Obama Ties Broken Families To Gun Violence In Emotional Chicago Speech

[theworldismine13]

Obama has not done what he said he was gonna do. Guantanamo, "big business", repealing Bush tax cuts, taking a harder line with Iran, etc. etc. Obama has fallen short on a laundry list of items he called "top priorities" in his 2008 campaign

And for the 20th time, I never said anything about workplace discrimination being the pillar of black progress... you are beginning to piss me off with all these points you assign to me that I don't make

And who did you vote for in 2012?



Joe

Obama has done pretty much all he said he was gonna do, this is news to me that Guantanamo was a "top priority", he said he would, then he found he couldn't and I don't really care personally, he did end the bush tax cuts and he didn't say he would take a hard line with Iran he said he would seek to open up dialogue with Iran

I'm not really saying that you are saying that work place is a pillar, I'm just explaining why I downplay it and that it's not a factor in analyzing obama

You said that work place enforcement is lacking and I said that is false, if you have evidence that civil rights enforcement is lagging in the Obama administration then post it, cuz I can tell you right now that you are lying, holder is a strong liberal, that dude is very strong when it comes to civil rights

So I'm not accusing you of saying work discrimination is a pillar, I'm accusing you of lying about obama's records, and I'm saying that even if he was lagging n fighting work discrimination that it wouldn't make me regret my vote

Do you even follow your own posts? I downplayed work place discrimination when talking to newarkhiphop, and you stepped in incredulously and asked why I don't think work place discrimination is important, and then i explained that its not a decisive factor in black progress, I'm not putting words in your mouth I'm answering the question that you posed as to why I downplay workplace discrimination

Biden is a POS for his role in the PIC, but at the end of the day the choices we had were

2008: first black president + POS or POS + retard

2012: 2 POS backed by party that is partially racist or 2 POS affiliated w/the party of Lee Atwater

You keep saying we shoudl champion blacks who vote Republican but offer no reason why we should vote Republican besides "exercising intellectual freedom"... should someone vote counter to their interests just for the sake of exercising the ability to choose?

If you can rationalize voting for a racist person that created a system that you believe to be the most damaging thing ever to black people, why isn't Tim Scott allowed to rationalize his support for republicans?

What I said is that black people should vote for whoever the fuk they want to vote for and I have no beef with tim Scott or any other black republican and I don't consider them sellouts like you do

I'm not championing republicans I'm championing intellectual freedom

 

[MeachTheMonster]

Just read through the thread and

A lot of good point were made on both sides.

In my opinion all of the problems discussed here can be reduced to one cause POVERTY.

yes culture is an issue, as well as racism, or the PIC. But in reality all of this boils down to poverty.

People don't see the value in an education because they are broke and hungry. People commit crimes and join into the PIC because they are broke and hungry. Racism is and always will be there, but those who are educated and financially stable can combat the effects of racism, the poor can not.

Obama gets a lot of blame/criticism for the condition of the black community(which is still better off now than it ever has been in the past) but in reality he's concentrated on the two issues that we need the most, education and economic opportunity. If we can fix those two issues, the rest will fall in line automatically.

 

[Juneya]

While I personally thought this was a good speech, this was a lose-lose situation. I think that the things he said are things that he truly believes based on his cumulative experiences as a person and his time as a community organizer as well as Chigaco politian. I don't think the things he said about the violence being cultural are conservative platitudes to him, but his real actual beliefs. Be that for better or worse. But he also spoke of his own experiences honestly, and I appreciated that.

Quite frankly, a few years ago, I would have beaten up Obama for 'talking down' to Black people the same way, I did when Bill Cosby said something similar but you know what I am more inclined to agree with these two as the years go by. Yes, we need to make changes to the drug wars, but Obama doesn't have the power to do all that by himself even if he had a Democratic Congress and he's done quite a bit and in doing so will curb the construction of the industrial prison complex, but that's neither here or there problem in Chicago is two parts economical and cultural and he was right to address that in this particular forum because that can have the most immediate impact in the streets in Chicago and elsewhere.

In other word had Obama talked to much policy, he would have been seen as political pandering and if he spoke from the heart, people would say 'he
s not really one of us' and 'what gives him the right to judge'

Let's be real Obama was walking into a minefield.

Which is why he avoids it soo much. Its a lose lose conversation. Nothing he says will be right and nothing he does will be enough

 

[Jello Biafra]

Just read through the thread and


Obama gets a lot of blame/criticism for the condition of the black community(which is still better off now than it ever has been in the past) but in reality he's concentrated on the two issues that we need the most, education and economic opportunity. If we can fix those two issues, the rest will fall in line automatically.

