Essential The Official Comic Book Discussion Thread [Support @Neuromancer’s book!]

[nieman]

Also to add to what you said their are black superheros who deal with real world racism like Luke Cage , Black Panther, Falcon even more so when he became captain america. then there Nighthawk from supreme power and Blue Marvel it really is hard to take the fantasy racism the xmen deal with seriously when you have characters that exist in the same world as they exist in who deal with real world racism. I mean look at blue marvel his backstory was that he had to put a mask and pretend to be white in order not to scare white americans of all powerful blackman.

It still parallels the real world. Mutants are greeted with such hate, because they are so close to their neighbor. The people next door aren't superheroes. Most mutants aren't. They just want to live their lives, but you hate them because last week he didn't have powers, now he's blowing up ish. The X-Men are the mutants, so they get the hate because of what they represent. The other superheroes, no one cares.

It's the same as entertainers who dealt with that ish everywhere, but in theit respective fields. We don't like your kind, but you can play here, work here, entertain us...you just can't eat/sleep/loiter here. You see their name and think they're black or Muslim, so you hate them, until you find out they're white...then you made a mistake. Same in reverse, you never seen your neighbor but they have a traditional name, you've accepted gifts from them, the neighbor that youbdo know, brought a plate from new neighbor, with food you ate and loved. Then you find out they're black now you hate them. It's not the why, it's the matter of just knowing that someone is different that sparks the hatred, that justifies the X-World.

Better example, you love this person until you discover they're gay, now it's pitchfork time. Racism and prejudice makes no sense in the real world, so it fits the X-Men fine. Franklin Richards is a member of the F4, so he's loved...until it's known that he is a mutant. I can't wait until a writer tackles that story.

 

[voltronblack]

It still parallels the real world. Mutants are greeted with such hate, because they are so close to their neighbor. The people next door aren't superheroes. Most mutants aren't. They just want to live their lives, but you hate them because last week he didn't have powers, now he's blowing up ish. The X-Men are the mutants, so they get the hate because of what they represent. The other superheroes, no one cares.

It's the same as entertainers who dealt with that ish everywhere, but in theit respective fields. We don't like your kind, but you can play here, work here, entertain us...you just can't eat/sleep/loiter here. .

It funny their was A x-men team name x-statix that deal with that they got kill off it a real shame too X-Statix - Wikipedia

 

[TKOK]

Trust Mr sinister x-brehs.

 

[parallax]

It still parallels the real world. Mutants are greeted with such hate, because they are so close to their neighbor. The people next door aren't superheroes. Most mutants aren't. They just want to live their lives, but you hate them because last week he didn't have powers, now he's blowing up ish. The X-Men are the mutants, so they get the hate because of what they represent. The other superheroes, no one cares.

It's the same as entertainers who dealt with that ish everywhere, but in theit respective fields. We don't like your kind, but you can play here, work here, entertain us...you just can't eat/sleep/loiter here. You see their name and think they're black or Muslim, so you hate them, until you find out they're white...then you made a mistake. Same in reverse, you never seen your neighbor but they have a traditional name, you've accepted gifts from them, the neighbor that youbdo know, brought a plate from new neighbor, with food you ate and loved. Then you find out they're black now you hate them. It's not the why, it's the matter of just knowing that someone is different that sparks the hatred, that justifies the X-World.

Better example, you love this person until you discover they're gay, now it's pitchfork time. Racism and prejudice makes no sense in the real world, so it fits the X-Men fine. Franklin Richards is a member of the F4, so he's loved...until it's known that he is a mutant. I can't wait until a writer tackles that story.

but that removes outside factors. its not just your neighbors kid is a mutant, its the chance that your neighbors kids powers can get you or your kids hurt. you think his kid is harmless because he has a prehensile tail and apparently an van del waals grip, only for him to realize that it extends beyond his hands and he can grip and crush things from meters away. the difference between racism and bigotry between blacks and gays and hatred from mutants is that mutants come with literal powers. doesnt help that the xmen and magneto are the face of mutants and both have made varied threats to humanity as a whole, not just reavers and purifiers as well as house killers and put them on teams(and im not even talking somewhat reformed killers like wolverine, but active monsters like sabretooth and mystique) makes the fear they feel more than a bit logical

 

[Jello Biafra]

It still parallels the real world. Mutants are greeted with such hate, because they are so close to their neighbor. The people next door aren't superheroes. Most mutants aren't. They just want to live their lives, but you hate them because last week he didn't have powers, now he's blowing up ish. The X-Men are the mutants, so they get the hate because of what they represent. The other superheroes, no one cares.

