The Infamous vs Death Certificate

[H.I.M.]

That doesn't mean they exactly doubled up, the sales are not updated they haven't updated since '95 you DO NOT KNOW how many copies of the album have been sold. You are going off numbers that are near 20 years old, Loud Records is also defunct which makes things complicated.

You claim the Infamous & HOE weren't able to be certified because LOUD went defunct... but it didn't until 2002. So based on your assertion, you'd have to accept that both albums sat on the shelves for 6-7 years without going platinum... while ATLiens went Platinum within a few months and was certified Double Platinum around the time LOUD was still active. Southernplayalistc went Platinum within a year.

Where are you getting that they stopped counting Mobb's record sales in '95?

BTW, wasn't the Infamous & HOE released on a joint label LOUD/RCA/BMG?

RCA & BMG are still active and certifying albums. So that alone destroys your theory.

Unless you can prove otherwise.

 

[Awesome Wells]

Both are on my list of favorite albums.

But DC is just next level music. I was a kid when I copped both, and I went crazy for The Infamous, but Death Certificate was like a damn life lesson while getting my ears changed for music as well.

 

[mobbinfms]

Let's put the certification argument to bed. This is what it says on the RIAA website. To get certified an audit has to be requested and paid for. It's a flat fee, plus travel expenses for the auditor. But the key point here is that the RIAA is not constantly examining the sales of every single record ever released to see if they can be certified gold or plat. When you're on a label that no longer exists (Mobb/Wu/Rae/Pac) or if you're album is well beyond its initial cycle - it stands to reason the label isn't gonna pay for certification. The whole thing sounds like a scam anyway.

RIAA - Recording Industry Association of America - May 29, 2014

@hexagram23 @ISOMELO @FreshAIG @The Ruler 09

 

[mobbinfms]

Anticipating where this is gonna go next - there doesn't appear to be a way for the general public to get soundscan information.

 

[mobbinfms]

False. "DC" came out in '91, "The Infamous" came out in '95. There was rap message boards in '93....there was zero rap message boards in '91. Less than half of 1% of the U.S. population had the internet in '91. The mid 90's the internet had started to explode. Obviously Youtube didn't exist back then, but rap fans using the internet grew right along side Mobb Deep's rise....which is why dumb shyt like "Youtube views" is even a factor in this discussion.

And no, Youtube views means absolutely nothing. Again, look at my Wu-Tang comparison. Or, "1st Of The Month" has 3.5 million views, slightly more than "Survival Of The Fittest"....who in their right mind would argue these songs are equally well known? One is off an album that struggled to go gold, one is off a 4x plat seller.



Because Mobb Deep wasn't even that big while NY was on top....the fukk makes you people think they're big now, over seas?

Fred.

93!!! That's crazy. You know this issue popped up in another thread and I looked it up. There were 16 million internet users in 95. Worldwide.

In any event - I don't see any correlation between that and the YouTube views. How are you extrapolating that because rap forums were around in 95, that the people on those forums would be more likely to view Infamous videos as opposed to DC? More likely to the tune of millions and millions. That's a huge reach.

Why do you keep repeating that Mobb Deep struggled to go gold? What is your definition of struggling to go gold?

You seem to be taking the position that the popularity of an album is set in stone for all perpetuity based on album sales from the initial album cycle. I.e. First of the Month was far far more popular in 95 so it will continue to be far far more popular forever. Is that what you're saying? If so, how do you account for an album like Illmatic which failed to go gold in its album cycle but is undoubtedly bigger than DC, Infamous and even E.99 now?

The only way that YouTube views would mean nothing is if people didn't have the ability to select the video they wanted to watch (of course not the case) or if the views were cooked. Now I've heard that views are cooked for artists coming out now, but it seems unlikely that that would be the case for all of the other examples listed.

So it has to mean something. There could be a million reasons why the views are the way they are and perhaps the real reason is something totally unrelated to the popularity of the two albums NOW, but neither of us knows for sure.

All that said, I'm no YouTube expert so there could be something significant I don't know about.

