Tarantino Says Marvel actors aren’t movie stars: ‘Captain America Is the Star,’ Not Chris Evans

[Xyrax]

All the other shyt aside.

Its wild how much the MCU movies success has mfers in their feelings. Both people in the film industry, and the wild fans/haters. shyt has everyone dialed up to 11 with over the top opinions.

Never would have thought shyt would go this way back at that first mid Hulk movie. But look at this shyt now. People cannot go near a microphone without offering their 2 cents about these movies.

 

[Tasha And]

All the other shyt aside.

Its wild how much the MCU movies success has mfers in their feelings. Both people in the film industry, and the wild fans/haters. shyt has everyone dialed up to 11 with over the top opinions.

Never would have thought shyt would go this way back at that first mid Hulk movie. But look at this shyt now. People cannot go near a microphone without offering their 2 cents about these movies.

They keep getting asked about it.

 

[Scustin Bieburr]

And this is what a lot of Hollywood/salty directors refuse, or are too out of touch, to accept

A movie really has to justify the trip and money spent. Scorcese called Marvel movies theme park rides as a slick pejorative but them shyts made nikkas wanna hop in the ride and do the whole expensive ass moviegoing experience. The Irishman wasn't going to do that

And Tarantino's been salty ever since he lost Christmas to Star Wars

You see it. Very few people are interested in spending substantial money to sit in a theater and watch a slow drama. It's not a coincidence that the movies doing best in the theaters are action and horror movies. That shyt hits different with dolby atmos and people screaming and gasping in the theater. Those genuine reactions.

I've never been in a theater more hyped than when them two avengers movies dropped. When black panther came out of the portal with the whole army the whole theater lost it. I felt like I was having a genuine communal experience.

I'm not going to get that in a 3hr movie about an old cac saying the n word every five minutes

 

[TEH]

fukk Tarantino

Racist cock sucking pos

Mad that those movies don’t say ****** 15 thousand times

 

[Satsui no Hadou]

Old movies are better any way.







These are films that actually had a substantial
Impact on cinema. Without Kurosawa there would have been no Clint Eastwood spaghetti westerns, for example.

 

[Tasha And]

Very few people are interested in spending substantial money to sit in a theater and watch a slow drama. It's not a coincidence that the movies doing best in the theaters are action and horror movies. That shyt hits different with dolby atmos and people screaming and gasping in the theater. Those genuine reactions.

I've seen this mentioned several times in this thread but I think this is missing what the criticism is. It's not that slow boring dramas should be making all of the money at the box office, it's that the box office is now pretty much just MCU or MCU wannabes, remakes, and franchise sequels, with barely anything else moving the needle. This wasn't always the case.

Pull out a random year at the box office in the 90s and look at the top grossing movies.

1998

1. Armageddon - Action Disaster movie (Disney)
2. Saving Private Ryan - WW2 war movie (Dreamworks)
3. Godzilla - Kaiju monster movie (TriStar)
4. There's Something About Mary - Rom Com (20th Century Fox)
5. A Bug's Life - Computer Animated (Disney)
6. Mulan - 2D Animated (Disney)
7. Doctor Dolittle - Family comedy (20th Century Fox)
8. Shakespeare in Love - Period Romantic Dramedy (Miramax/Universal)
9. Lethal Weapon 4 - Franchise sequel (WB)
10. The Truman Show - Dramedy (Paramount)
11. Enemy of the State - Political Thriller (Disney)
12. You've Got Mail - Rom Com (WB)
13. The Mask of Zorro - Action Adventure (Sony)
14. Rush Hour - Buddy Cop (New Line Cinema)
15. Life is Beautiful - WW2 Dramedy (International)
16. The Prince of Egypt - 2D Animated (Dreamworks)
17. Patch Adams - Dramedy (Universal)
18. City of Angels - Romantic Fantasy (WB)
19. The Horse Whisperer - Western (Disney)
20. The Waterboy - Comedy (Disney)
21. The Man in the Iron Mask - Action Drama (MGM)
22. Antz - Computer Animated (Dreamworks)

Very little to any slow boring dramas. Only one sequel. 7 different studios in the top 10. 3 of the top 10 were nominated for Best Original Screenplay at the Oscars, 2 for Best Pic. Only a few attempts at building a franchise. Hits a bunch of different genres. And they put butts in seats.


