Essential The Official Comic Book Discussion Thread [Support @Neuromancer’s book!]

[Dirty Mcdrawz]

Nah bro u gotta read em from issue 1 u can't really judge them from Tie ins

i've read them from #1 and i can confirm they are trash.

 

[Bigbigguy]

i've read them from #1 and i can confirm they are trash.

 

[Mr. Negative]

They say this is the list that Bendis did to reverse engineer the ramifications of Hank Pym being killed.

EVENTS POTENTIALLY UNDONE BY HANK PYM’S DEATH (and resulting ripple effects)​

Spoiler

1 - Creation of Ultron

A - No Vision

1 - No marriage to Scarlet Witch/Immortus plan to prevent her from breeding possibly derailed

2 - No birth of children (Speed & Wiccan of Young Avengers)

3 - No undoing of their children, which Immortus engineered in part to ensure Scarlet Witch’s mental instability and thus pliability

a – Mephisto and Master Pandemonium affected

4 - No Leonia, NJ-based events (Vision and Scarlet Witch maxi-series)

a - No opportunity for Crystal to meet and have affair with Norman Webster

1 - No divorce from Quicksilver

5 - No defeating Salem’s Seven

a – they conquer the witch town of New Salem, and we have an entire town of evil black mages working against humanity

6 – Does not form West Coast Avengers

7 - No Scarlet Witch insanity

a – No Disassembled deaths of Ant-Man/Lang, Jack of Hearts, Vision destruction

b – No M/M-Day/Decimation

1- Hundreds of X-Men/mutant stories undone

8 - Grim Reaper’s Lethal Legion potentially defeat and slay Avengers (Captain America, Black Panther, Quicksilver and Scarlet Witch)

1- Thousands of ripple effects from those deaths

2- Grim Reaper won’t later feel the need to revive his “dead” brother Wonder Man as a zombie, which means Wonder Man presumably remains dormant

9 - Vision not present as one of the Dead Avengers who save the living Avengers during the Chaos War.

B - No Crimson Cowl

1 - No Jarvis betrayal

C - No Jocasta

1 - Lots of battles go that bit worse without her (without her neutralizing the internal defenses, Beast doesn’t manage to get inside Red Ronin during his rampage, robot destroys the Long Island expressway during rush hour., she was instrumental in team’s first defeat of Taskmaster, Evolutionary War finale, etc.)

D - No Alkhema

1 - No Bio-Synthezoids, War Toys, Robos

2 - Mockingbird not abducted by Skrulls, or at least not in the same way (her abduction by Alkhema and the team’s battle with Alkie was the cover for the Skrulls’ abduction of Mockingbird)

E - No slaughter in Slorenia

1 - No giant Bloodwraith

F - No sentient Iron Man armor

1 - Blacklash doesn’t die

G - No Victor Mancha

1 - Gertrude Yorkes doesn’t die

H - No role in Annihilation: Conquest

1 - Star-Lord’s Guardians of the Galaxy don’t form

2 - Deathcry doesn’t die

3 - Spaceknights not taken over by Phalanx

4 – No further devastation of Kree Empire

5 - Moondragon doesn’t die

a – Phylla-Vell does not become Martyr

6 - Second major war that causes the Fault doesn’t happen - possibly negating the result of War of Kings and the Cancerverse’s attempted infestation of the universe, further negating Thanos’ resurrection and Nova (Rider) and Star-Lord’s sacrifice

I - No marriage to Jocasta

J - No possession of the Intelligencia’s inert Spaceknight body

K - No revival of Jim Hammond, the original Human Torch, after Mad Thinker’s usage of him against the FF

1 - Spitfire would not have been rejuvenated without a second dose of Human Torch blood

A - Spitfire’s absence may have affected various missions by the New Invaders and MI-13

2 - Marriage to Janet Van Dyne

A - Wasp’s chauffeur Charles Matthews never fired (events leading to same in Marvel Feature wouldn’t have happened without Hank), and Charles possibly never exposed as the Whirlwind/David Cannon (it was Pym who finally figured it out after years of Charles’ double identity going unsuspected by Hank, Jan and all the other Avengers). More than once, Whirlwind (David Cannon) has captured or defeated the Wasp, only to have Hank Pym arrive to save her or team up with her. Without Hank, it’s likely Wasp might not have escaped one of Whirlwind’s attempts.

3 - Bill Foster might have become Black Goliath sooner

A – Become a more confident, A-list hero without being in Hank Pym’s shadow

4 - Equipment being available for Scott Lang to steal to become Ant-Man and rescue surgeon to save his daughter’s life (Even if he still broke into Pym’s old lab and became Ant-Man, he’d have died during his first mission if Pym hadn’t been secretly tagging along and protected him a few times.)

