Over/Under ObamaCare gets Repealed? *Edit* Entire Law Upheld

[VerbalIntercourse]

Brilliant. So by your logic, since the US highway system cost about $425 billion in input without any direct output besides paltry toll collection, we should no longer subsidize the US highway system.

Output isn't always quantifiable in accounting revenue. There is definitely a benefit to having the freeway systems. They were intended as a defense measure, and it's hard to measure the benefit of National fortification without an active market.

If an Artist takes a rock and turns it into a sculpture, it may or may not generate revenue, but that doesn't mean he did not add value through his production process. He certainly added value in his own mind.

The Freeway systems probably could generate much more accounting revenue if they used the right measures. Who knows?

That's why it's better to have an active market. With an Active market value and profitability can be quickly assessed. If a market could invest or purchase freeways, i'm sure some would be much more valuable than others and many would no longer be in existence.

 

[DalMem]

Tamron Hall is so sexy claudehavemercy

Dog I was just thinking the same thing while watching MSNBC.

 

[714562]

Output isn't always quantifiable in accounting revenue.

There is definitely a benefit to having the freeway systems. They were intended as a defense measure, and it's hard to measure the benefit of National fortification without an active market.

Ohhhh, so we're talking about UNQUANTIFIABLE output now?

Do I really have to get into the "unquantifiable" output of rail? Less traffic? Less pollution? Less repeated construction to accommodate more and more road vehicles? More economic activity in inner cities?

If an Artist takes a rock and turns it into a sculpture, it may or may not generate revenue, but that doesn't mean he did not add value through his production process. He certainly added value in his own mind.

Irrelevant hypothetical.

The Freeway systems probably could generate much more accounting revenue if they used the right measures. Who knows?

...oh, so now they're not using the right measures?

TThat's why it's better to have an active market. With an Active market value and profitability can be quickly assessed. If a market could invest or purchase freeways, i'm sure some would be much more valuable than others and many would no longer be in existence.

...oh, so it's always better to have an active market for everything?

 

[ExodusNirvana]

false. If there was demand for mass transit the market would provide for it.

It is because of the Freeway system created by the government that allowed for the sprawl that necessitated cars.

This is so stupid...even back on KTL people generally agreed that YES in some cases the free market could handle things but mass transit it not one of them

Some companies already provide mass transit for their employees. I know apple and GOOGlE have mass transit programs for their employees.

No it wouldn't be like Public Mass transit, but who wants to ride that crap anyways? I don't. I hate it. It's dirty and the people are ghetto and annoying. I don't want to be on those things especially the buses.

WTFFFFFFFFFFFFF IS THIS DUDE TALKING ABOUT?? How is that comparable!!

 

[VerbalIntercourse]

Ohhhh, so we're talking about UNQUANTIFIABLE output now?

Do I really have to get into the "unquantifiable" output of rail? Less traffic? Less pollution? Less repeated construction to accommodate more and more road vehicles? More economic activity in inner cities?

Those definitely can be benefits to Mass transit, but there are costs. Higher taxes. additionally, people would rather not be crammed like sardines into train carts, but it's hard to quantify that cost of that displeasure. Those Benefits would have to exceed the costs.

Irrelevant hypothetical.

Is it? I think it's perfect example of how value can be different from person to person, and it's the market that, to say in a less that optimally descriptive way, takes the averages of everyone wants and desires and puts a price on it.

...oh, so now they're not using the right measures?

No they're not. I think there should be tolls that vary with use for one. High traffic times, that impact the freeway system, shouldn't be free-use time periods. People should be charged accordingly for their use of the freeway at all times preferably, but The toll lanes out here and in Socal are steps in the right direction.

...oh, so it's always better to have an active market for everything?

Definitely. it's really hard to assess value without a market. How else is it possible?

 

[Dusty Bake Activate]

Neg on sight. John Roberts Outrages Conservatives In Health Care Ruling

 

[TheHonorableOmarSharif]

 

[714562]

Those definitely can be benefits to Mass transit, but there are costs. Higher taxes. additionally, people would rather not be crammed like sardines into train carts, but it's hard to quantify that cost of that displeasure. Those Benefits would have to exceed the costs.

Oh, so you don't pay for a federal highway with taxes?

Is it? I think it's perfect example of how value can be different from person to person, and it's the market that, to say in a less that optimally descriptive way, takes the averages of everyone wants and desires and puts a price on it.