Then compare it to the last box office before covid 2019

1. Avengers: Endgame - Franchise Sequel (Disney)
2. The Lion King - Animated Remake (Disney)
3. Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker - Franchise Sequel (Disney)
4. Frozen II - Franchise Sequel (Disney)
5. Toy Story 4 - Franchise Sequel (Disney)
6. Captain Marvel - Franchise spinof (Disney)
7. Spider-Man: Far From Home - Franchise Sequel (Disney)
8. Aladdin - Remake (Disney)
9. Joker - Comic Book Spinoff (WB)
10. Jumanji: The Next Level - Sequel (Columbia)
11. It Chapter Two - Sequel (WB)
12. Us - Horror film (Blumhouse/Universal)
13. Fast and Furious Presents: Hobbs and Show: Franchise spinoff (Universal)
14. John Wick: Chapter 3 - Parabellum - Franchise Sequel (Lionsgate)
15. Knives Out - Murder Mystery (Lionsgate)
16. How to Train Your Dragon: The Hidden World - Sequel (Paramount)
17. 1917 - WW1 (Dreamworks/Universal)
18. The Secret Life of Pets 2 - Sequel (Universal)
19. Pokemon Detective Pikachu - Franchise starter (WB)
20. Once Upon A Time in Hollywood - period dramedy (Sony)
21. Shazam - Franchise Spinoff (WB)
22. Maleficent: Mistress of Evil - Sequel (Disney)

17 of the 22 are sequels, remakes, or franchise spinoffs. The top 8 are all Disney.

Now there are arguments to be made that the diversity once seen at the box office is now reflected in streaming/TV content. And I'd say that is true. We entered into a golden age of TV some time ago. But it's not like the people mourning the loss of diversity in cinema are making up their complaints. You can see how people that loved the golden age of theaters, were formed or moved by those experiences, are looking at todays cinema and wishing there was room for more than sequels and remakes. It isn't the MCU's fault, but the MCU is the beneficiary of the industry changes, and the death of the mid budget blockbuster experience is the loser in all of this.

And it's not like QT is some bitter hasbeen who isn't popping. He's one of the few name directors, along with guys like Jordan Peele and Nolan that can still pack theaters for their original movies.

But movies like Rush Hour, Fight Club, Se7en, The Truman Show, and The Matrix probably wouldn't be greenlit as movies in 2022. They will be netflix or hulu shows going forward. For better or worse.

 

[Vandelay]

He's not knocking their performance. He's just saying that these roles aren't making them movie stars, the same way we had legitimate movie stars in the 80s, 90s, and even 2000's. They aren't even parlaying the massive success of their MCU fame into massive success outside of the MCU. Not to the extent that famous actors in yesteryear could. Some of these MCU actors are starring in straight to Netflix movies nobody has heard of when they aren't in a MCU flick.

Batman, Spiderman, and Superman have been played by a ton of actors, and will continue to be in the future, along with Ironman, Wolverine, Black Panther. People will have their favorite performances, like some folks prefer Michael Fassbenders Magneto to Ian Mckkellen, but the fact will remain that its the character that is the star....and this reality, which wasn't as strong when RDJ first blew up the role of Iron Man, is getting more pronounced by the year.

Movie stars used to be able to generate huge box office numbers on their names alone. People went to see the latest Arnold movie, or the latest Will Smith movie, or the latest Tom Cruise movie. It didn't really even matter what the movie was about, if it was original or based on something pre-existing. They just wanted to see their favorite movie stars in their next thing. And studios would greenlight movies based on the box office appeal of these stars. But that has shifted in the era of Marvel Studios and franchise film building.

Actually agree with your take. The irony is, under a different lens, I would just assume Tarantino would be for this. He's known for plucking actors from obscurity or purgatory and making them into stars.

My take is, Tarantino, Scorsese, Soderbergh et al are purists and aren't particularly happy with the direction film is going. I don't think it's a disdain for the actors, but the films themselves follow a very predictable, theme park ride format. Everything is interchangeable and takes very little to make much money once you have that formula; director, actor, story be damned.