A - Cassie dies

1 - No Stature

B - Surgeon Lang rescued, Erica Sondheim, remains imprisoned by her captor

1 – Not available to later implant bio-tech chip that restored crippled Tony Stark, and later saved his life when it went wrong - without her, Stark either remains crippled or dies

5 - Becoming Yellowjacket

A - Rita de Mara does not become Yellowjacket

1 – Is not present in Evolutionary War finale

2 – Is not present in any Guardians of the Galaxy story

3 – No death during the Crossing

4 – Is not present in Chaos War to help save Avengers, others

6 - Joining Defenders (as YJ)

A- does not rescue captured Defenders Dr. Strange, Valkyrie and Hulk from the Squadron Sinister

7 - Mental breakdown/imprisonment/divorce from Janet Van Dyne

A - No court-martial

B - Jan doesn’t have affair with Tony Stark/Iron Man while Hank was imprisoned

C - Jan doesn’t become the chastened Avengers leader later on (significantly affecting Masters of Evil’s siege of Mansion and Kang Dynasty, amongst others) OR conversely, Hank’s death forces this to happen much earlier

8 - Preventing Egghead’s schemes

A - Egghead would have forced his niece Trish Starr into his robot, destroying her individuality and body.

9 - Death of Egghead

A - Egghead remains with Intelligencia, possibly eliminating MODOK’s involvement - no Red Hulk/She-Hulk, World War Hulks, Hulked-Out Heroes

10 - Joining West Coast Avengers (which wouldn’t exist without Vision)

A - No participation in Time-Lost Saga - possibly leaving WCA stranded in the past

11 - No creation of MODAM (AIM scientists were unable to advance SODAM’s development without Pym’s help.)

A - The Cosmic Cube disaster during “Taking AIM” might have been worse, with MODOK being reactivated sooner

B - No Number None (the baby MODOK who claims his mother is MODAM)

C - No SILENT, no HATE, and no Nextwave: Agents of HATE

1 - Undoing character development leading to a more independently confident Photon, a more bloodthirsty Elsa Bloodstone and the human-hating/zombie killing Machine Man

12 - No dimension-crossing experiments resulting in fugitive St. Looie’s hitman from being lost in “Otherwhere”

13 - Relationship with Firebird/Espirita

14 - Relationship with Tigra

A – As mentioned below, Tigra’s son would probably never be born, since the Skrull who fathered said son was posing as Pym

15 – Participation in stopping Vibro from destroying LA with earthquakes

16 - Participation in the Crossing

A - Jan not mutated, dies of injuries at hands of Iron Man

17 - Participation in Heroes Reborn

A - Counter-Earth (Franklin) native and Avengers janitor Ernest Sanger would never have become Mant, the size-changing leader of the Remnants

18 - Participation in Destiny War (Possible Immortus picked a different Pym from another era/reality, so things might well have still gone much as seen)

A – Doesn’t double cross both sides as Yellowjacket

B - Rick Jones does not get involved in final battle

C - Time-Keepers survive

1 – No final event prompting Lilandra to sponsor Maximum Security

a – Quasar does not absorb Ego

2 - Reality-616 destroyed by Time-Keepers

19 - Curing of Firestar’s radiation problem

A – Leading to earlier or worse cancer/death

20 - Pym not available to supervise treatment and containment of Jack of Hearts’ unstable physiology

21 - Replacement by Skrull(s)

A - Various Skrulls that replaced him not participate in Initiative/Camp Hammond

B - The Skrulls would have needed another highly placed superhuman genius to replace instead of Hank Pym.

C - No GI-Ant-Man suit for Eric O’Grady to steal

1 - O’Grady dies in Helicarrier crash, never becomes Ant-Man

D – No Skrull relationship with Tigra

1 - William Garson never born

22 - Dark Reign events

A - No Infinite Mansion

B - No Dark Reign-era Mighty Avengers

1 - Amadeus Cho/Vision Jonas/Stature’s membership negated

2 - Chthon victorious

C - Not named Scientist Supreme

23 - Instruction at Avengers Academy

A - Veil, Hazmat, Mettle - not receiving treatment for various conditions

NOTE: During She-Hulk’s encounter with the TVA (Time Variation Authority) it was established that if an individual was removed from the timestream, in some instances time would cope by using a suitable stand-in to fulfill the their role. However, obviously more unique individuals or major events would be impacted greatly if the protagonist was removed. The early demise of Hank Pym and the impact his death has on any of the subsequent events listed above could be discounted as events still could have happened with a Pym-substitute.

