Outriders dev didn't get royalties yet, Square won't say how much it sold

[Gizmo_Duck]

Spot on. Comparing games to music, TV and movies isn’t smart. Gizmo hit the nail on the head here.

As you mentioned earlier, this is a great case study for ‘AAA’ single player Game Pass day 1 release without MTX. Actually, Outriders is probably closer to ‘AA’ which makes the situation more dire.

>>As of June 1, Outriders did ‘3.5 million unique players with 31 hours average each player’. This number includes sales from Playstation, PC, Xbox as well as Game Pass downloads. <<

Outriders boasts 3.5 million unique players since launch

^ That seems like a successful game to me. To see no profits from that is criminal. How much is a Game Pass download and completion worth?

Seriously, if we are being real here, only have 1 data point with hard numbers for a game that released on Game Pass as well as being sold separately and coincidentally its from Sony.

>>MLB did around 2Ms in sales and had 4M ‘players’. Sony noted to investors that MLB exceeded expectations due to ‘MLB The Show 21 contributed “significantly” to sales and profits during the quarter thanks in part to strong DLC sales.’<<

Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart and MLB The Show 21 Exceeded Expectations; Sony Comments on Acquisitions

Is this a ratio we should apply to other Day 1 GP releases? Or should we look at sales splits from UK charts for games like Hades (93% sales on PS, 7% sales on XB).

UK Sales Charts: GTA 5 Just Keeps on Selling, Hades Makes Top 10

…just some data points to think about…

Also, a lot of good talking points brought up in the thread. Im going to add a few more.

• The CEO saying this publicly isnt a good look for Square or Xbox Game Pass (even if only by association) since Square was loud and proud about the number of players, hours played and how they want to continue this as a franchise.
  
• This won’t be the last time we hear about this
• Playstation’s former head Shawn Layden and Take Two boss Strauss Zelnick know what they are talking about when saying AAA/frontline games don’t work on GP
• Xbox and Microsoft are taking a HUGE loss leader position with Game Pass because only they can do it ($$$) and in the long term if it succeeds it will only benefit them
• Edit: I don’t believe Game Pass or similar services will lead to a healthier industry

You get it.

…And people here were so quick to write off Shawn Layden despite him having actual years of experience and a look behind the curtain on a lot of this stuff. I’m sure they ran the same numbers when he was still top dawg at sony and it looked terrifying.

It’s also why we haven’t heard about any other big budget 3rd party game deals since outriders and MLB. Certainly not single player games, despite xbox insiders claiming scarlet nexus would be on gamepass, then battlefield, then tales of arise…etc

If the gamepass numbers were so great why are there no other 3rd party pubs jumping on it? Outside of Indie games with a small enough budget to make the upfront money worth it?

 

[Pressure]

What does this have to do with game pass?

After @Gizmo_Duck learned returnal only sold 500k he stopped playing it.

Like when he stanned cyberpunk only to reverse course weeks after he beat the game because it was removed from the playstation store.



Thread isn't serious.

 

[Red Shield]

Square fukking with them

Outriders did way better then anyone expected it to

 

[Leasy]

Spot on. Comparing games to music, TV and movies isn’t smart. Gizmo hit the nail on the head here.

As you mentioned earlier, this is a great case study for ‘AAA’ single player Game Pass day 1 release without MTX. Actually, Outriders is probably closer to ‘AA’ which makes the situation more dire.

>>As of June 1, Outriders did ‘3.5 million unique players with 31 hours average each player’. This number includes sales from Playstation, PC, Xbox as well as Game Pass downloads. <<

Outriders boasts 3.5 million unique players since launch

^ That seems like a successful game to me. To see no profits from that is criminal. How much is a Game Pass download and completion worth?

Seriously, if we are being real here, only have 1 data point with hard numbers for a game that released on Game Pass as well as being sold separately and coincidentally its from Sony.

>>MLB did around 2Ms in sales and had 4M ‘players’. Sony noted to investors that MLB exceeded expectations due to ‘MLB The Show 21 contributed “significantly” to sales and profits during the quarter thanks in part to strong DLC sales.’<<

Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart and MLB The Show 21 Exceeded Expectations; Sony Comments on Acquisitions

Is this a ratio we should apply to other Day 1 GP releases? Or should we look at sales splits from UK charts for games like Hades (93% sales on PS, 7% sales on XB).

UK Sales Charts: GTA 5 Just Keeps on Selling, Hades Makes Top 10

…just some data points to think about…

Also, a lot of good talking points brought up in the thread. Im going to add a few more.

