Polls Close in a hour:(UPDATE: its over :sadbern:)South Carolina Democratic Primary

Who wins


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rapbeats

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Wake up and stop following the establishment...very few positive things happened in the last 30 or so years that have benefited black people that either voted Democrat or stayed at home and let the Republican candidate win. This election was a real golden opportunity for not only African Americans but the working class as a whole to make a statement and start change in this country. In the course of this election we have seen Hillary fall apart again with the Email scandal...a 14 minute youtube compilation of "Hilldawg" contradicting herself and blatant proof that she is funded by Wall Street (working for the current establishment). Bernie showed that his campaign and policies where going to challenge the status quo and try to help the African Americans and the working class making them his priority instead of rich cacs. Hillary called Black children "Super Predators". Her husband signed off on NAFTA and the 3 strikes rule, and Obama (who Hillary will follow) just signed away even more jobs here in America with the TPP. It is really depressing to see that our people are still mentally shackled and will not fight for any sort of positive change. :snoop:
its not just OUR people. its white people too. not all of them but a certain segment of them.

think about it. you have two sets of people voting against their own interest. all the low middle to broke class whites running with trump, and all the black folks RUnning up behind hillary.
 

No1

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Bernie fukked up by letting Hillary run to the side of Obama first and then Bernie started criticizing Obama and didnt realize he was fukking up by doing that until it was too late. I dont care what your policies are, you arent going to gain the support of black people (im just generalizing here) by criticizing the first black president. Especially when you some new white guy thats popping up on the black scene out of nowhere. So right off the bat he lost the older black vote, he managed to get the support of some younger blacks but unfortunately for him young people dont vote.
A lot of people criticized Obama in 2011 when he tried to put through that budget deal with Boehner. Hillary was just lucky to be in his cabinet. You're acting like dude campaigned on criticizing Obama. Clinton wisely brought up his old comments but that could have been done to any Democratic Senator. Harry Reid looked at Obama crazy for that shyt. fukk it, we all did.

@wire28 the reason I negged you the other day is because you're taking stances and supporting people who are criticizing Bernie just for the fukk of it no matter how wrong they are. You have been cosigning shyt like the above-mentioned. It's like you are surrounded by pro-Bernie people so anyone anti-Bernie, no matter how wrong is good with you. It's corny. That is not being fair-minded, that is being a contrarian.

Moreover, I really want to figure out how as a person of color, who knows the history of America in foreign territories that you guys are just dusting off Clinton's warhawk ways. That is the worst part to me more than anything economic.
 

wire28

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A lot of people criticized Obama in 2011 when he tried to put through that budget deal with Boehner. Hillary was just lucky to be in his cabinet. You're acting like dude campaigned on criticizing Obama. Clinton wisely brought up his old comments but that could have been done to any Democratic Senator. Harry Reid looked at Obama crazy for that shyt. fukk it, we all did.

@wire28 the reason I negged you the other day is because you're taking stances and supporting people who are criticizing Bernie just for the fukk of it no matter how wrong they are. You have been cosigning shyt like the above-mentioned. It's like you are surrounded by pro-Bernie people so anyone anti-Bernie, no matter how wrong is good with you. It's corny. That is not being fair-minded, that is being a contrarian.

Moreover, I really want to figure out how as a person of color, who knows the history of America in foreign territories that you guys are just dusting off Clinton's warhawk ways. That is the worst part to me more than anything economic.

Lol you keep coming at me with this. I told you straight up before the Bernie stan base got unbearable that I was undecided but leaning towards Bernie. Probably a week later I said I was more for Bernie. Your problem with me is at the same time that I support Bernie I haven't bashed Hillary and don't think she is incompetent. You saying I'm not being fair minded is hilarious when the only reason the Bernie fans were giving me shyt was BECAUSE I was being fair minded and said she had positive things she can bring to the presidency and trying to evaluate both candidates and not just dismiss her because she is the devil apparently.

