Essential The Official Boxing Random Thoughts Thread...All boxing heads ENTER.

[Newzz]

All I know is Shane said Canelo and Floyd hit about the same. That's all I need to know.

Floyd does have power though. He just doesnt sit down on all his punches and doesnt throw and land many power shots as Canelo does.


Getting hit by 7-8 power punches a round at a level 8 power (Floyd) or getting hit by 15-20 punches a round at a level 8 power (Canelo) is a big difference.

 

[InvictusAeternusEternus]

Canelo would wipe the floor with this version of Manny. It might have been a good fight with the Manny from 2-3 years ago though

 

[Newzz]

stopped reading right there. I may be totally wrong here and may not have seen these 2 fight as much as you have....but I have never seen evidence of this.

My computer keeps crashing.


It was supposed to be edited to say Canelo has about as much hand speed as Bradley. He's a little slower. My initial post was all raw thoughts. After I rethought it...I couldnt edit until just now.

 

[Newzz]

Canelo would wipe the floor with this version of Manny. It might have been a good fight with the Manny from 2-3 years ago though

I believe he'd KO Manny......but Manny would have to fight Canelo at at LEAST 152 lbs

 

[surv2syn]

Floyd does have power though. He just doesnt sit down on all his punches and doesnt throw and land many power shots as Canelo does.


Getting hit by 7-8 power punches a round at a level 8 power (Floyd) or getting hit by 15-20 punches a round at a level 8 power (Canelo) is a big difference.

you almost lost me for a min but still, your statement is misguided. getting hit by jabs to the face and sternum 20 x by Floyd in a round is worse unless those power punches are landing flush....for which someone would have to have horrible defense. no way he was landing on Trout like that.

those jabs tighten your back up and restricts movement as the fight goes on. ask Shane.

not sitting down on your punches has pros and cons. the con obviously is lack of power. the pro is....you can easily escape return fire. by Canelo sitting down on his punches, meant that he stood virtually no chance of getting away from Floyd's counters. against Manny it could be detrimental as Manny punches harder with committed combinations. it puts him in harms way too, but if I had to bet who would take a sustained beating in the fight...my money would be on Canelo.

 

[surv2syn]

Canelo would wipe the floor with this version of Manny. It might have been a good fight with the Manny from 2-3 years ago though

but couldnt mop the floor up with Trout

I think the JMM KO is fools gold for those thinking its easy to KO Manny with one punch. Manny got KOed by a punch he NEVER saw. Canelo dont have that kind of counter punching speed or accuracy. Canelo can certainly stop Manny with a body shot....no doubt about it. To the head is not going to be easy at all, in fact I just dont see it happening.

 

[Newzz]

you almost lost me for a min but still, your statement is misguided. getting hit by jabs to the face and sternum 20 x by Floyd in a round is worse unless those power punches are landing flush....for which someone would have to have horrible defense. no way he was landing on Trout like that.

those jabs tighten your back up and restricts movement as the fight goes on. ask Shane.

not sitting down on your punches has pros and cons. the con obviously is lack of power. the pro is....you can easily escape return fire. by Canelo sitting down on his punches, meant that he stood virtually no chance of getting away from Floyd's counters. against Manny it could be detrimental as Manny punches harder with committed combinations. it puts him in harms way too, but if I had to bet who would take a sustained beating in the fight...my money would be on Canelo.

I was not referencing the Trout fight.


You used Shane's thoughts on Floyd's vs Canelo's power.....so I used their fights as example.


Canelo Alvarez landed 252 power shots on Mosley which was at a 57% connection rate, plus 96 jabs at a 41% connect rate (overall 348 punches landed at 52% connection)
Mayweather landed 123 power shots on Mosley which was at a 46% connection rate, plus 85 jabs at a 40% connect rate (overall 208 punches landed at a 44% connection)


Canelo landed more power punches on Mosley than Floyd landed total punches (power + jabs) PERIOD on Mosley



That's why Mosley even compared his speed to Floyd's and was surprised at how fast he was in the ring:

"His defense was really good and he was really fast," said Mosley, who has won five titles in three divisions. "He can go a long ways. When the kids start to beat you, you might need to start going to promoting. I didn't expect him to be that fast or that good.

"He's up there with the top guys [I've faced]. Mayweather is fast, Cotto, all those guys I fought. He's up there with them."

Canelo Alvarez crushes Shane Mosley in decision - ESPN

Again, the main difference in Floyd's and Canelo's power is that Canelo hits you with MUCH more power shots during the course of the fight. That's not a knock on him or Floyd, because Floyd has power. He just lands only about 10 power punches a round while Canelo lands about 20 of em.


That causes the body to break down much faster against Canelo. If Floyd threw as many punches as Canelo did, he would KO many more fighters.


And Canelo throws TONS of body power shots throughout the course of the fight.

 

[Newzz]

but couldnt mop the floor up with Trout

I think the JMM KO is fools gold for those thinking its easy to KO Manny with one punch. Manny got KOed by a punch he NEVER saw. Canelo dont have that kind of counter punching speed or accuracy. Canelo can certainly stop Manny with a body shot....no doubt about it. To the head is not going to be easy at all, in fact I just dont see it happening.