White Americans have 22 times more wealth than blacks -- a gap that nearly doubled during the Great Recession.

The median household net worth for whites was $110,729 in 2010, versus $4,995 for blacks, according to recently released Census Bureau figures.

The difference is similarly notable when it comes to Hispanics, who had a median household net worth of $7,424. The ratio between white and Hispanic wealth expanded to 15 to 1.

The gap between the races widened considerably during the recent economic downturn, which whites weathered better than blacks, Hispanics and Asians.

The latter three groups saw their median household net worth fall by roughly 60% between 2005 and 2010, while the median net worth for white households slipped only 23%.

The racial wealth divide is nothing new. Black and Hispanic Americans have historically had lower incomes, higher unemployment and less education.

That makes it more difficult for these groups to save money and put their capital to work building wealth, said Tatjana Meschede, research director of the Institute on Assets and Social Policy at Brandeis University.

The Great Recession exacerbated the problem. In 2005, the net worth difference wasn't quite as stark. Whites had 12 times more wealth than blacks and 8 times more than Hispanics.

Recession widens the wealth gap by race - Jun. 21, 2012

 

[Gravity]

There is def an element of black inferiority in the media but lets keep it real

"White superiority" has nothing to do w/the success of Tyler Perry, for example. "White superiority" has nothing to do with the proliferation of goofy black reality shows like Love And Hip Hop. "White superiority" has nothing to do with the continued success of hardcore/gangsta rap and the fact that its messages resonate so deeply w/us, even in its hypocrisy and short sightedness. Its important to recognize when white America plays games- for example the "magical negro" phenomenon in Hollywood- but to argue that that outside force is the controlling factor in where we are? You can *maybe* argue that some acts/incidents steered us one way over the other, and some aspects of America encourage bad decisions, but at the end of the day we still have free will/decision making power and misuse it.

This talk of segregation and making enemies out of a white boogeyman is just creating a vehicle to abandon personal responsibility. Even if white America controlled us at the end of the day that is beyond our control. We have to focus on what we can control... which right now are the choices/decisions we make on a daily basis, and how we leverage our power to use the system to get what we want.

This post is so ignorant that it's insulting. You've ignored several key points that I've made to continue to post dumb shyt. The way you put quotation marks around white superiority and your use of a term like "white boogeyman" implies that you don't think that institutional white supremacy is real. It's like you're implying that institutional racism is just something that I've made up to use as an excuse for our community. If that's your position then you're an even bigger fool than I imagined. What do you mean that "white superiority" has nothing to do with the success of Tyler Perry? You aren't saying that racism in Hollywood doesn't exist because Tyler Perry has become successful, are you? Please tell me that you aren't really this clueless? Of course racism plays a major part in the proliferation of shows like love & hiphop and the promotion of certain kinds of rap music. Our society perpetuates black inferiority which is why the only images of us that are shown in the media are negative. you're insultingly ignorant.

How in the world does advocating segregation(economic segregation to be specific) promote abandoning personal responsibility at the same time? I'm all about personal responsibility which is why my position is that we must do everything for us and by us. Yes we have to focus on what we can control, and that starts with uniting with each other. This every black person for theirself mindset isn't working for us as a whole. The system is set up to keep our community at the bottom, and it's always been like that. That's not an excuse its a fact. Institutional white supremacy/black inferiority is not some "boogeyman" that doesnt really exist, it's a reality of life in Amerikkka. We all agree that blacks have to do better, obviously there are glaring problems within our community. How do we go about solving those problems is the question? I don't see you offering any solutions. Standing there with your hands on your hips nose in the air repeating "blacks have got to do better" over and over isn't going to solve anything. We all can see that too many within our community exhibit self destructive behavior, but you cannot solve that problem without understanding why so many within our community are self destructive. Why are so many within our community so self destructive in your opinion? Do you think that there are reasons for the state of our community or do you think that a lot of blacks are just born that way? Get off that simple shyt and start thinking critically. The problems in our community are complex, so are the causes and solutions.

 

[MeachTheMonster]

Not comparing us to whites. As you guys seem to use as a measuring stick. Compare us to ourselves and see that we are way better off than we ever have been.

 

[TLR Is Mental Poison]

This post is so ignorant that it's insulting. You've ignored several key points that I've made to continue to post dumb shyt. The way you put quotation marks around white superiority and your use of a term like "white boogeyman" implies that you don't think that institutional white supremacy is real. It's like you're implying that institutional racism is just something that I've made up to use as an excuse for our community. If that's your position then you're an even bigger fool than I imagined. What do you mean that "white superiority" has nothing to do with the success of Tyler Perry? You aren't saying that racism in Hollywood doesn't exist because Tyler Perry has become successful, are you? Please tell me that you aren't really this clueless? Of course racism plays a major part in the proliferation of shows like love & hiphop and the promotion of certain kinds of rap music. Our society perpetuates black inferiority which is why the only images of us that are shown in the media are negative. you're insultingly ignorant.

