Polls Close in a hour:(UPDATE: its over :sadbern:)South Carolina Democratic Primary

Who wins


  • Total voters
    34

The_Sheff

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A lot of people criticized Obama in 2011 when he tried to put through that budget deal with Boehner. Hillary was just lucky to be in his cabinet. You're acting like dude campaigned on criticizing Obama. Clinton wisely brought up his old comments but that could have been done to any Democratic Senator. Harry Reid looked at Obama crazy for that shyt. fukk it, we all did.

@wire28 the reason I negged you the other day is because you're taking stances and supporting people who are criticizing Bernie just for the fukk of it no matter how wrong they are. You have been cosigning shyt like the above-mentioned. It's like you are surrounded by pro-Bernie people so anyone anti-Bernie, no matter how wrong is good with you. It's corny. That is not being fair-minded, that is being a contrarian.

Moreover, I really want to figure out how as a person of color, who knows the history of America in foreign territories that you guys are just dusting off Clinton's warhawk ways. That is the worst part to me more than anything economic.


The overwhelming majority of people dont pay attention to politics like that. So when you say a lot of people looked at Obama sideways including Harry Reid, ill counter by saying most of the electorate doesnt know who Harry Reid is.

When you're the new white guy on the block and your black support is hovering below 20% you dont directly state how something Obama did wasnt good enough and you have the actual answer we need. When he started doing that immediately black folks were like "Oh, the new white guy is downing Obama, this is just like some shyt white people pull they always think they know whats actually good for us". Hillary saw that shyt and you notice every time she talked about a plan she mentioned how Obama's plan was right and she just wants to continue his work. Hillary didnt have to go back to 2011 to pick up some Bernie quotes, she took the sentences he spoke 20 seconds prior and used them against him.
 

Swaggatron

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You're absolutely right, but I know who the Bernie supporters are versus the stans. The supporters are cool and reasonable. the stans are annoying and disgusting, especially when they say things like black people should deserve L's for not voting for Bernie :scust:

But what I am saying is The big 3 in the race have stans like that...Not just Bernie...I notice when the stans of all 3 stay out of the conversations or are ignored thoughtful discussion can be had
 

wire28

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If you're dapping up Napoleon and the right-wingers (but especially Napoleon), you deserve those negs. :huhldup:
What can I say, I can find the good in all of us :troll:

Napoleon isn't a Hillary stan?

He makes 10 threads a day bashing Sanders :dead:
And nah he just posts a lot bashing Bernie. There's probably one anti Bernie thread a day, if that.
 

wire28

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The overwhelming majority of people dont pay attention to politics like that. So when you say a lot of people looked at Obama sideways including Harry Reid, ill counter by saying most of the electorate doesnt know who Harry Reid is.

When you're the new white guy on the block and your black support is hovering below 20% you dont directly state how something Obama did wasnt good enough and you have the actual answer we need. When he started doing that immediately black folks were like "Oh, the new white guy is downing Obama, this is just like some shyt white people pull they always think they know whats actually good for us". Hillary saw that shyt and you notice every time she talked about a plan she mentioned how Obama's plan was right and she just wants to continue his work. Hillary didnt have to go back to 2011 to pick up some Bernie quotes, she took the sentences he spoke 20 seconds prior and used them against him.
Ding ding ding. When you say stuff like that it's just a simple statement of fact. Unless you are a Bernie groupie. The you get mad like :fire:

And ditto on the Harry Reid thing. You can't say people are dumb and vote off emotion and then try and act like people pay attention to anything other than war or general election time politics.
 

CHL

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yeah I guess I havent been in higher learning enough because there is a strong little group of posters with heavy socialist leanings that I didn't know about. It's hard to have a decent convo when people think they or the politicians they support are infallible.

The nikka basically Negged me because he didn't like who I was dapping :dead: welcome to higher learning yall
Is this a problem?
 

Jello Biafra

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honestly you are the only one I can remember that has kept it a buck. and we don't have any Hillary stans on this site, atleast that I've seen. Atlroc is fine with Hillary or trump. Dtown is fine with Hillary. Nobody is making 5 threads a day about why Bernie is trash or why if you don't vote for Hillary you are an ignorant c00n who can't vote in your own best interest and therefore deserve the worst of what politics has to offer
I think I have been lumped into the "Hillary Stan" category despite how many times I have explained my stance on this primary.:francis:
 

feelosofer

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Combination of problems here.

1. Sanders personally didn't run a good campaign in SC apparently. He has limitations. He has no longstanding ties to black voters as a support group.

2. The Clintons are liked by most black people. This is hard for lots to get their head around but the 90s were a great time for a lot of people economically. Many black people were lifted out of poverty by the 90s economy. And despite accusations of economic reductionism by sanders, the economy is still the most important issue to black voters and all voters. The issue here is that I suspect longing for the boom of the 90s to return superseded sanders welfare statism with SC blacks.