You disagree, which is fine. But your whole premise of being mad that I don't think Hillary is going to ruin the country can go that way :camby:

Most of politics is opinion based on your own preferences, not fact, so yes I guess when I agree with others it's "wrong" to you, especially since you clearly have trouble accepting different viewpoints although you love to portray yourself as above the fray.
 
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Anerdyblackguy

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We (younger generation) will complain the most about the unfair treatment we get from the current establishment but we would rather schedule our day around watching Empire or Real HouseThots of Random City and staying sedated than spend 1 hour to vote :scust:

People thought the last 3 or so years of police brutality was bad...wait until #TrumpSet :mjcry:

That's what bothers me the most.
 

Tate

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Combination of problems here.

1. Sanders personally didn't run a good campaign in SC apparently. He has limitations. He has no longstanding ties to black voters as a support group.

2. The Clintons are liked by most black people. This is hard for lots to get their head around but the 90s were a great time for a lot of people economically. Many black people were lifted out of poverty by the 90s economy. And despite accusations of economic reductionism by sanders, the economy is still the most important issue to black voters and all voters. The issue here is that I suspect longing for the boom of the 90s to return superseded sanders welfare statism with SC blacks.

3. The nature of SC politically was bad for sanders. It's a state with next to no organized labor or independent political grassroots type organizations. Much of the democratic machinery is wrapped in old white party loyalists clubs and the black church. Sanders is not a democrat and thus has no ties to the old local democratic clubs and he had no inroads with the black churches. This is a divide that is exasperated by both sanders geographic isolation and cultural Jewery/spiritual Atheisim.

Clinton on the other hand has great connections within the remnants of the white southern Dems and the black church. The Clintons are southern democrats to the core, they understand how to manage their client groups and have been since the 70s. Clinton is of course also a Methodist and a southern, these matter when it comes to communication.

4. I think HRC's embrace of Obama was atleast partially successful. Black folk, especially older black women, love Obama. Exit polls showed that the perception of disrespect towards Obama on Romney and the GOP's account drove up black turnout and was a primary reason for many black voters.

By cynically painting Sanders as undermining Obama, HRC atleast partly tapped into this. Sanders personally failed to deflect this criticism well. Partly because in fact he and Obama do have pretty large disagreements on matters of policy. And despite sandera not really being an undermining force to Obama's incredibly modest progressive goals, he refused to disavow these differences. Though sanders could have pushed HRC harder on her own differences with Obama on foreign policy, she had an excellent defense of this in that despite these, Obama made her his SoS.

Though I dismissed these at the time, I think maybe cornel west's presence and prominence as a Sanders surrogate wasn't helpful on this front. West's flair for dramatic language has perhaps made him toxic even in the halls from whence he comes. I'm sure his declaration of John Lewis being a neoliberal sellout(which he sorta is, but decorum and all) will not be a helpful thing going forward.

5. I'm sure there are a fair amount of moderate, neoliberal black voters that just prefer those policies.

6. In the end, there are still bright spots. Sanders did better with younger voters. Only losing millennial blacks 45-55(compared to losing over 65 by ~95-3). This indicates that left economics remain a winner with the young across race. This indicates to me that a left candidate not as uniquely weak as sanders in these respects would do better against a moderate, establishment candidate not as uniquely strong in these respects.

The problem with this conclusion is that I currently see no left inheritors of Sandersism that has much stronger variables here. A Warren is marginally better for sure in a number aspects but not decisively. Someone like Keith Ellison has separate cultural barriers, tho he has the unique advantage of being black. Whereas the neoliberal establishment has thoroughbreds like Cory Booker at their disposal in the future.

However, the political landscape is ever changing. In 5 years, from Generalissimo Trump's Very Luxurious Day Spa/Internment Camp, the whole situation may be different.
 

Swaggatron

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Combination of problems here.

