The Cavs Andrew Wiggins/Kevin Love Dilemma*Update* Deal is finalized

[Eye Cue DA COLI GAWD]

He's gonna be 3rd option at best. He's not gonna have to create his own offense. The defense won't be able to key on him. The flaws that are being glossed over are Love's. A PF that gives you nothing on terms of defense on the interior and isn't really a post up threat on offense. He's a less athletic, less durable, superior rebounding Chris Bosh. None of the "they gotta get Love so they can start rattling off titles right now" crowd has explained to me how a team featuring Kyrie and Love without an elite rim protector stops anyone. Wiggins may or may not pan out but at the very least they would still have options and flexibility. They don't even need him to be the superstar he was predicted to be. Love on the other hand would need to be Tim Duncan circa 02 for this deal to be worth it.

Love on the Cavs immediately makes them a better team than Wiggins on the Cavs.

That's a fact. Don't even know who would argue against that.

So all you Wiggins supporters are basically hanging your hat on projections. You sit here today and know Love makes the Cavs an immediately better team, so of course you're going to hype Wiggins regardless if its true or not. You don't have a baseline to really have a honest debate which is why you dudes keep talking about Wiggins supposed elite defensive abilities.

The fact is he's only 19. Even he turns out to be the player you all think he will be, it will take years for that to happen. Understand that... there is no guarantee he turns into the player you think he is, and even if he does turn into that player, it definitely won't happen for 3-5 years.

If I'm LeBron, why would I allow my career in my 30s to be leveraged on that when I could be playing with a great player right now who also makes my team immediately more likely to win a championship?

 

[Eye Cue DA COLI GAWD]

You really think they're going to stop at Tristan and Wiggins? Especially since Tristan is due for an extension soon, the filler will be Waiters or Bennett, not salary.

That's what negotiations are for. I'm banking on them not trading both Wiggins and Waiters together.

We will see.

 

[tremonthustler1]

Hmm...How much did he give up on average however.

He still sucked on D but that wasn't what was brought up.

Love had a ridiculous usage rate last year because Rick ran the offense through Love (a bad idea), which is also why for someone who loves to point fingers, Love never ripped Adelman

 

[BStapies]

What's the deadline for the cavs to sign wiggins?

After he signed they can't trade him for 30 days

 

[Malta]

That's what negotiations are for. I'm banking on them not trading both Wiggins and Waiters together.

We will see.

If they fold on trading Wiggins, they will fold on trading whoever else the Wolves want, because the underlying theme is "You have to get Love!" and it appears to be at all costs.

You simply want them to trade players you don't like and then play hardball and retain the guys you do like (Waiters) while getting back another asset in return (Dieng).

 

[Illeye buckmatic]

That's what negotiations are for. I'm banking on them not trading both Wiggins and Waiters together.

We will see.

Is Wiggy your new struggle cuts breh

 

[jaguar paw]

Would you rather have 65% of your cap tied in Kyrie Tristan (up for an ext in '15) Varejao (up for re-up in '16)?

Your argument is weak because Kyrie and LeBron make up 50% of the cap by themselves.

End of the day you win with a Love over Tristan + Wiggins + filler

Kyrie and LeBron don't make up 50 percent of the cap yet. They will be over 50 percent of the cap in 2015 once Kyrie's extension kicks in. Add Love into the equation and you will be around 90 percent of the cap.

The better plan is to develop what you currently have and bring in 3 veterans that will help improve a young team's learning curve. See what doesn't fit and where they need more help later on down the line.

Keeping the flexibility is key and making a panic pubic perception trade is where a lot of organizations make the wrong turn.

Kevin Love doesn't need the ball in his hands to be effective. He averaged 20/15 while Kurt Rambis refused to draw up plays for him

Note that I said to be at his best.

 

[Eye Cue DA COLI GAWD]

If they fold on trading Wiggins, they will fold on trading whoever else the Wolves want, because the underlying theme is "You have to get Love!" and it appears to be at all costs.