3. The nature of SC politically was bad for sanders. It's a state with next to no organized labor or independent political grassroots type organizations. Much of the democratic machinery is wrapped in old white party loyalists clubs and the black church. Sanders is not a democrat and thus has no ties to the old local democratic clubs and he had no inroads with the black churches. This is a divide that is exasperated by both sanders geographic isolation and cultural Jewery/spiritual Atheisim.

Clinton on the other hand has great connections within the remnants of the white southern Dems and the black church. The Clintons are southern democrats to the core, they understand how to manage their client groups and have been since the 70s. Clinton is of course also a Methodist and a southern, these matter when it comes to communication.

4. I think HRC's embrace of Obama was atleast partially successful. Black folk, especially older black women, love Obama. Exit polls showed that the perception of disrespect towards Obama on Romney and the GOP's account drove up black turnout and was a primary reason for many black voters.

By cynically painting Sanders as undermining Obama, HRC atleast partly tapped into this. Sanders personally failed to deflect this criticism well. Partly because in fact he and Obama do have pretty large disagreements on matters of policy. And despite sandera not really being an undermining force to Obama's incredibly modest progressive goals, he refused to disavow these differences. Though sanders could have pushed HRC harder on her own differences with Obama on foreign policy, she had an excellent defense of this in that despite these, Obama made her his SoS.

Though I dismissed these at the time, I think maybe cornel west's presence and prominence as a Sanders surrogate wasn't helpful on this front. West's flair for dramatic language has perhaps made him toxic even in the halls from whence he comes. I'm sure his declaration of John Lewis being a neoliberal sellout(which he sorta is, but decorum and all) will not be a helpful thing going forward.

5. I'm sure there are a fair amount of moderate, neoliberal black voters that just prefer those policies.

6. In the end, there are still bright spots. Sanders did better with younger voters. Only losing millennial blacks 45-55(compared to losing over 65 by ~95-3). This indicates that left economics remain a winner with the young across race. This indicates to me that a left candidate not as uniquely weak as sanders in these respects would do better against a moderate, establishment candidate not as uniquely strong in these respects.

The problem with this conclusion is that I currently see no left inheritors of Sandersism that has much stronger variables here. A Warren is marginally better for sure in a number aspects but not decisively. Someone like Keith Ellison has separate cultural barriers, tho he has the unique advantage of being black. Whereas the neoliberal establishment has thoroughbreds like Cory Booker at their disposal in the future.

However, the political landscape is ever changing. In 5 years, from Generalissimo Trump's Very Luxurious Day Spa/Internment Camp, the whole situation may be different.

Really interesting and well thought out analysis. +rep

This election has proved to me that the Clinton machine is too strong. I would prefer Bernie Sanders over Hilary (not that I think she'd be terrible). The fact is too many Blacks still stand behind Clinton for the reasons you supported right or wrong and Sander's doesn't have political jiu-jitsu moves Obama had when he ran.
 

No1

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yeah I guess I havent been in higher learning enough because there is a strong little group of posters with heavy socialist leanings that I didn't know about. It's hard to have a decent convo when people think they or the politicians they support are infallible.

The nikka basically Negged me because he didn't like who I was dapping :dead: welcome to higher learning yall
No, I negged you because I don't like disingenuous shyt. You were not the only person I negged when I said I hate everyone. I just mod the place so I have to come in here and read that garbage on my phone. No person who actually wants Sanders to win would spend as much time as you do trying to tear him down, it is completely illogical and I don't think you're stupid. So I just happen to think you're BSing. Don't invoke @Jello Biafra, he's contrarian as fukk and loves to be that way. But in there he will say some things that make sense. You do none of that.

You come in and go :umad: at Sanders supporters and dip out. Jello and I sat there and were telling people who were new to politics how shyt works when they were getting mad at people who voted Clinton as two dudes who would rather Sanders, where were you at? Trolling like always. LOL@ there being no Hillary stans. You have ACTIVELY rooted for Sanders to lose so his "stans" go away instead of trying to educate those people, and you're wondering why people think you're fugazi? I have shytted on racially insensitive Sander supporters more than you have and no one calls me a Hillary shill even when they were mad that I called her a progressive. Have several seats bro. You're a good dude but you look corny on this topic and there's no way around it.
 

rapbeats

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Combination of problems here.

1. Sanders personally didn't run a good campaign in SC apparently. He has limitations. He has no longstanding ties to black voters as a support group.

2. The Clintons are liked by most black people. This is hard for lots to get their head around but the 90s were a great time for a lot of people economically. Many black people were lifted out of poverty by the 90s economy. And despite accusations of economic reductionism by sanders, the economy is still the most important issue to black voters and all voters. The issue here is that I suspect longing for the boom of the 90s to return superseded sanders welfare statism with SC blacks.

....

the rest of what you said is true but not needed for this discussion.

#1. we all have TV's now. most of us have the internet. if you can't find out who sanders and hillary are. Shame on you. and thats the point. SHAME ON these black folks older ones especially. i know grandmas that know how to click a youtube video. everyone has a smart phone. stop it. no excuses. the debates tell you all you need to know. again all on TV. STOPIT.

