The Birth of a Nation (Official Thread)

FruitOfTheVale

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Europe may be the home but Slavery in America is the origin of White Supremacy Mentality and Systems that still affect Blacks till this day. It's that state of mind that we are property and less than human that lead to the very creation of systems and the horrible treatment we still endure. Through witnessing the different burtality on the planations, Nat Turner begain to see not only the hypocracy but the mentality of that hypocracy. Through scripture he was also able to tie in spiritualty that his crusade was one of justice because the Slave Masters were using scipture to justify torture. The Black Angel represented that conformation that he made the right choice.

Yes, Nat saw the hypocrisy of their actions not aligning with the bible that they supposedly believed in. The film does a good job of highlighting this hypocrisy. As far as the mentality of that hypocrisy as you called it, though, at what point in the film did you feel that the film actively drew the viewer's attention to the mentality? Whether or not Nat recognized the mentality behind the hypocrisy to be an ideology the slave owners actively practiced more deeply than they practiced Christianity is not explicitly addressed in the film. It is implied in the film but never directly addressed.

My issue with this is that it somewhat narrows the meaning of the rebellion. This was indeed an ideological war but not one about scripture. The film dwells a lot on the hypocrisy of the way religion is used to subjugate the slaves but it doesn't paint as clear of a picture of the level of craziness that underpinned white supremacist beliefs. IMO it dangerously leaves room for the interpretation that the rebellion is grounded in the idea of divine retribution, revenge and bloodthirst when really it was the most logical choice given the circumstances. You can't reason with insanity and the most tightly held beliefs of that white population are literally crazy.
 

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Saw it two days ago, I'll post my thoughts.

Honestly I was a little disappointed with the film. The acting is solid throughout and the production quality is solid throughout but the film itself lacks the level of substance I was expecting. The main question in my head after I watched it was, "Who is this film supposed to be directed at?" Looking at the film's namesake and what "Birth of a Nation" represents in this country, I pictured this film having a lot more to say about the mentality of the white society that not only permitted chattel slavery but endorsed it.

I'll backtrack a little bit to make another point. IMO slavery films in general are by definition targeted at white people. The horror of slavery is not old - let alone new - to black folks here in America. White people have been raised to forget what these films (supposedly) aim to make them remember and confront. That being said, Nate Parker's Birth of a Nation suffers the same problem as the other slavery films (12 Years a Slave, Django, etc.) that came out in the last 20 years. The only way these films understand how to communicate with their intended (white) audience is through violence. The emotional set-pieces of Nate Parker's film are almost all predicated on extreme acts of violence committed by slave owners on their slaves.

My problem with violence being the driving plot device in this film is that the violence is a symptom of the mindset that empowers these slave owners to act this way. The mindset is the root problem, not the violence. When a white audience watches a film like this one, the only thing they are being forced to confront is the barbarity of the violence. A white person can watch this film and genuinely cringe at the violence while thinking in the back of their head, "we've come a long way from this."

But what about the barbarity of the slave owner's mindset? Have we come a long way from that? The original Birth of a Nation was released a full 70 years - a lifetime - after emancipation. What is the difference between the mindset on display in that film and that of a slave owner? There isn't one. What was the difference between the mindset on display in Jim Crow and the mindset on display in slavery? There wasn't one. My point being... What is the difference between the white mindset of 2016 and the white mindset of 1916? This film took on the burden of addressing that question when it took on the namesake and imo it failed to address it.

The narrative construction is a big part of where the film lost power... Nate Parker's performance is good but the choice to make him the singular focus of the film AND make the violence the focus of the film was a poor choice imo. Nat Turner did not rebel because he witnessed unspeakable violence, he rebelled because he saw that the mentality that enabled slavery was a chronic disease that could not be treated with sermon. The elephant in the room is that the white slave owners are sick but they can't (and don't want to) see that...

... The same way the white audience in the movie theater can't and doesn't want to see it either.
@Golden
 

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Great movie.
Top notch acting.
I felt like they could have developed the characters outside of Nat and his wife a little bit more.
I felt like their wasn't a white male savior but although the movie, it had a sympathetic white woman and I can't say that's accurate. White women were as much an issue as their men.
Nate Parker acted extremely well. Extremely well. I thought he was Nat Turner the entire time.
Nat is an African hero and a proud one nonetheless.
I have to agree with @FruitOfTheVale but I really enjoyed the film for what it is.
 

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Weekend Box Office Results for October 14-16, 2016 - Box Office Mojo

12.3 Million for "Birth of a Nation". Here's a lesson in Box Office and proof of the media bias. This weekend Ben Affleck's film "The Accountant" was released. It comes in at #1 with 24 Million OW. It's budget is 45 Million. No talks of Flop. Last weeks #1 "Girl of the Train" dropped hard but has now made 1 million over it's 45 Million Budget though wiht 46 Million. "Masterminds" came out a few weeks ago it has Zack G from "Hangover" Owen Wilson and Kristen Wiig from "Braidsmaids". It has only grossed 16 Million in two weeks, no talks of flop.