In the post you quoted I not only acknowledged the existence of racism in Hollywood but cited an example

But I brought up Tyler Perry to say that for whatever reason when given the choice we support the lowest of the low. Its a transcendental theme, from the most popular rappers, to Tyler Perry's movies, to the unbridled support of the likes of Eddie Long... over the last 10-20 years we have not only had a glut of leadership, but an appetite for fukkery

How in the world does advocating segregation(economic segregation to be specific) promote abandoning personal responsibility at the same time?

Because its a deflection of the root cause of a lot of our woes... bad decision making. What is the argument for economic segregation, when you consider that if we had the tools to play in corporate America we could easily use it to our advantage? I agree that we should have more black enterprise, but at the same time corporate America is an easy tool to use to gain wealth. We shouldn't be passing up avenues to build capital for no reason

I'm all about personal responsibility which is why my position is that we must do everything for us and by us. Yes we have to focus on what we can control, and that starts with uniting with each other. This every black person for theirself mindset isn't working for us as a whole. The system is set up to keep our community at the bottom, and it's always been like that. That's not an excuse its a fact. Institutional white supremacy/black inferiority is not some "boogeyman" that doesnt really exist, it's a reality of life in Amerikkka. We all agree that blacks have to do better, obviously there are glaring problems within our community. How do we go about solving those problems is the question? I don't see you offering any solutions. Standing there with your hands on your hips nose in the air repeating "blacks have got to do better" over and over isn't going to solve anything. We all can see that too many within our community exhibit self destructive behavior, but you cannot solve that problem without understanding why so many within our community are self destructive. Why are so many within our community so self destructive in your opinion? Do you think that there are reasons for the state of our community or do you think that a lot of blacks are just born that way? Get off that simple shyt and start thinking critically. The problems in our community are complex, so are the causes and solutions.

Like I said to TWISM institutional racism is real and is a problem; where I disagree with you is that it is the driver of a lot of the bad decisions we make. That is where the intersection of your philosophy and this idea of the abandonment of personal responsibility happen in my mind. How is white supremacy forcing black people to do some of the stupid shyt we do?

As far as what I think the cause is, I think it is just a perpetuation of certain aspects of the culture of poverty, not of black people. Poor white people engage in all the ratchet fukkery mainstream America associates with black people. The reason it is more widespread with black people is largely because we are collectively poorer than the rest of the country, and so all the things associated with poverty come with that. Someone who came up poor is less likely to have kids that end up middle class, and someone who came up poor is more likely to get caught up in some bullshyt. That doesn't make them "inferior" or whatever eugenic bullshyt you are trying to goad me into cosigning. Does the system contribute to it? Sure, but at the end of the day when I wake up in the morning I have way more control over what I do than what the system does. Obama is supposed to be our conduit/representative within the system, and to that end he has failed. But like I told TWISM 100 times, I never suggested that dude was our only hope for change, far from it.

 

[Jello Biafra]

Not comparing us to whites. As you guys seem to use as a measuring stick. Compare us to ourselves and see that we are way better off than we ever have been.

Since 2009 black households have seen an 11.1% drop in median income. That is not doing better than ever by any stretch of the imagination.

 

[MeachTheMonster]

Since 2009 black households have seen an 11.1% drop in median income. That is not doing better than ever by any stretch of the imagination.

Since 2009 the ENTIRE WORLD has seen a drop in median income. It's called a global rescission and unfortunately black folks aren't immune to it.

As of today more black people are educated than ever before. As of today less black people are in poverty than ever before. As of today the black community has less crime than ever before. There are more black millionaires than every before. A black man is the president. Yes we are better off now than we have been in the past.

 

[MeachTheMonster]

What I don't understand is that people always wanna complain about Obama's record in regards to black people. But when you really look at it he's done more for black people than the last 10 presidents combined. Then when you bring up the stuff he has done for black folks people wanna bring up stuff like drones, Guantanamo, or ndaa. None of that has anything to do with black folks. If you really cared about what Obama is doing for black folks, you wouldn't even bring up those issues, because they don't effect our lives.

I'm convinced that nikkas just wanna complain.

 

[TLR Is Mental Poison]

What I don't understand is that people always wanna complain about Obama's record in regards to black people. But when you really look at it he's done more for black people than the last 10 presidents combined. Then when you bring up the stuff he has done for black folks people wanna bring up stuff like drones, Guantanamo, or ndaa. None of that has anything to do with black folks. If you really cared about what Obama is doing for black folks, you wouldn't even bring up those issues, because they don't effect our lives.