• The CEO saying this publicly isnt a good look for Square or Xbox Game Pass (even if only by association) since Square was loud and proud about the number of players, hours played and how they want to continue this as a franchise.
  
• This won’t be the last time we hear about this
• Playstation’s former head Shawn Layden and Take Two boss Strauss Zelnick know what they are talking about when saying AAA/frontline games don’t work on GP
• Xbox and Microsoft are taking a HUGE loss leader position with Game Pass because only they can do it ($$$) and in the long term if it succeeds it will only benefit them
• Edit: I don’t believe Game Pass or similar services will lead to a healthier industry

Gamepass all in Yall mouth with the smallest market share of systems but gamepass at fault . Yall pitiful

 

[Dallas' 4 Eva]

@ Sony stans - Gamepass is here to stay. There may be growing pains right now with how and what works on the service, but it isn't going anywhere no matter how you feel about it because one day Microsoft is going to make boatloads of money off of it. You are also in denial if you think Sony isn't getting ready to drop their subscription service on you, it will just operate different from Gamepass in how you can access and consume the content. Gamepass is like Netflix, Sony's will be like Disney+.

@ xbox stans - the concerns that gamers have with the quality of games aren't just talking shyt. You are blind if you don't see the noticeable drop in quality in movies, music, and TV since streaming services became the standard for the market. There needs to be a happy mediun found between the two. You can't expect AAA quality games 3 to 4 times a year for $15 a month without some way to monetize the game post release(either in the form of numerous paid DLC's or micro transactions out the ass).

Sony has their lane, Microsoft has theirs.

 

[Leasy]

@ Sony stans - Gamepass is here to stay. There may be growing pains right now with how and what works on the service, but it isn't going anywhere no matter how you feel about it because one day Microsoft is going to make boatloads of money off of it. You are also in denial if you think Sony isn't getting ready to drop their subscription service on you, it will just operate different from Gamepass in how you can access and consume the content. Gamepass is like Netflix, Sony's will be like Disney+.

@ xbox stans - the concerns that gamers have with the quality of games aren't just talking shyt. You are blind if you don't see the noticeable drop in quality in movies, music, and TV since streaming services became the standard for the market. There needs to be a happy mediun found between the two. You can't expect AAA quality games 3 to 4 times a year for $15 a month without some way to monetize the game post release(either in the form of numerous paid DLC's or micro transactions out the ass).

Sony has their lane, Microsoft has theirs.

Your view point of Xbox I disagree with. Music and movie declined started before streaming services especially with rap. Games been a shytty mess since last generation started before gaming services were available. Streaming services will actually allow game developers and publishers to be more flexible in their release of games. Microsoft can make a chance to develop an AA title such as Grounded or Sea of Theives while also releasing a Halo Starfield Elders etc..

The streaming service will actually help Sony because they don't want to make chances anymore. They have so many titles that won't see the day due to them expecting to sale 7 to 10 million to recoup a 100 plus development cost. Streaming will be good for all gamers and people of all income.

What we are seeing is Microsoft again moving gaming to a direction that is needed. Gaming streaming service and the cloud.

 

[CarltonJunior]

Thats like saying piracy = lost sale. Everything people download that doesn't mean if they couldn't they'd buy.

It's up to the publishers and Microsoft to figure this out like the music industry did and the TV industry did and the film industry is having to do now.

Subscription based services are the future of entertainment. People don't want to be nicked and dimed on individual transactions just to play a game.

Now that I have Spotify I'm not going back to buying every album.

Yeah, I'd be shocked if they didn't pay them per download. Subscription based services are supposed to pay for content engagement, M$ already made their money from the subscription, so they supposed to kick back the money to Square for providing the game which is helping people stay subscribed, and a % of that money is supposed to go to the dev team.

 

[Gizmo_Duck]

@ Sony stans - Gamepass is here to stay. There may be growing pains right now with how and what works on the service, but it isn't going anywhere no matter how you feel about it because one day Microsoft is going to make boatloads of money off of it. You are also in denial if you think Sony isn't getting ready to drop their subscription service on you, it will just operate different from Gamepass in how you can access and consume the content. Gamepass is like Netflix, Sony's will be like Disney+.

The problem is you think I’m just blanket-hating on gamepass due to stan wars and you’re not actually reading what I’m saying. Actual analyst have since came out and pretty much said the same thing. I understand people are excited for an “all games all the time for a low price service” but there are caveats to it that yall are putting blinders on because it seems like such a good bargain at the moment.





