Russia's Invasion of Ukraine (Official Thread)

[Black Magisterialness]

Y'all bring up some very, very valid points. I think where I fall on the issue is... I can't fathom Russia breaking up. Not anytime soon. Maybe y'all are seeing something that I'm not, but as long as Putin and other hard-nose former Soviets are alive, I don't see them letting Russia fall apart after having to suffer the shame and fallout that came from the USSR falling apart. I just can't see that. I don't see a world where that happens.

I still think that NATO countries ease up on the sanctions if Russia were to withdraw. I'm certain that would be part of Russia's negotiations. There is no way they withdraw from Ukraine if they don't get an agreement regarding sanctions easing up. And if NATO's private face is the same as their public face, I can see them working out an agreement regarding the sanctions.

However, I am saying that only happens if NATO's private face is the same as its public face. Right now, their public face is "Invasion of Ukraine is morally wrong, you are displacing men, women and children, you should withdraw immediately blah blah blah."

But there is a chance that their private face is different. Y'all may very well be right, in that NATO is more interested in the destruction of Russia than saving Ukraine. If that's the case, Ukraine is truly in trouble and that would lend credence to some of the conspiracy theorists who have entered this thread with posts about the US only using Ukraine to do their dirty work, and the US government not really caring one whit about what happens in Ukraine.

In the scenario that y'all lay out: NATO would never agree to lift sanctions because they are willing to sacrifice Ukraine in a bid to get Russia completely out of the paint.

I hope that isn't so, cause if it is, what we've seen happen in Ukraine so far is child's play compared to what we'll soon be seeing.

But the bolded is the bigger prize. If Russia is sanctioned into oblivion and crumbles, then Ukraine can be rebuilt.

But what makes you so certain ANY nation can't be broken up? The UK left the Eurozone. Russia's all ready been broken up and or reconstructed twice in the past 100 years, former Yugoslavia broke up etc. Russia isn't some how exempt from that because Putin's a strong man. In fact, deposing strongman leaders is almost CERTAIN to lead to the country falling apart for a while. And like I said, unlike South Sudan or Yugoslavia, NATO has a VESTED INTEREST in having a leader play ball in Moscow. Putin knows this and will fight to the death, because his oligarchs and sycophants will do what sycophants do, and save themselves. As long as they can keep their millions (which most won't) they'll suck NATOs dikk too.

 

[Neo. The Only. The One.]

But the bolded is the bigger prize. If Russia is sanctioned into oblivion and crumbles, then Ukraine can be rebuilt.

But what makes you so certain ANY nation can't be broken up? The UK left the Eurozone. Russia's all ready been broken up and or reconstructed twice in the past 100 years, former Yugoslavia broke up etc. Russia isn't some how exempt from that because Putin's a strong man. In fact, deposing strongman leaders is almost CERTAIN to lead to the country falling apart for a while. And like I said, unlike South Sudan or Yugoslavia, NATO has a VESTED INTEREST in having a leader play ball in Moscow. Putin knows this and will fight to the death, because his oligarchs and sycophants will do what sycophants do, and save themselves. As long as they can keep their millions (which most won't) they'll suck NATOs dikk too.

But breh, this would be the biggest mistake of any world leader probably in all of history if what you're saying is true.

This is a bigger mistake than Hitler's Barbarossa operation, or him declaring war on the US.

This is insanity, it's madness! If Putin is responsible for the breakup of Russia, my God, that would be insane.

I'm having trouble even fathoming him backing himself into a corner of that magnitude and ultimately being responsible for the death of Russia.

 

[newarkhiphop]

The US Is Offering You $5M to Snitch on Oligarch Yachts, Jets, and Mansions

Would you SNITCH?

no snitching Putin could be about to hit the nuke button I ain't telling, ya feel me!

 

[newarkhiphop]

 

[ORDER_66]

We need to start locking up these oligarchs, stick them to a crime.

But what law did they break?!!? I mean dont they have to prove they have brought shyt with dirty money or just railroad them like some nikkas

 

[hashmander]

Surreal


“There’s no talk of capitulation for Kyiv,” said Lt. Tetiana Chornovol, the commander of an anti-tank missile unit operating on the outskirts of the city. “Everything is going far better than we thought.”

