mediators come to negotiate and end to the conflict and Taiwan says “we will end this conflict on 4 conditions, permanent cease fire, release of 500 prisoners held in Chinese jails, free movement of all citizens of Taiwan both combatant and non-combatant without any vetting for affiliation, and you have to pay us $16 billion for damages.”

What do you think China would say? Now change out the names of any government in history and ask yourself again

It is the duty of the occupying state to ensure the safety and protection of Palestinians. If Palestine was a state with it's own military, then you would have a point.

Taiwan doesn't work in your example because they are their own country.