Come on, breh. You REALLY expect me to believe that Bendis did THAT much research? fukk outta heeerrrreeeeeeee


As a comics history fan, that IS a cool list to read through, though. Pretty thorough, just missing Vision stopping Count Nefaria from flat out killing The Avengers the first time they fought.

 

[Bud Bundy]

They say this is the list that Bendis did to reverse engineer the ramifications of Hank Pym being killed.




Come on, breh. You REALLY expect me to believe that Bendis did THAT much research? fukk outta heeerrrreeeeeeee


As a comics history fan, that IS a cool list to read through, though. Pretty thorough, just missing Vision stopping Count Nefaria from flat out killing The Avengers the first time they fought.

why not?

dude is as much of a comic book fan as you or me. (though he prob had some poor marvel intern do it).

I do not get the hate for bendis? shyt he brought a black man to forefront of marvel comics (who really took luke cage serious). Made ultimate spiderman black and hispanic. And had a hand in making the avengers the powerhouse it is today.

 

[Bigbigguy]

why not?

dude is as much of a comic book fan as you or me. (though he prob had some poor marvel intern do it).

I do not get the hate for bendis? shyt he brought a black man to forefront of marvel comics (who really took luke cage serious). Made ultimate spiderman black and hispanic. And had a hand in making the avengers the powerhouse it is today.

Me neither he always gives tries to diversify his books I would have expected dudes on here to appreciate that

 

[Jack Martinez]

Young Avengers such a HUGE disappointment.

Such a hardbody squad with interesting characters

Loki
Ms. America
Captain Marvel aka Novarr
Wiccan
Hulkling

They first arc is them fighting aliens who melt.

 

[Jack Martinez]

why not?

dude is as much of a comic book fan as you or me. (though he prob had some poor marvel intern do it).

I do not get the hate for bendis? shyt he brought a black man to forefront of marvel comics (who really took luke cage serious). Made ultimate spiderman black and hispanic. And had a hand in making the avengers the powerhouse it is today.

As much flak as Bendis gets, he did dust off tha Avengers and made them

Marvel's franchise team.

 

[Spidey Man]

As much flak as Bendis gets, he did dust off tha Avengers and made them

Marvel's franchise team.

Plus his daredevil run was the best since Miller.

 

[Dirty Mcdrawz]

i think bendis get's flak because has a certain style and voice that goes well street level heroes and villains. it's when he starts writing for the bigger characters that his style becomes .......imo of course.

 

[Jello Biafra]

Bendis gets flack because his writing on Avengers is shytty.
I like Ultimate Spiderman, Powers is still good and his current X-Men stuff is much better than I expected it to be so far but the guy is only slightly less awful than Chuck Austen when it comes to writing the Avengers.
And so far his Guardians of the Galaxy is ass too.

 

[Mr. Negative]

Bendis gets flack because his writing on Avengers is shytty.
I like Ultimate Spiderman, Powers is still good and his current X-Men stuff is much better than I expected it >>>>>>>THATS CAUSE STUART IMMOMEN IS WRITING IT<<<<<<<< to be so far but the guy is only slightly less awful than Chuck Austen when it comes to writing the Avengers.
And so far his Guardians of the Galaxy is ass too.

his throwing away of characters histories, personality AND established continuity

his leading readers by the nose with extra decompressed storytelling and leading them.... nowhere

his shoehorning of his favorite characters whether they fit or not into his stories

the way critically acclaimed and extremely loved by the fans books tend to either get cancelled or their creative teams get fukked right when they start to get more shine than whatever he's working on (at least I know Hawkeye will be alright because it's an Avengers property)

The way you KNOW he P. Diddies books by giving a plot and letting the artist write the book while he gets top billing as the writer (of course he denies it. No I have no proof.)

Everything stops for a Bendis Event!!!!!



YES I will forever give him props for Ultimate Spidey, Powers and Daredevil.

NO I don't care if he uses black characters so they can "get some shine".

 

[Grifter]

Batman & Red Hood reunion

 

[ExodusNirvana]

Batman & Red Hood reunion

 

[Dirty Mcdrawz]

i never understood why these companies release comics that deal with the ramifications of big events when the big event hasn't even concluded yet.

Batman & Red Hood reunion

i guess that explains what's happening in red hood.

 

[FaygoMI]

As much flak as Bendis gets, he did dust off tha Avengers and made them

Marvel's franchise team.

Marvel not owning the X-Men movie rights made the Avengers Marvel's franchise team.