1. Sanders personally didn't run a good campaign in SC apparently. He has limitations. He has no longstanding ties to black voters as a support group.

2. The Clintons are liked by most black people. This is hard for lots to get their head around but the 90s were a great time for a lot of people economically. Many black people were lifted out of poverty by the 90s economy. And despite accusations of economic reductionism by sanders, the economy is still the most important issue to black voters and all voters. The issue here is that I suspect longing for the boom of the 90s to return superseded sanders welfare statism with SC blacks.

3. The nature of SC politically was bad for sanders. It's a state with next to no organized labor or independent political grassroots type organizations. Much of the democratic machinery is wrapped in old white party loyalists clubs and the black church. Sanders is not a democrat and thus has no ties to the old local democratic clubs and he had no inroads with the black churches. This is a divide that is exasperated by both sanders geographic isolation and cultural Jewery/spiritual Atheisim.

Clinton on the other hand has great connections within the remnants of the white southern Dems and the black church. The Clintons are southern democrats to the core, they understand how to manage their client groups and have been since the 70s. Clinton is of course also a Methodist and a southern, these matter when it comes to communication.

4. I think HRC's embrace of Obama was atleast partially successful. Black folk, especially older black women, love Obama. Exit polls showed that the perception of disrespect towards Obama on Romney and the GOP's account drove up black turnout and was a primary reason for many black voters.

By cynically painting Sanders as undermining Obama, HRC atleast partly tapped into this. Sanders personally failed to deflect this criticism well. Partly because in fact he and Obama do have pretty large disagreements on matters of policy. And despite sandera not really being an undermining force to Obama's incredibly modest progressive goals, he refused to disavow these differences. Though sanders could have pushed HRC harder on her own differences with Obama on foreign policy, she had an excellent defense of this in that despite these, Obama made her his SoS.

Though I dismissed these at the time, I think maybe cornel west's presence and prominence as a Sanders surrogate wasn't helpful on this front. West's flair for dramatic language has perhaps made him toxic even in the halls from whence he comes. I'm sure his declaration of John Lewis being a neoliberal sellout(which he sorta is, but decorum and all) will not be a helpful thing going forward.

5. I'm sure there are a fair amount of moderate, neoliberal black voters that just prefer those policies.

6. In the end, there are still bright spots. Sanders did better with younger voters. Only losing millennial blacks 45-55(compared to losing over 65 by ~95-3). This indicates that left economics remain a winner with the young across race. This indicates to me that a left candidate not as uniquely weak as sanders in these respects would do better against a moderate, establishment candidate not as uniquely strong in these respects.

The problem with this conclusion is that I currently see no left inheritors of Sandersism that has much stronger variables here. A Warren is marginally better for sure in a number aspects but not decisively. Someone like Keith Ellison has separate cultural barriers, tho he has the unique advantage of being black. Whereas the neoliberal establishment has thoroughbreds like Cory Booker at their disposal in the future.

However, the political landscape is ever changing. In 5 years, from Generalissimo Trump's Very Luxurious Day Spa/Internment Camp, the whole situation may be different.


I was waiting for you to provide input :blessed:
 

Atlrocafella

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Lol you keep coming at me with this. I told you straight up before the Bernie stan base got unbearable that I was undecided but leaning towards Bernie. Probably a week later I said I was more for Bernie. Your problem with me is at the same time that I support Bernie I haven't bashed Hillary and don't think she is incompetent. You saying I'm not being fair minded is hilarious when the only reason the Bernie fans were giving me shyt was BECAUSE I was being fair minded and said she had positive things she can bring to the presidency and trying to evaluate both candidates and not just dismiss her because she is the devil apparently.