Finally - people on here complain all the time about Bone being erased from the history books - so them having 3.5 million views for their second biggest song would t surprise me. Bone has receded in prominence over the years.

Finally - with the overseas stuff - are you saying I'm wrong about Japan and Europe? You didn't actually respond to what I said.

 

[mobbinfms]

Thank you. Anyone mentioning Youtube is retarded. There's songs out now that are from albums that didn't even sell 100,000 copies that have 10 million views, and songs that were huge billboard hits that don't even have a million. Means nothing.

View counts will definitely be heavily weighted towards newer shyt. It's kind of like my iTunes play count in that regard.

 

[mobbinfms]

The fact that the Youtube view numbers are all over the place for the artists you listed should be a big ass clue there's no kind of rhyme or reason to them.

And no....I've yet to see anybody other than Mobb Deep stans say they "stopped updating their sales". I've never heard that in my life. By that logic I could sit here and say "oh, they stopped updating Cube's numbers, DC went diamond".

Mobb Deep has one plat album in their entire discography. That's it. The only place Mobb Deep is bigger than Cube is inside your mind.

You're delusional. There's no nice way to put it. You say things that are impossible to prove....they stopped updating their sales....you know hip-hop heads world-wide. shyt is retarded. They stopped updating sales for ALL their albums?

Let's say you do know hip-hop heads world-wide....there's 7 billion people on the planet, it's meaningless. There's no way you know enough people for that to matter either way.

Factually, Mobb Deep never sold anywhere near as much as Cube. They weren't even a top tier group in NY, when NY was on top. They were never a Wu or BIG or Nas type group. They were B-list, selling gold when the others were multi-plat.

Cube was an A-list artist on his coast and nation-wide when "DC" dropped. Hell, he was big before that off the strength of "Straight Outta Compton". Cube going solo....merely going solo....received more attention than Mobb Deep did in their entire career. I have no idea what year you got into rap but comparing Cube to Mobb Deep is like comparing 50 Cent circa '04 to Rick Ross at any point in his career. Not necessarily sales wise, I mean mainstream buzz and over all popularity. For you to not know that, you either got into rap well after '91, or were severely sheltered from anything non-NY related until the mid 90's.

Fred.

What about his examples is all over the place? Again, unless clips are randomly being played - of course their is some rhyme or reason to it.

Updating sales isn't accurate - that barcode is still being monitored by soundscan (I assume). But the certifications aren't automated. I posted a link from the RIAA explaining how it works.

There seems to be a huge disconnect here. No one is saying Cube wasn't bigger or DC didn't sell more records back in the day. But that doesn't necessarily ensure that DC will always be "bigger" than Infamous. Look to the Illmatic example. We should only being talking about now.

 

[The Ruler 09]

What about his examples is all over the place? Again, unless clips are randomly being played - of course their is some rhyme or reason to it.

Updating sales isn't accurate - that barcode is still being monitored by soundscan (I assume). But the certifications aren't automated. I posted a link from the RIAA explaining how it works.

There seems to be a huge disconnect here. No one is saying Cube wasn't bigger or DC didn't sell more records back in the day. But that doesn't necessarily ensure that DC will always be "bigger" than Infamous. Look to the Illmatic example. We should only being talking about now.

Your posts are explaining very well what people are failing to grasp, or refusing to lol.

 

[mobbinfms]

How many of you remember this commercial from 95'? It was getting much airplay in NYC(possibly other regions) because The Infamous was that hot back then.

Man - what an awful commercial! Even the Shook Ones instrumental couldn't save that from being extra girly.

 

[mobbinfms]

Dudes in here being revisionist simple as that. Using RIAA plaques to try and say what's hot and what's not. Like they now anything about the certification process, as if the RIAA is at all consistent in updating especially in hip hop for the most part.

The Infamous and Hell On Earth are not certified Platinum, yet to think they haven't sold a million to this day is ignorant as hell given that these albums are critically acclaimed, certified classics that went Gold in months.

