Once again is there any quantifiable, empirical scientific research or data to back your claim
If it is common sense like to our say the research should be in abundance
Essential Random Gym Thoughts Revisited...
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Once again is there any quantifiable, empirical scientific research or data to back your claim
If it is common sense like to our say the research should be in abundance
It's pretty clear that it forces you to a fixed plane of motion.
What's "better" is up for debate buy it's clearly not the same.
The smith machine stabilizes the weight for you.
That's the point of the machine.
That has nothing to do with the context of the conversation
@CrimsonTider If your goal is just to have bigger legs and look better, you can use the smith machine, one of the best body builders of all time didn't even do back squats or flat bench. Dorian Yates did leg press only and fukked with decline/incline bench without flat, you can build muscle any way you please. People harp on the compound lifts too much, the general population are not elite athletes so do whatever works for you and gets the results you want.
If people really wanted to build stabilizer muscles they'd do swimming or get a heavy ass weight vest and go hiking with it.
If people really wanted to build stabilizer muscles they'd do swimming or get a heavy ass weight vest and go hiking with it.
I don't think people harp on compound lifts to much. That's a key component of changing your body composition.
Yates was a pro and also enhanced so that just doesn't apply to the average person.
Big picture it is all an individual experiment but point people in the logical directions (health willing) isn't a bad thing.
Nah, I think people definitely harp on the compound lifts, you say it's a key component to changing your body composition and that isn't exactly true. I've been lifting a long time, and to me it's reaching the level of monotony, I look at male gymnasts and boxers, both of them have far more functional strength and generally more aesthetic bodies and neither does weight lifting. It's not the key component, it's one of them but people speak as though it's the only means.
Yates was a pro that used drugs, and beat other pros that used drugs, all while tossing two supposedly vital compound lifts in the bushes which is the point. If @CrimsonTider's goal is simply to look better then there's nothing wrong with the Smith machine
Well what does level of monotony have to do we the physiology of the movements?Nah, I think people definitely harp on the compound lifts, you say it's a key component to changing your body composition and that isn't exactly true. I've been lifting a long time, and to me it's reaching the level of monotony, I look at male gymnasts and boxers, both of them have far more functional strength and generally more aesthetic bodies and neither does weight lifting. It's not the key component, it's one of them but people speak as though it's the only means.
Yates was a pro that used drugs, and beat other pros that used drugs, all while tossing two supposedly vital compound lifts in the bushes which is the point. If @CrimsonTider's goal is simply to look better then there's nothing wrong with the Smith machine
Again you are comparing elite athletes who do this as a profession to the average person.
The reality is that when its discussed it's aimed at people that are starting to change body composition or bring up a lagging area. I don't see who it's not the most effective starting point for those groups. Again it's clearly not the only way but it's the straightest line.
I hate when you're telling someone what you're doing and they turn around and tell you what you should do. 
I told my friend I'm going to do at least 30 minutes of exercise everyday for June. She told me to tell her what I would be doing and I explained the 5x5 and said "so basically I would be doing at least 25 of each exercise each day". Then she replied well you need to do 36 or 48
I wasn't asking for suggestions, I was telling yo you what I was doing...you know like you asked me to.
I told my friend I'm going to do at least 30 minutes of exercise everyday for June. She told me to tell her what I would be doing and I explained the 5x5 and said "so basically I would be doing at least 25 of each exercise each day". Then she replied well you need to do 36 or 48
I wasn't asking for suggestions, I was telling yo you what I was doing...you know like you asked me to.IDK, there are other alternatives. I just bought a leg press machine for my house, and Im also looking into getting one of this hip squat belts. Squats are dangerous enough as is, seems even worse to try and fix your knees/hips/upper back to move in a rigid plane. But back squats are technical AF and dangerous for someone who has no desire to master them. I guess Smith machine squats can be OK.
People are using the major compound lifts because of elite athletes and pro body builders, if you go into the ideal physique thread it's nothing but athletes being posted, so me bringing up Gymnasts and Boxers is no different, people are using athletes/body builders as their targets.
The target is simply to look better for the vast majority of people lifting, and truthfully speaking if they knew better, starting out the majority would be doing isolation work instead of the compound lifts. That video above by Elliot is from the perspective of someone that competes in Strongman competitions, stabilizers for him are paramount to success....they aren't necessary for the dude that wants to look better at the beach and works in an office. And if stabilizers were really key, nobody would touch the barbell bench over the DB bench, even though it's one of the compound lifts.
I ditched back squats, hip belt and weight vest > back squats.
I'm to the point I may just start doing body weight training + my weight vest.
Good discussion
I guess my question is who ever started at ground zero and go ripped doing isolation? I doubt there is an answer there.
I think you have to have a base an them from there it's effective in several ways.
It's anecdotal but this morning I say a guy I've seen in the gym for at least to years and he mainly does iso work. I saw him on the assisted pull-up machine and was honestly stunned he had to use it.