It's the same as entertainers who dealt with that ish everywhere, but in theit respective fields. We don't like your kind, but you can play here, work here, entertain us...you just can't eat/sleep/loiter here. You see their name and think they're black or Muslim, so you hate them, until you find out they're white...then you made a mistake. Same in reverse, you never seen your neighbor but they have a traditional name, you've accepted gifts from them, the neighbor that youbdo know, brought a plate from new neighbor, with food you ate and loved. Then you find out they're black now you hate them. It's not the why, it's the matter of just knowing that someone is different that sparks the hatred, that justifies the X-World.

Better example, you love this person until you discover they're gay, now it's pitchfork time. Racism and prejudice makes no sense in the real world, so it fits the X-Men fine. Franklin Richards is a member of the F4, so he's loved...until it's known that he is a mutant. I can't wait until a writer tackles that story.

But you are just as likely to get bit by a radioactive hamster or discover an alien artifact in the woods that will give you powers.

The OG Nova used to have non-stop battles with super-villains and aliens in Hempstead, NY all on his neighbor's lawn and shyt.

The proximity to super-powered people is way too common for everyone in the Marvel U for that to be a special trigger for hating mutants.

 

[MenacingMonk]

Batman: Dark Knight, Dark City mini-review

This 3-issue story has been on my radar for a few months. I found 2/3 issues at a con a few months ago. I thought I bought them, but it turns out I left them on a box while going through other comics.

Anyways, I finally found all 3 issues scattered around in the cheap boxes recently (). The reason I wanted these issues is because it's the introduction to Barbatos. (Barbathos as he's called in these issues.) I want to to go back and read Metal, as well as some of Morrison's Batman issues that involve the demon, so this was a good starting point to read the backstory. Anyways, the story involves the Riddler putting Batman through the ringer. It's a pretty dark story. Very enjoyable from beginning to end. Milligan did a good job fleshing out the story, and at 3 issues it doesn't go overboard. Very good story. Verdict: 3.75/5.

 

[TNC]

I don't like it because it fundamentally makes no logical sense. In what world are humans aggrieved by people with superpowers going to differentiate between someone who's a mutant and someone who got their powers via cosmic accident? It stretches credibility and it lessens the whole concept of the X-Men in the process.

I don't think you are understanding the case behind it...

First of all, real world racism doesn't make logical sense, yet its a literal defining trait of some cultures and periods in world history.

Second, people hate and fear mutants because the resent and reject the fact that mutants are the next stage of humanity, outright invalidating humans. They are jealous and hateful because mutants existence is evidence of humanity's inferiority. Its like racist white guys hating and resenting black men for our physical strength and well endowments, it makes them feel inferior.

Third, humanity has increasingly been rejectful of superhumans as a whole in the Marvel Universe. The X-Men are hated, Spider-Man is hated, Hulk is hated, Thor and the Asguardians and even Captain America have been hated for periods, the only ones who really haven't are the Fantastic Four, who are off world half the time and the other half are inventing things to make human lives better. They like the USEFUL heroes, not all of them overall.

Fourth, humans dislike the idea of untrained and unknown mutants running around as loose cannons, sort of like white men feel about Arab/Muslim men. They look at them as a ticking time bomb that can go off any second and they can't adequately fight back. And given the fact that their own kids or neighbors could become one at the drop of a hat, produces visceral reactions.

 

[TNC]

That has always been my issue with the whole "hated by the world they have sworn to protect" thing with The X-Men.