Chornovol, 42, is a former activist in Ukraine’s street protest movement who sent her two children to safety before reporting for duty as a reserve officer. She commands two teams of a half-dozen or so people each, firing Ukrainian-made, tripod-mounted missiles, which they transport to ambush positions in their personal cars.

Chornovol drives a Chevy Volt electric hatchback, which she calls an “ecologically clean killing machine.”

Interviewed beside a burning grocery warehouse in the suburban town of Brovary, the lieutenant popped the hatchback to reveal a beige tube, holding a Stugna-P missile. It has a range of 3 miles and hits a target within a diameter of 1 foot.

Seemingly unfazed by combat, Chornovol described the Ukrainian tactic of ambushes that has defined the early phases of the battle for the capital. Last week, she said, she blew up a Russian tank a few miles east of Brovary on the M01 highway.

“We look for firing positions where we can see a stretch of road,” Chornovol said, adding that “we know a column will drive on the road” eventually. With her car parked some distance away, covered in camouflage, she and her team lay in wait in a tree line for three days before a Russian column came rumbling down the road.

When the command came to open fire, she used a laser to lock in on the tank, pushed a button, then watched as the tank lit up in flames before she rushed back to her car to escape return fire. “I shoot at armor,” she said, when asked about the human toll. “If they climb inside, it’s their fault.”


The Battle for Kyiv Looms as a Long and Bloody Conflict

an "ecologically clean killing machine"

"If they climb inside, it’s their fault"

wow, what a woman.

 

[BigMoneyGrip]

The US Is Offering You $5M to Snitch on Oligarch Yachts, Jets, and Mansions

Would you SNITCH?

Where do I sign up? I’m snitchin on everybody

 

[BigMoneyGrip]

Sobering. There's going to be a bit of pain to wean off Russia.

In this low attention span age, things will get dicey once the war is over in terms of public opinion.

After Ukraine, how will the world replace Russia’s oil products?

I think the west is hoping to get Putin completely out the pain and whom ever is next to be president to start playing ball.. but Putin only off ramp is straight to a casket

 

[Orbital-Fetus]

Y'all bring up some very, very valid points. I think where I fall on the issue is... I can't fathom Russia breaking up. Not anytime soon. Maybe y'all are seeing something that I'm not, but as long as Putin and other hard-nose former Soviets are alive, I don't see them letting Russia fall apart after having to suffer the shame and fallout that came from the USSR falling apart. I just can't see that. I don't see a world where that happens.

I still think that NATO countries ease up on the sanctions if Russia were to withdraw. I'm certain that would be part of Russia's negotiations. There is no way they withdraw from Ukraine if they don't get an agreement regarding sanctions easing up. And if NATO's private face is the same as their public face, I can see them working out an agreement regarding the sanctions.

However, I am saying that only happens if NATO's private face is the same as its public face. Right now, their public face is "Invasion of Ukraine is morally wrong, you are displacing men, women and children, you should withdraw immediately blah blah blah."

But there is a chance that their private face is different. Y'all may very well be right, in that NATO is more interested in the destruction of Russia than saving Ukraine. If that's the case, Ukraine is truly in trouble and that would lend credence to some of the conspiracy theorists who have entered this thread with posts about the US only using Ukraine to do their dirty work, and the US government not really caring one whit about what happens in Ukraine.

In the scenario that y'all lay out: NATO would never agree to lift sanctions because they are willing to sacrifice Ukraine in a bid to get Russia completely out of the paint.

I hope that isn't so, cause if it is, what we've seen happen in Ukraine so far is child's play compared to what we'll soon be seeing.

lettuce roll back a few strokes...

i'm gonna start with your last point about the public and private face of NATO because that is a great umbrella to put your other talking points under.

after the fall of the USSR, NATO was on some wtf we gonna do now?

US: We got a nerfed Russia outta this unforeseen win. Let's give them Levi's and McDonalds and see how it goes

KGB: We change name to FSB.