This guy like christopher dring and mat piscatella are actually analyst that get real numbers on sales. They aren’t youtubers just talking shyt

 

[Leasy]

The problem is you think I’m just blanket-hating on gamepass due to stan wars and you’re not actually reading what I’m saying. Actual analyst have since came out and pretty much said the same thing. I understand people are excited for an “all games all the time for a low price service” but there are caveats to it that yall are putting blinders on because it seems like such a good bargain at the moment.





This guy like christopher dring and mat piscatella are actually analyst that get real numbers on sales. They aren’t youtubers just talking shyt

They don't get it. You can't compared the amount of users on gamepass and assume every 20 million gamer will buy the game. Sony sold 100 million plus consoles but only sold 10 million copies of God of War. Their arguments is stupid and they should know this being analyst. Xbox hold the smallest market share compared to PS/PC/Switch. Why is gamepass being blamed when the larger markets didn't buy the game as well.

Y'all not making any sense. Compared to other games which were actually good sold more copies once they hit Gamepass. Gamepass is not stopping anybody from buying titles. MLB sold crazy on Xbox.

 

[Gizmo_Duck]

They don't get it. You can't compared the amount of users on gamepass and assume every 20 million gamer will buy the game. Sony sold 100 million plus consoles but only sold 10 million copies of God of War. Their arguments is stupid and they should know this being analyst. Xbox hold the smallest market share compared to PS/PC/Switch. Why is gamepass being blamed when the larger markets didn't buy the game as well.

Y'all not making any sense. Compared to other games which were actually good sold more copies once they hit Gamepass. Gamepass is not stopping anybody from buying titles. MLB sold crazy on Xbox.

Naw you don’t get it, MLB has micro transactions, a lot of them, which is where sony made the brunt of its sales, not on the game itself. What David Gibson is saying is that for a single player AA game the gamepass offer that microsoft gave them doesn’t outweighs loss of retail sales. The whole, “its on gamepass so it will get a lot of free advertising through word of mouth and sell more even on other platforms” thing doesn’t really hold weight and there just hasn’t been any real proof of that happening.

 

[Leasy]

Naw you don’t get it, MLB has micro transactions, a lot of them, which is where sony made the brunt of its sales, not on the game itself. What David Gibson is saying is that for a single player AA game the gamepass offer that microsoft gave them doesn’t outweighs loss of retail sales. The whole, “its on gamepass so it will get a lot of free advertising through word of mouth and sell more even on other platforms” thing doesn’t really hold weight and there just hasn’t been any real proof of that happening.

Just stop argument would be better if the game wasn't ass
https://www.gamereactor.eu/npdanalyst-still-no-sign-that-game-pass-cannibalises-sales-volume/
Game Pass Launch Helps The Ascent Achieve $5 Million In Sales
"For Descenders, it has been immense. Sales across all platforms increased after we went into Game Pass" – What does Game Pass mean for indies? | Business News | MCV/DEVELOP

 

[Gizmo_Duck]

Just stop argument would be better if the game wasn't ass
https://www.gamereactor.eu/npdanalyst-still-no-sign-that-game-pass-cannibalises-sales-volume/
Game Pass Launch Helps The Ascent Achieve $5 Million In Sales
"For Descenders, it has been immense. Sales across all platforms increased after we went into Game Pass" – What does Game Pass mean for indies? | Business News | MCV/DEVELOP

Yes, for indie publishers, it works…no one is arguing that. It’s a lot easier to manage a dev team of 11 with a 3 million dollar budget then a major studio

 

[Loose]

Came in here for a second, man yall still on this immature shyt? Jesus. When i wad 18-21 sure but we 30+ grown men now . Some of yall nikkas grandfathers

 

[Leasy]

Yes, for indie publishers, it works…no one is arguing that. It’s a lot easier to manage a dev team of 11 with a 3 million dollar budget then a major studio

Bro the game failed because it sucked and was underwhelming just like Avengers. Square Enix is ass

 

[Gizmo_Duck]

Bro the game failed because it sucked and was underwhelming just like Avengers. Square Enix is ass

You seemed to have a very different tone here…

But Gamepass don’t work: Outriders, a Game Pass game, is #1 Top Paid Games on Xbox

Top paid games - Microsoft Store

Developers will see this and more than likely add their titles to Gamepass