I'm convinced that nikkas just wanna complain.

Or maybe people are able to look at different aspects of dude's presidency separately? You are the first person here to make any link or even bring up Obama's foreign policy; nobody here tried to make that connection but you

 

[MeachTheMonster]

Or maybe people are able to look at different aspects of dude's presidency separately? You are the first person here to make any link or even bring up Obama's foreign policy; nobody here tried to make that connection but you

Obama has not done what he said he was gonna do. Guantanamo, "big business", repealing Bush tax cuts, taking a harder line with Iran, etc. etc. Obama has fallen short on a laundry list of items he called "top priorities" in his 2008 campaign

Again if you cared about Obama doing things or black folks, you wouldn't even bring up this nonsense that has absolutely nothing to do with black folks.

Black folks biggest problem by far is poverty, Obama has done plenty to address this problem, so I ask you what should Obama do for black folks?

 

[TLR Is Mental Poison]

Again if you cared about Obama doing things or black folks, you wouldn't even bring up this nonsense that has absolutely nothing to do with black folks.

Black folks biggest problem by far is poverty, Obama has done plenty to address this problem, so I ask you what should Obama do for black folks?

Dude claimed Obama made good on his campaign promises, he hasn't.

And how has Obama helped on the front of poverty? More people are below the poverty line or on govt assistance than ever

 

[MeachTheMonster]

Dude claimed Obama made good on his campaign promises, he hasn't.

And how has Obama helped on the front of poverty? More people are below the poverty line or on govt assistance than ever

You can't blame Obama for the recession. Again we are in a GLOBAL recession that is the worst it's ever been since the Great Depression. Obama's policies have helped stop the bleeding and get people back to work. Obama's policies on education and healthcare have and will continue to help the poor and middle class.
The Root: Obama and Poor People: What Has His Administration Done?

Slideshow: What has Obama done for black America in 2010? | theGrio


You didn't answer my question though. What should Obama do for black people?

 

[TLR Is Mental Poison]

You can't blame Obama for the recession. Again we are in a GLOBAL recession that is the worst it's ever been since the Great Depression. Obama's policies have helped stop the bleeding and get people back to work. Obama's policies on education and healthcare have and will continue to help the poor and middle class.
The Root: Obama and Poor People: What Has His Administration Done?

Slideshow: What has Obama done for black America in 2010? | theGrio

Did you read your first link?

O on healthcare

Claudia Fegan, a physician serving low-income patients in Chicago and a spokesperson for Physicians for a National Health Program, says that Obama's initiatives have good intentions. "But the process is too complicated for most poor people, who have fairly chaotic lives, to access," she said, citing the bureaucratic application process for CHIP as an example. "It's hard enough to get people the care they need without making them prove that the need it, requiring documentation and jumping through hoops to get it."

Fegan has similar "good intentions" concerns about the Affordable Care Act: "As this program goes forward, more people will be insured, but at what cost? We provide more people access to care, but we lose by decreasing funding for safety-net providers and cutting back on some of the Medicare reimbursement. But poor patients need more than just a doctor to prescribe medication -- they need social services and assistance navigating the system, resources that other providers don't necessarily have."

If Obama hadn't given up on the single-payer system from the start of 2009's health care debate, Fegan thinks the resulting compromise might have been easier to administer. "People say that the Affordable Care Act is socialized medicine, but nothing could be further from the truth," she said. "We're pushing people into the private insurance industry. We did what was politically expedient, but we put in place a very complicated system."

Safety Net

Economist Malveaux, president of Bennett College for Women, says there's no doubt that Obama has provided assistance to the poor, but cites challenges. "There are some really good things that the administration has done around poverty, but they have not been proportionate to the extent to which the problem has increased," she said.

"You're nibbling around the edge when you say there's a little program here and there's a tax cut there," she continued. "I think this should have been more central two years ago because, while doing health care was great, the first thing people want to do is be fed and know they'll have a secure situation. And many Americans just don't know that anymore."

nikkas need jobs!!!!!

Housing crisis, same story... O's moves came up short, and to boot, have benefitted banks and mortgage lenders more than homeowners. This is where we got hit the hardest in wealth because our homes are (were) all we have (had). Education, more criticisms in the article. It seems like you just did a Google search and posted whatever came up w/o reading it

You didn't answer my question though. What should Obama do for black people?

I said it pretty early on... I feel like Obama should have directly addressed

racial profiling, a fukked up court system (and) the prison industrial complex

Those are problems unique to us that I feel are worth addressing