US: *hopes for the best*

FF to today and the West is tired of licking it's wounds at the hands of Putin.

sorry for the drawn out opening but i wanted to lay out the groundwork for this;
the West is no longer hoping for the best and letting things rot whilst holding their noses.
imo, the public and private faces are lined up locked step for the time being. did you see the German Parliament sessions where all parties pretty much agreed to up military spending to over 2% of GDP? that's a bigger change in German policy taking place in 24 hrs than has taken place in 24 years. the entire potential for what the map of Europe can be is more fluid now than it has been in a generation.

all of this to say that i do not doubt that the public resolve of NATO at this time is on par with it's private.



to your first point about Putin letting the fall of Russia happen?

at some point that choice is going to be taken out of his little hands.

Spoiler

that dog walk

to wrap it up, the fact that you can't imagine a world where Russia falls after seeing everything transpire over the past weeks should tell you something.

the only thing that stays the same is change, breh...

 

[Carl Tethers]

The US Is Offering You $5M to Snitch on Oligarch Yachts, Jets, and Mansions

Would you SNITCH?

If you've been chilling with oligarchs, 5 milli is a lowball offer

 

[Lord Beasley]

We need to start locking up these oligarchs, stick them to a crime.

I'm not sure if other countries have forms of RICO, but if they did and they start following the money... you don't know where you'll end up

If you've been chilling with oligarchs, 5 milli is a lowball offer

that kid who follows planes needs to hop on this and show y'all

 

[Orbital-Fetus]

I'm not sure if other countries have forms of RICO, but if they did and they start following the money... you don't know where you'll end up

that kid who follows planes needs to hop on this and show y'all

so many scumbags living lives of luxury on the necks of others.

 

[Orbital-Fetus]

But breh, this would be the biggest mistake of any world leader probably in all of history if what you're saying is true.

This is a bigger mistake than Hitler's Barbarossa operation, or him declaring war on the US.

This is insanity, it's madness! If Putin is responsible for the breakup of Russia, my God, that would be insane.

I'm having trouble even fathoming him backing himself into a corner of that magnitude and ultimately being responsible for the death of Russia.

 

[Neo. The Only. The One.]

lettuce roll back a few strokes...

i'm gonna start with your last point about the public and private face of NATO because that is a great umbrella to put your other talking points under.

after the fall of the USSR, NATO was on some wtf we gonna do now?

US: We got a nerfed Russia outta this unforeseen win. Let's give them Levi's and McDonalds and see how it goes

KGB: We change name to FSB.

US: *hopes for the best*

FF to today and the West is tired of licking it's wounds at the hands of Putin.

sorry for the drawn out opening but i wanted to lay out the groundwork for this;
the West is no longer hoping for the best and letting things rot whilst holding their noses.
imo, the public and private faces are lined up locked step for the time being. did you see the German Parliament sessions where all parties pretty much agreed to up military spending to over 2% of GDP? that's a bigger change in German policy taking place in 24 hrs than has taken place in 24 years. the entire potential for what the map of Europe can be is more fluid now than it has been in a generation.

all of this to say that i do not doubt that the public resolve of NATO at this time is on par with it's private.



to your first point about Putin letting the fall of Russia happen?

at some point that choice is going to be taken out of his little hands.

Spoiler

that dog walk

to wrap it up, the fact that you can't imagine a world where Russia falls after seeing everything transpire over the past weeks should tell you something.

the only thing that stays the same is change, breh...

I don't disagree with any of this. In the context of someone else taking over the helm in Russia, I thought that was a given, and maybe I should have clarified that point in my earlier remarks about sanctions.

I don't believe that Putin pulls his army out of Ukraine and the US decides to play ball with Russia again. I thought it was a given that he would be forced to resign before the US started removing sanctions from Russia.

That's what I was saying earlier that if he withdrew the military, then NATO might be willing to gradually ease sanctions. But of course, none of that happens with Putin still in charge. He would be forced to step down before sanctions are eased.

 

[BigMoneyGrip]

If you've been chilling with oligarchs, 5 milli is a lowball offer

It’s not a low ball of all your funds are frozen or the Oligarcs can’t pay you..