You simply want them to trade players you don't like and then play hardball and retain the guys you do like (Waiters) while getting back another asset in return (Dieng).

No... the Wolves are on record saying they want Wiggins.

Cavs haven't offered Wiggins.

So I'm left to assume if the Cavs offered Wiggins instead of Waiters that the Wolves would take it.

Now if they want Bennett + picks along with Wiggins, they gotta give me Dieng as well.

Not really hard here.

 

[Eye Cue DA COLI GAWD]

Is Wiggy your new struggle cuts breh

Yes, his nickname is TWiggins, thank you very much

 

[Illeye buckmatic]

Yes, his nickname is TWiggins, thank you very much

 

[Malta]

No... the Wolves are on record saying they want Wiggins.

Cavs haven't offered Wiggins.

So I'm let to assume if the Cavs offered Wiggins I stead of Waiters that the Wolves would take it.

Now if they want Bennett + picks along with Wiggins, they gotta give me Dieng as well.

Not really hard here.

No, that's what you think because you value and like Bennett over Tristan, reality is Tristan is due for an extension soon and I doubt they want to give him one, so they then demand Waiters or Bennett.

The Wolves are in the drivers seat the second the Cavs cave and offer up Wiggins, you'll either get a shytty salary back from them, or you'll have to give up even more if you want a Love/Dieng package.

 

[FTBS]

Love on the Cavs immediately makes them a better team than Wiggins on the Cavs.

That's a fact. Don't even know who would argue against that.

So all you Wiggins supporters are basically hanging your hat on projections. You sit here today and know Love makes the Cavs an immediately better team, so of course you're going to hype Wiggins regardless if its true or not. You don't have a baseline to really have a honest debate which is why you dudes keep talking about Wiggins supposed elite defensive abilities.

The fact is he's only 19. Even he turns out to be the player you all think he will be, it will take years for that to happen. Understand that... there is no guarantee he turns into the player you think he is, and even if he does turn into that player, it definitely won't happen for 3-5 years.

If I'm LeBron, why would I allow my career in my 30s to be leveraged on that when I could be playing with a great player right now who also makes my team immediately more likely to win a championship?

Does he make them a lock to win a title right away as people are suggesting? That's the only way you trade all those young pieces and tie yourself into 3 dudes like that. Wiggins doesn't have to be great for keeping him to be worth it. Love has to be prime Duncan for sacrificing all depth and flexibility to be worth it. The thing about it is it's not just Love vs. Wiggins. It's Love vs. all those young assets. If Love gets hurt you got Kyrie, Bron and some MLE, vet minimum type dudes. If Wiggins gets hurt you still got a bunch of young assets to step in. And there are other trade possibilities for said assets. The defense piece has been referenced (and ignored ) numerous times as well.

 

[tremonthustler1]

Kyrie and LeBron don't make up 50 percent of the cap yet. They will be over 50 percent of the cap in 2015 once Kyrie's extension kicks in. Add Love into the equation and you will be around 90 percent of the cap.

The better plan is to develop what you currently have and bring in 3 veterans that will help improve a young team's learning curve. See what doesn't fit and where they need more help later on down the line.

Keeping the flexibility is key and making a panic pubic perception trade is where a lot of organizations make the wrong turn.



Note that I said to be at his best.

His 20/15 season WAS Love at his best

 

[Malta]

The "filler" everyone is talking about adding into the Love trade would be Brendan Haywood's contract, and trading it now would also be absurd. For next season it's worth $2.2 million, however next summer it gets bumped up to $10 million of which 100% of it is non-guaranteed, so basically you want to trade young players on favorable contracts, then throw in a massive trade chip before it even turns into gold.

The Cavs could literally sign a center next summer in the $8 million range, then turn around and trade one of the players you want them to trade right now + Haywood's contract for a player on a max contract. Just no foresight at all...

 

[tremonthustler1]

Side note: Haywood making $10 mil next year. Long live the hustle