You disagree, which is fine. But your whole premise of being mad that I don't think Hillary is going to ruin the country can go that way :camby:

Most of politics is opinion based on your own preferences, not fact, so yes I guess when I agree with others it's "wrong" to you, especially since you clearly have trouble accepting different viewpoints although you love to portray yourself as above the fray.
:dahell: this nicca won't let you be. These Bernie stans can't fathom a different point of view. I'm opposed to Bernie for the fukk of it? Umm no, I'm opposed to Bernie because I'm not a got damn liberal, leftist, socialist.
 

Swaggatron

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What was the point of merging the thread with this one...At least the other thread wasn't a troll fest
 

Swaggatron

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:dahell: this nicca won't let you be. These Bernie stans can't fathom a different point of view. I'm opposed to Bernie for the fukk of it? Umm no, I'm opposed to Bernie because I'm not a got damn liberal, leftist, socialist.



I am a Bernie supporter and this entire thread has been open discussion...that is a generalization that isn't true...you cant look at a couple of avid Bernie stans and group everyone as a whole...the same can be said by the irrational HRC and Trump stans on this site as well if you want to magnify outliers
 

wire28

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:dahell: this nicca won't let you be. These Bernie stans can't fathom a different point of view. I'm opposed to Bernie for the fukk of it? Umm no, I'm opposed to Bernie because I'm not a got damn liberal, leftist, socialist.
yeah I guess I havent been in higher learning enough because there is a strong little group of posters with heavy socialist leanings that I didn't know about. It's hard to have a decent convo when people think they or the politicians they support are infallible.

The nikka basically Negged me because he didn't like who I was dapping :dead: welcome to higher learning yall
 

wire28

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I am a Bernie supporter and this entire thread has been open discussion...that is a generalization that isn't true...you cant look at a couple of avid Bernie stans and group everyone as a whole...the same can be said by the irrational HRC and Trump stans on this site as well if you want to magnify outliers
honestly you are the only one I can remember that has kept it a buck. and we don't have any Hillary stans on this site, atleast that I've seen. Atlroc is fine with Hillary or trump. Dtown is fine with Hillary. Nobody is making 5 threads a day about why Bernie is trash or why if you don't vote for Hillary you are an ignorant c00n who can't vote in your own best interest and therefore deserve the worst of what politics has to offer
 

JahFocus CS

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yeah I guess I havent been in higher learning enough because there is a strong little group of posters with heavy socialist leanings that I didn't know about. It's hard to have a decent convo when people think they or the politicians they support are infallible.

The nikka basically Negged me because he didn't like who I was dapping :dead: welcome to higher learning yall

If you're dapping up Napoleon and the right-wingers (but especially Napoleon), you deserve those negs. :huhldup:
 

Swaggatron

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honestly you are the only one I can remember that has kept it a buck. and we don't have any Hillary stans on this site, atleast that I've seen. Atlroc is fine with Hillary or trump. Dtown is fine with Hillary. Nobody is making 5 threads a day about why Bernie is trash or why if you don't vote for Hillary you are an ignorant c00n who can't vote in your own best interest and therefore deserve the worst of what politics has to offer

Napoleon breh :bryan:
 

JahFocus CS

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honestly you are the only one I can remember that has kept it a buck. and we don't have any Hillary stans on this site, atleast that I've seen. Atlroc is fine with Hillary or trump. Dtown is fine with Hillary. Nobody is making 5 threads a day about why Bernie is trash or why if you don't vote for Hillary you are an ignorant c00n who can't vote in your own best interest and therefore deserve the worst of what politics has to offer

Napoleon isn't a Hillary stan?

He makes 10 threads a day bashing Sanders :dead:
 

Atlrocafella

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I am a Bernie supporter and this entire thread has been open discussion...that is a generalization that isn't true...you cant look at a couple of avid Bernie stans and group everyone as a whole...the same can be said by the irrational HRC and Trump stans on this site as well if you want to magnify outliers
You're absolutely right, but I know who the Bernie supporters are versus the stans. The supporters are cool and reasonable. the stans are annoying and disgusting, especially when they say things like black people should deserve L's for not voting for Bernie :scust:
 
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