The irony of this situation is Simu Li had a public rebuttal for Tarantino, but Shang Chi is exhibit A. It could've been a solid smaller story about family ties and martial arts, but they unnecessarily turned it into a goofy monster movie by the end it. If I was Simu, I wouldn't bite the hand that fed me, but I'd take Tarantino's criticism to heart and see what I could do to make sure my career didn't fall victim to that same fate.

 

[Grifter]

What about the stars that Marvel recruits for their films?

 

[O.Red]

I've seen this mentioned several times in this thread but I think this is missing what the criticism is. It's not that slow boring dramas should be making all of the money at the box office, it's that the box office is now pretty much just MCU or MCU wannabes, remakes, and franchise sequels, with barely anything else moving the needle. This wasn't always the case.

Pull out a random year at the box office in the 90s and look at the top grossing movies.

1998

1. Armageddon - Action Disaster movie (Disney)
2. Saving Private Ryan - WW2 war movie (Dreamworks)
3. Godzilla - Kaiju monster movie (TriStar)
4. There's Something About Mary - Rom Com (20th Century Fox)
5. A Bug's Life - Computer Animated (Disney)
6. Mulan - 2D Animated (Disney)
7. Doctor Dolittle - Family comedy (20th Century Fox)
8. Shakespeare in Love - Period Romantic Dramedy (Miramax/Universal)
9. Lethal Weapon 4 - Franchise sequel (WB)
10. The Truman Show - Dramedy (Paramount)
11. Enemy of the State - Political Thriller (Disney)
12. You've Got Mail - Rom Com (WB)
13. The Mask of Zorro - Action Adventure (Sony)
14. Rush Hour - Buddy Cop (New Line Cinema)
15. Life is Beautiful - WW2 Dramedy (International)
16. The Prince of Egypt - 2D Animated (Dreamworks)
17. Patch Adams - Dramedy (Universal)
18. City of Angels - Romantic Fantasy (WB)
19. The Horse Whisperer - Western (Disney)
20. The Waterboy - Comedy (Disney)
21. The Man in the Iron Mask - Action Drama (MGM)
22. Antz - Computer Animated (Dreamworks)

Very little to any slow boring dramas. Only one sequel. 7 different studios in the top 10. 3 of the top 10 were nominated for Best Original Screenplay at the Oscars, 2 for Best Pic. Only a few attempts at building a franchise. Hits a bunch of different genres. And they put butts in seats.


Then compare it to the last box office before covid 2019

1. Avengers: Endgame - Franchise Sequel (Disney)
2. The Lion King - Animated Remake (Disney)
3. Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker - Franchise Sequel (Disney)
4. Frozen II - Franchise Sequel (Disney)
5. Toy Story 4 - Franchise Sequel (Disney)
6. Captain Marvel - Franchise spinof (Disney)
7. Spider-Man: Far From Home - Franchise Sequel (Disney)
8. Aladdin - Remake (Disney)
9. Joker - Comic Book Spinoff (WB)
10. Jumanji: The Next Level - Sequel (Columbia)
11. It Chapter Two - Sequel (WB)
12. Us - Horror film (Blumhouse/Universal)
13. Fast and Furious Presents: Hobbs and Show: Franchise spinoff (Universal)
14. John Wick: Chapter 3 - Parabellum - Franchise Sequel (Lionsgate)
15. Knives Out - Murder Mystery (Lionsgate)
16. How to Train Your Dragon: The Hidden World - Sequel (Paramount)
17. 1917 - WW1 (Dreamworks/Universal)
18. The Secret Life of Pets 2 - Sequel (Universal)
19. Pokemon Detective Pikachu - Franchise starter (WB)
20. Once Upon A Time in Hollywood - period dramedy (Sony)
21. Shazam - Franchise Spinoff (WB)
22. Maleficent: Mistress of Evil - Sequel (Disney)

17 of the 22 are sequels, remakes, or franchise spinoffs. The top 8 are all Disney.