As I said last week both Tim Burton and Mark Walhburg's films are struggling to make their 100+ Million budget back. Now Denzel and Tom Hanks are both doing good as "Mag 7" and "Sully" are still going strong. Kevin Hart came out strong with 11 Million for "What Now" off a 9.9 Million Budget. Plus comedy stand up films only make so much. Lastly the Kid sci fil film "Max Steel" bombed badly making less than even "Birth of a Nation" this weekend. So you have all these major hollywood releases barely performing yet "Birth of a Nation" was touted as one of the Biggest Flops of the Year and it's made it's budget back and is headed for 20+ Million Domestic which is 3x's it Budget.
 
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you're NOT "n!ggas"

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I gotta watch it again but did anyone else get the underlying sense that Nat became a non-believer over the course of the film and used Christianity to spark the rebellion? I got my reasons for saying this but let's just be real: White "masters" had him preach to pacify the slaves, right? He used that same power of religion to turn against them, the other slaves probably would have never rebelled if he hadn't told them it was a message from God.
 

Birnin Zana

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I gotta watch it again but did anyone else get the underlying sense that Nat became a non-believer over the course of the film and used Christianity to spark the rebellion? I got my reasons for saying this but let's just be real: White "masters" had him preach to pacify the slaves, right? He used that same power of religion to turn against them, the other slaves probably would have never rebelled if he hadn't told them it was a message from God.

I didn't see that way. From my perspective, he leaned into the word more and more as time went on. The Nat from the beginning of the movie, for example, would've not baptized that white man.
 

Birnin Zana

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Weekend Box Office Results for October 14-16, 2016 - Box Office Mojo

12.3 Million for "Birth of a Nation". He's a lesson in Box Office and proof of the media bias. This weekend Ben Affleck's film "The Accountant" was released. It comes in at #1 with 24 Million OW. It's budget is 45 Million. No talks of Flop. Last weeks #1 "Girl of the Train" dropped hard but has now made 1 million over it's 45 Million Budget though wiht 46 Million. "Masterminds" came out a few weeks ago it has Zack G from "Hangover" Owen Wilson and Kristen Wiig from "Braidsmaids". It has only grossed 16 Million in two weeks, no talks of flop.

As I said last week both Tim Burton and Mark Walhburg's films are struggling to make their 100+ Million budget back. Now Denzel and Tom Hanks are both doing good as "Mag 7" and "Sully" are still going strong. Kevin Hart came out strong with 11 Million for "What Now" off a 9.9 Million Budget. Plus comedy stand up films only make so much. Lastly the Kid sci fil film "Max Steel" bombed badly making less than even "Birth of a Nation" this weekend. So you have all these major hollywood releases barely performing yet "Birth of a Nation" was touted as one of the Biggest Flops of the Year and it's made it's budget back and is headed for 20+ Million Domestic which is 3x's it Budget.

One thing I noticed: Box office Mojo lists Birth's budget as $8.5 million. If that's the case, then it absolutely was never even a flop at all.

Media bias, as you mentioned.
 

valet

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I gotta watch it again but did anyone else get the underlying sense that Nat became a non-believer over the course of the film and used Christianity to spark the rebellion? I got my reasons for saying this but let's just be real: White "masters" had him preach to pacify the slaves, right? He used that same power of religion to turn against them, the other slaves probably would have never rebelled if he hadn't told them it was a message from God.
No, i think when he called them false prophets, it showed he knew that their christianity was false. Not that he became a non believer in christianity. The sign of the sky turning was proof to him that God was telling him it was time. He believed in God Christianity. Just not these false white slave masters version
 

Roland Coltrane

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I actually read Confessions of Nat Turner back in the day and the whole time I was like :what::stopitslime::scust: :martin:
and it turns out it was the fantasy of a cac playing on the same tired tropes and stereotypes.


any of you brehs know of any definitive books about Nat Turner, preferably written by black authors? :patrice:
 

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Because of work schedule I wasn't able to see it last week but I took the wife out and saw it last night. First thing I noticed was this is a pretty busy movie theater, and there was a total of 5 people in there. But I think it'll be packed with black women and church folks to see madea's new movie next week but I digress.

Overall I thought the movie was good, it wasn't great because I didn't think Nat's cohesive plan was really put in depth. Another scene that caught my eye was when he was in the bushes and his wife said they were just going plantation to plantation killing blacks just because they were angry. Which historians have said is true that after the slave rebellion things got even worse for blacks but it's hard to imagine but I guess it did.

Don't know if it was overblown or not but it seems most plantation owners were having problems with their slaves rebelling and they used a black face to calm them down with the supposed teachings of god. No different than when black unarmed men are killed present day, you have preachers quoting MLK and saying let god deal with it

Again it was a pretty good movie.
 

satam55

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I actually read Confessions of Nat Turner back in the day and the whole time I was like :what::stopitslime::scust: :martin:
and it turns out it was the fantasy of a cac playing on the same tired tropes and stereotypes.


any of you brehs know of any definitive books about Nat Turner, preferably written by black authors? :patrice:
You read this?:
 
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