The entire example is completely irrelevant to the discussion we are having because it is implicit for very basic situations. This is not such a situation.

No they're not. I think there should be tolls that vary with use for one. High traffic times, that impact the freeway system, shouldn't be free-use time periods. People should be charged accordingly for their use of the freeway at all times preferably, but The toll lanes out here and in Socal are steps in the right direction.

Oh, so instead of raising taxes to build a cleaner mass transit system, you want more tolls (the equivalent of raising taxes) to maintain the old one.

Perfect

Definitely. it's really hard to assess value without a market. How else is it possible?

Cool. So let's abolish all of our agricultural subsidies tomorrow. Oh wait. Let's not. Because that's a terrible idea.

There are plenty of ways markets can fail -- non-excludability, externalities, etc.

 

[the next guy]

Neg on sight. John Roberts Outrages Conservatives In Health Care Ruling

ruthless.

 

[Street Knowledge]

Since when toure got a show on MSNBC?

 

[VerbalIntercourse]

Oh, so you don't pay for a federal highway with taxes?

The few pennies of your taxes that go towards the Interstate highway system don't really work towards you fully realizing the costs of your personal freeway use. I'm sure you aware of the tragedy of the commons.

The entire example is completely irrelevant to the discussion we are having because it is implicit.

It's not. It goes to the core of the discussion of Production and value.

Oh, so instead of raising taxes to build a cleaner mass transit system, you want more tolls (the equivalent of raising taxes) to maintain the old one.

Perfect

Tolls would decrease use of the freeway system and would push more people towards using mass transit. If anything, a toll would create more demand for mass transit. The core problem with the freeway system is that people can use it virtually for free, and it's convenient. On the one hand there is mass transit, which many people, in California atleast, associate with being broke, filthiness and criminals, and on the other hand there is a completely free use of the freeway system that is individualistic and always convenient. Mass transit is a hard sell, that is, unless people fully realize their own personal cost of use the freeway systems.

If tomorrow, there was a toll of 15 dollars to drive on the freeway at 5pm, I guarantee that many people would opt out and take mass transit. That's good thing in my eyes, and it has the consequence of reduced traffic and pollution.

Cool. So let's abolish all of our agricultural subsidies tomorrow.

.

Definitely, I think all subsidies should be abolished. Look at where corn subsidies have gotten us. High Fructose corn syrup is in everything because it is so cheap, and it makes unhealthy snacks significantly cheaper than other healthier alternatives.

 

[Broke Wave]

I'm kind of angry that the supreme court didn't over rule this decision.


CLEARY it is constitutional, and all of it should have been upheld from strictly a legal standpoint, but politically the law is garbage, and would have helped a Romney win, s so I am against this decision.

 

[714562]

Tolls would decrease use of the freeway system and would push more people towards using mass transit. If anything, a toll would create more demand for mass transit. The core problem with the freeway system is that people can use it virtually for free, and it's convenient. On the one hand there is mass transit, which many people, in California atleast, associate with being broke, filthiness and criminals, and on the other hand there is a completely free use of the freeway system that is individualistic and always convenient. Mass transit is a hard sell, that is, unless people fully realize their own personal cost of use the freeway systems.

If tomorrow, there was a toll of 15 dollars to drive on the freeway at 5pm, I guarantee that many people would opt out and take mass transit. That's good thing in my eyes, and it has the consequence of reduced traffic and pollution.

So you want to place more tolls on highways on top of the inevitable government money it would take to build more mass transit?

Definitely, I think all subsidies should be abolished. Look at where corn subsidies have gotten us. High Fructose corn syrup is in everything because it is so cheap, and it makes unhealthy snacks significantly cheaper than other healthier alternatives.

...remember how you said highways were good for national security? You know what else is good for national security? Domestically produced food.

 

[DalMem]

Since when toure got a show on MSNBC?

I know.

I can't stand his punkass.

 

[VerbalIntercourse]

So you want to place more tolls on highways on top of the inevitable government money it would take to build more mass transit?

Mass transit funding is not qualifying condition for tolls.

...remember how you said highways were good for national security? You know what else is good for national security? Domestically produced food.

Californian grown produce can command 10X the domestic price in foreign markets.

For example, in Taiwan, a pound of Californian Cherries is about 30 to 40 dollars a pound at the market. Something tells me that subsidies are not needed for food production in the united states.

Its one of our best exporting goods.