Now there are arguments to be made that the diversity once seen at the box office is now reflected in streaming/TV content. And I'd say that is true. We entered into a golden age of TV some time ago. But it's not like the people mourning the loss of diversity in cinema are making up their complaints. You can see how people that loved the golden age of theaters, were formed or moved by those experiences, are looking at todays cinema and wishing there was room for more than sequels and remakes. It isn't the MCU's fault, but the MCU is the beneficiary of the industry changes, and the death of the mid budget blockbuster experience is the loser in all of this.

And it's not like QT is some bitter hasbeen who isn't popping. He's one of the few, along with directors like Jordan Peele and Nolan that came still pack theaters for their original movies.

But movies like Rush Hour, Fight Club, Se7en, The Truman Show, and The Matrix probably wouldn't be greenlit as movies in 2022. They will be netflix or hulu shows going forward. For better or worse.

This is like when people blame the record labels for violent rap when the truth is the labels follow the existing demand

Things change it's been brought up multiple times already but the movies are expensive breh this is a huge factor that doesn't appear to be taken as seriously as it should

Also now more than ever nikkas got home setups. A moderately large TV with a decent sound system will curb the urge to just go see anything at the movies like the old days. If the Truman Show came out today nikkas cooking a meal and booting that shyt up on HBO Max. The increasing and consistent availability of big screen TVs and sound systems have done more damage to theaters than I think most people realize

Movie theaters are the venue of spectacles, and at one point the movies on your 1998 list were spectacles in their own right, but again times change The spectacles now are once unprecedented superhero movies and director vehicles(Tarantino, Peele etc)

If we're being 100 the summer blockbuster, introduced by films like Top Gun in the 80s is what really began the slow death of "cinema" There was going to be a point where blockbusters bubbled over the summer and spread into other months of the year, which began to happen in the 2000s. The MCU is only a natural progression of something that had been simmering for 20 years

Now I do completely agree that Hollywood is suffering from an enormous lack of creativity and risk taking. And I wish I had an answer to reconcile that but I don't a risk taking studio like A24 gives me hope tho and I'd like to see more like it

 

[O.Red]

Actually agree with your take. The irony is, under a different lens, I would just assume Tarantino would be for this. He's known for plucking actors from obscurity or purgatory and making them into stars.

My take is, Tarantino, Scorsese, Soderbergh et al are purists and aren't particularly happy with the direction film is going. I don't think it's a disdain for the actors, but the films themselves follow a very predictable, theme park ride format. Everything is interchangeable and takes very little to make much money once you have that formula; director, actor, story be damned.

The irony of this situation is Simu Li had a public rebuttal for Tarantino, but Shang Chi is exhibit A. It could've been a solid smaller story about family ties and martial arts, but they unnecessarily turned it into a goofy monster movie by the end it. If I was Simu, I wouldn't bite the hand that fed me, but I'd take Tarantino's criticism to heart and see what I could do to make sure my career didn't fall victim to that same fate.

Shang Chi is an interesting case to me because it's hurt as much as helped by it's success in my opinion

Shang Chi was Marvel's chance to take some amazing chances and tap into the Chinese epic, Shaw Brothers style of film with MCU learnings. They tapped their toe in the water, but ultimately it became just another MCU origin with the same muted MCU color scheme(which REALLY hurts the movie to me). The MCU template watered down any potential flair that movie tried to reach for

Ironically a Tarantino directed Shang Chi would more than likely be

 

[The_Truth]

This isn't specific to marvel. Plenty of actors have been made famous for one character, while they don't get the same recognition for other characters.

 

[Saysumthinfunnymike]

In the year 2022, 27 American films have grossed over $100 million worldwide

Of those 27, only 9 aren’t a sequel and/or tied to a franchise/IP with an established fanbase

Elvis
The Bad Guys
Bullet Train
Smile
The Lost City
Nope
The Black Phone
Ticket to Paradise
Everything Everywhere All at Once

Of these 9 how many of them can you say the biggest draw was the starpower of the lead actor(s)

nope was all because of Peele. Same with QT. They can put out $100m movies off they own name.

 

[Spiritual Stratocaster]

Jumanji, Jumanji 2, the game plan, rampage, the Cia one with kevin hart

Walking Tall and the one with the white daughter..Escape from the Mountain

And greatest of all DOOM

 

[Big Boss]

 

[BlackMajik]