People are scare of mutants powers which means the powers are the problem so why not be scared and hating on all the people with powers?
The Thing is roaming the streets looking like a monstrous nightmare.
Heroes like Thor claiming to be actual gods.
Motherfukking aliens from other planets flying around all willy nilly.
Artificial lifeforms being treated like tax-paying citizens and getting married to human women.
But a hot ass supermodel who can control the weather is who the world is going to want to save all their hate for?
That shyt just don't compute for me.

Majority of the Marvel heroes are not well liked. The only ones that are, are the ones that are celebrities that improve human life (Iron Man/FF) or government controlled (Cap, SHIELD).

 

[TNC]

Comparing the mutant hate to real life racism doesn't work either because racists are stupid yet we are supposed to believe that in the Marvel U the racists take the time to do their due diligence and make sure they are only hating mutants and not non-mutant superpowered people.
Now compare that to how after 9/11 racists were going after Sikhs and Indians because they were too ignorant to know they were not the same as the terrorists.

Its just like racists in the real world will "accept" the soft-shoe, tap dancing, submissive negro but not the ones that actually strive for something themselves. But also keep in mind, the Avengers are government managed and maintained. They are tolerated because of that.

 

[parallax]

Majority of the Marvel heroes are not well liked. The only ones that are, are the ones that are celebrities that improve human life (Iron Man/FF) or government controlled (Cap, SHIELD).

caps not govt controlled

 

[TNC]

caps not govt controlled

However the Avengers are

 

[Jello Biafra]

Majority of the Marvel heroes are not well liked. The only ones that are, are the ones that are celebrities that improve human life (Iron Man/FF) or government controlled (Cap, SHIELD).

Aside from Spider-Man and The Hulk, the rest of the heroes were damn near celebrities for much of Marvel's existence.

And Spider-Man was only unliked because he basically had a major newspaper spreading false propaganda against while The Hulk was legit feared/hated because he tended to destroy shyt whenever he showed up.

 

[Jello Biafra]

Its just like racists in the real world will "accept" the soft-shoe, tap dancing, submissive negro but not the ones that actually strive for something themselves. But also keep in mind, the Avengers are government managed and maintained. They are tolerated because of that.

The Avengers were intermittently under the purview of the US government and they were still popular and beloved during the times they weren't. They didn't take their first steps into working for the government until the 1980s.

 

[TNC]

Aside from Spider-Man and The Hulk, the rest of the heroes were damn near celebrities for much of Marvel's existence.

And Spider-Man was only unliked because he basically had a major newspaper spreading false propaganda against while The Hulk was legit feared/hated because he tended to destroy shyt whenever he showed up.

Well, this isn't entirely true. With the exception of the FF, who ARE celebrities and Reed basically makes society better through his inventions like Elon Musk x 1000, nearly every super hero went through a period or extended time where they were hated. Even Iron Man and Cap were outright wanted criminals by the government.

The X-Men too were loved when they first showed up, it wasn't till super villians started showing up rampantly that the public feeling changed and kept devolving. The X-Men obviously got the worst of it, mainly due to how rampant some of the evil mutants got, but let's not pretend Spider-Slayers weren't a thing or that Lt. Ross didn't make it his life mission to hunt The Hulk. We are talking 3/4s of the MU here.

Media and Propaganda definitely created a lot of the animosity but the public hating super heroes is not new to Marvel or unique to the X-Men.

 

[TNC]

The Avengers were intermittently under the purview of the US government and they were still popular and beloved during the times they weren't. They didn't take their first steps into working for the government until the 1980s.

The Avengers have been associated with the Marvel Government and World Government's ever since Black Panther became a member. In the 1970s, it was a major plot point for a while. Granted its been off and on, but they've always had the government or SHIELD right along side of them which has granted them a lot of room to work. Remember how much of a bad rap the Avengers got when it was "Cap's Kooky Quartet".

I get the point you are making, because the X-Men have experienced Nth levels of hatred, but they also have been completely opposed to government and their sanctions too, so of course they get the bad rap from the marvel media.