My best guess would be that Infamous passed a million after Murda Muzik was released.

 

[ISO]

You claim the Infamous & HOE weren't able to be certified because LOUD went defunct... but it didn't until 2002. So based on your assertion, you'd have to accept that both albums sat on the shelves for 6-7 years without going platinum... while ATLiens went Platinum within a few months and was certified Double Platinum around the time LOUD was still active. Southernplayalistc went Platinum within a year.

Where are you getting that they stopped counting Mobb's record sales in '95?

BTW, wasn't the Infamous & HOE released on a joint label LOUD/RCA/BMG?

RCA & BMG are still active and certifying albums. So that alone destroys your theory.

Unless you can prove otherwise.

BMG is also defunct, also again if you think an album that went Gold in 2 months still hasn't gone Platinum 20 years later your crazy there's no point in arguing if you believe that. I just showed you Rae's SoundScan numbers from years ago that had Cuban Linx at over 1.1 million sales, yet the RIAA has it as only a a Gold certified album.

Look at mobbinfms posts where he's talking about how RIAA certification works. It's really not that difficult to understand

Anticipating where this is gonna go next - there doesn't appear to be a way for the general public to get soundscan information.

You have to subscribe to SoundScan and request and pay money for the report it's a process.

 

[FaTaL]

you nikkas are still arguing?

you guys are literally

 

[H.I.M.]

BMG is also defunct, also again if you think an album that went Gold in 2 months still hasn't gone Platinum 20 years later your crazy there's no point in arguing if you believe that. I just showed you Rae's SoundScan numbers from years ago that had Cuban Linx at over 1.1 million sales, yet the RIAA has it as only a a Gold certified album.

Look at mobbinfms posts where he's talking about how RIAA certification works. It's really not that difficult to understand

You have to subscribe to SoundScan and request and pay money for the report it's a process.

Still had two albums that sat on the shelf for nearly a decade without going platinum, while Outkast went Platinum in a few months

Still were peons in the 90's compared to Outkast and about at least a dozen other groups

And STILL have produced no evidence of The Infamous or HOE ever moving 1 million units... but yet easily produced evidence of Raekwon moving a Milli

 

[ISO]

Still had two albums that sat on the shelf for nearly a decade without going platinum, while Outkast went Platinum in a few months

Still were peons in the 90's compared to Outkast and about at least a dozen other groups

And STILL have produced no evidence of The Infamous or HOE ever moving 1 million units... but yet easily produced evidence of Raekwon moving a Milli

The only reason Rae's numbers are out is because of an Only Built 4 Cuban Linx II article. I've been trying to find Mobb's numbers but to no avail. If Rae sold a million so did Mobb. You sound dumb as hell breh and are being revisionist.

 

[hex]

Let's put the certification argument to bed. This is what it says on the RIAA website. To get certified an audit has to be requested and paid for. It's a flat fee, plus travel expenses for the auditor. But the key point here is that the RIAA is not constantly examining the sales of every single record ever released to see if they can be certified gold or plat. When you're on a label that no longer exists (Mobb/Wu/Rae/Pac) or if you're album is well beyond its initial cycle - it stands to reason the label isn't gonna pay for certification. The whole thing sounds like a scam anyway.

RIAA - Recording Industry Association of America - May 29, 2014

@hexagram23 @ISOMELO @FreshAIG @The Ruler 09

I already knew all that. I've explained this in other threads, you can search the site for it.

This kills your whole argument. That's the funny part. You're acting like this only applies to Mobb Deep. Factually we know 'kast debut and "DC" outsold "The Infamous" by at least 500,000. It's on RIAA.

So if "DC" and 'kast is certified platinum....and Mobb Deep is certified gold....Mobb Deep would have to sell 500,000+ just to be equal, if both of those completely stopped selling. Which obviously didn't happen, using your own logic.

So....what are you talking about? Anything you can say about "oh, they stopped counting Mobb Deep sales!" can be applied to Outkast and Cube as well. The difference is we know for a fact Mobb Deep was far behind both of them.

Fred.