#2. broke blacks were still broke in the 90's. NOW there was a side of us that were working because everyone working. since all of our jobs were not overseas yet. but the moment you find out that Bill Billy help send those jobs overseas FIRST. you have to be like oh, now i see who my real friends are. and the clintons are not them. but NOPE. we dont pay attention to anything. we just run behind people like zombies. its pathetic.
 

SirReginald

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the rest of what you said is true but not needed for this discussion.

#1. we all have TV's now. most of us have the internet. if you can't find out who sanders and hillary are. Shame on you. and thats the point. SHAME ON these black folks older ones especially. i know grandmas that know how to click a youtube video. everyone has a smart phone. stop it. no excuses. the debates tell you all you need to know. again all on TV. STOPIT.

#2. broke blacks were still broke in the 90's. NOW there was a side of us that were working because everyone working. since all of our jobs were not overseas yet. but the moment you find out that Bill Billy help send those jobs overseas FIRST. you have to be like oh, now i see who my real friends are. and the clintons are not them. but NOPE. we dont pay attention to anything. we just run behind people like zombies. its pathetic.
EXACTLY
 

wire28

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No, I negged you because I don't like disingenuous shyt. You were not the only person I negged when I said I hate everyone. I just mod the place so I have to come in here and read that garbage on my phone. No person who actually wants Sanders to win would spend as much time as you do trying to tear him down, it is completely illogical and I don't think you're stupid. So I just happen to think you're BSing. Don't invoke @Jello Biafra, he's contrarian as fukk and loves to be that way. But in there he will say some things that make sense. You do none of that.

You come in and go :umad: at Sanders supporters and dip out. Jello and I sat there and were telling people who were new to politics how shyt works when they were getting mad at people who voted Clinton as two dudes who would rather Sanders, where were you at? Trolling like always. LOL@ there being no Hillary stans. You have ACTIVELY rooted for Sanders to lose so his "stans" go away instead of trying to educate those people, and you're wondering why people think you're fugazi? I have shytted on racially insensitive Sander supporters more than you have and no one calls me a Hillary shill even when they were mad that I called her a progressive. Have several seats bro. You're a good dude but you look corny on this topic and there's no way around it.
Your emotions are/were overflowing thats why you negged me. You are acting like a 13 year old girl who is in dire need of her diary when it comes to Bernie. Block me if im annoying you so much. And fukk out of here all I was doing in here at first was asking questions like what is his plan B and you and the rest of you stans took it as a shot at his viability rather than a legit concern worthy of a decent reply. ANY fukkING QUESTION concerning Bernie is taken as a shot or pro-hillary comment. fukk out of here man you annoying me now with your high and mighty bull shyt. fukk out my face with that weak bull shyt.

Is this a problem?
it is when they the also happen to fall into the category of the second sentence, which you omitted. as i have said numerous times i have no problems agreeing to disagree with people. nobody in here knows the answer to everything so people can stop acting like they do. i do have problems with people who think their viewpoint is the end all be all or people like @Abogado who are mods and catch feelings because they dont like who im dapping like this is high school while pretending to be above the fray

dear diary, wire upset me again today....
 
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Red Shield

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Wake up and stop following the establishment...very few positive things happened in the last 30 or so years that have benefited black people that either voted Democrat or stayed at home and let the Republican candidate win. This election was a real golden opportunity for not only African Americans but the working class as a whole to make a statement and start change in this country. In the course of this election we have seen Hillary fall apart again with the Email scandal...a 14 minute youtube compilation of "Hilldawg" contradicting herself and blatant proof that she is funded by Wall Street (working for the current establishment). Bernie showed that his campaign and policies where going to challenge the status quo and try to help the African Americans and the working class making them his priority instead of rich cacs. Hillary called Black children "Super Predators". Her husband signed off on NAFTA and the 3 strikes rule, and Obama (who Hillary will follow) just signed away even more jobs here in America with the TPP. It is really depressing to see that our people are still mentally shackled and will not fight for any sort of positive change. :snoop:

meh all our people have ever done in this country is fight for positive change. :manny:
 

The_Sheff

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the rest of what you said is true but not needed for this discussion.

#1. we all have TV's now. most of us have the internet. if you can't find out who sanders and hillary are. Shame on you. and thats the point. SHAME ON these black folks older ones especially. i know grandmas that know how to click a youtube video. everyone has a smart phone. stop it. no excuses. the debates tell you all you need to know. again all on TV. STOPIT.

#2. broke blacks were still broke in the 90's. NOW there was a side of us that were working because everyone working. since all of our jobs were not overseas yet. but the moment you find out that Bill Billy help send those jobs overseas FIRST. you have to be like oh, now i see who my real friends are. and the clintons are not them. but NOPE. we dont pay attention to anything. we just run behind people like zombies. its pathetic.

If you are depending on the youth and informed voters to win an election you already lost.
 
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