If Bradley can rock Manny at this point of his career, you dont think Canelo can breh?


Canelo has more power and accuracy in his punches than Bradley. Plus he throws more punches and will land 4-5 punch combinations on you if you stand there like Manny was doing with Bradley.


No, he's not JMM type of counter puncher accuracy, but neither is Bradley and he still had Manny legs wobbly for a second.....with no power.

 

[InvictusAeternusEternus]

but couldnt mop the floor up with Trout

I think the JMM KO is fools gold for those thinking its easy to KO Manny with one punch. Manny got KOed by a punch he NEVER saw. Canelo dont have that kind of counter punching speed or accuracy. Canelo can certainly stop Manny with a body shot....no doubt about it. To the head is not going to be easy at all, in fact I just dont see it happening.

Trout is a legit 154 lber though. Canelo would outweigh Manny by damn near 20+ pounds and is a faster and much more talented boxer than the only other "big" fighter Manny fought in chetto

 

[surv2syn]

That's why Mosley even compared his speed to Floyd's and was surprised at how fast he was in the ring:

the only thing about that is....when Canelo face Floyd...the speed difference was apparent. people make the common mistake of overrating hand speed based on that alone. Oscar perfect example. Lighting fast hands but feet often looked like they were in quicksand and head movement was awful. Manny's foot speed is still top notch. Not what it used to be...but still above average.

 

[surv2syn]

If Bradley can rock Manny at this point of his career, you dont think Canelo can breh?

yes, he can, but its not as simple as power. has a lot to do with speed and style.

for instance.....big bad Jermain Taylor couldnt do shyt with Spinks (a fight I believe Spinks won)....a guy that Zab almost KOed in the 1st fight and finished the job in the 2nd.

 

[Newzz]

yes, he can, but its not as simple as power. has a lot to do with speed and style.

for instance.....big bad Jermain Taylor couldnt do shyt with Spinks (a fight I believe Spinks won)....a guy that Zab almost KOed in the 1st fight and finished the job in the 2nd.

Jermaine Taylor was never that good that breh, just hyped up. He was always a B fighter....which was the same as Spinks. And yes, Spinks won that fight. The Zab Judah that fought Cory Spinks was a better fighter than Jermaine Taylor as well.


However, I agree with the speed and style statement and I believe that Canelo's style is more suited to knock out Manny than Bradley's is. Canelo would stand and trade with Manny...that's what he does. I dont think Manny can win a "fire fight" with Canelo who will be much to big for him. Especially with the fact that Manny's chin has weakened due to age.


This is all hypothetical though, so it really doesnt matter


If they DO fight, we can revisit these breakdowns down the line

 

[Tide Run This]

Thanks for the list guys I wasn't in a sober state (still not ) i'll give him the list and let him look up some of the fighters. He's a casual fan so he really only knows of Marquez,Canelo and Chavez Jr at the moment. He used to stan Fernando Vargas back in high school he was from Oxnard so he was on his nuts big time. Only time I ever root for DLH was vs Vargas the Mexicans out in Cali were so pro Vargas I had to em with my DLH pompoms they wanted to jump a nikka the Monday after the fight.

 

[Yuzo]

where is this myth of canelo alvarez's power coming from?

 

[Tide Run This]

I was not referencing the Trout fight.


You used Shane's thoughts on Floyd's vs Canelo's power.....so I used their fights as example.


Canelo Alvarez landed 252 power shots on Mosley which was at a 57% connection rate, plus 96 jabs at a 41% connect rate (overall 348 punches landed at 52% connection)
Mayweather landed 123 power shots on Mosley which was at a 46% connection rate, plus 85 jabs at a 40% connect rate (overall 208 punches landed at a 44% connection)


Canelo landed more power punches on Mosley than Floyd landed total punches (power + jabs) PERIOD on Mosley



That's why Mosley even compared his speed to Floyd's and was surprised at how fast he was in the ring:




Again, the main difference in Floyd's and Canelo's power is that Canelo hits you with MUCH more power shots during the course of the fight. That's not a knock on him or Floyd, because Floyd has power. He just lands only about 10 power punches a round while Canelo lands about 20 of em.


That causes the body to break down much faster against Canelo. If Floyd threw as many punches as Canelo did, he would KO many more fighters.


And Canelo throws TONS of body power shots throughout the course of the fight.

Floyd's power is underrated probably most underrated in the sport right now. I always laugh at the ones who claims he "runs" during fights. I tell them most times I see him standing flush in middle of the right landing lasers for right hands on these much bigger fighters even walking them down at times. Floyd hasn't let the combos go on a consistent basis for years but these cats that get in the ring respect his power enough to keep them from rushing in. Let dummies like Skip Bayless tell it you would think Floyd hit like a feather. Floyd power underrated to me it's a shame his hands are so brittle if he was able and wanted to KO cats he would be getting crazy love even from the Mexicans and White folks in 2014.