Micheal Jordan pointing out the obvious about Lebron James :mjlol:

[Seoul Gleou]

This idiot said prime MJ wouldn’t hang with todays soft ass 3 point game.

LeBron wouldn’t survive Bill Laimbeer and the pistons.

He couldn't survive the Boston big 3, the Spurs big 3, the Dwight Orlando magic and the pistons. But he can hang with the Utah jazz, rockets, bulls, sonics, and even the Knicks from the 90s?? Really??

These stans just ignore history and say anything

 

[Bryan Danielson]

Speaking of ignoring history

 

[Ozymandeas]

Where did I say anything about losing being better than winning. That WOULD be stupid logic. I disagreed with the ‘its better to miss the playoffs than to lose in the Finals’ logic because that is stupid. If that were the case teams wouldnt fight and claw to be the 8th seed most years. And while winning has always been the standard, the idea that regularly making the Finals but losing makes you some kind of flawed loser has ONLY been applied to LeBron and it didnt start recently. It started after he lost to San Antonio and then was essentially cemented as a fact in some folks minds after the Dallas series. There is no other great player in history who people summarize by their playoff losses or count their finals losses. Not a one. And LeBron has actually won multiple titles! Its wild how much joy people get in trying to discredit him and 99% of the time its based on their love of another player, ie Jordan and Kobe. There aint a LeBron hater in the world who isnt either a Boston fan or a lover of Kobe or Mike. Thats why the bias is so stupid. And again, Ive always maintained Mike is the GOAT. I dont know why that means LeBron cant be enjoyed and appreciated, especially since Mike aint won a title in 25 years. Oh and as a Vikings fan Id absolutely rather have my team make the Super Bowl than miss the playoffs. As would any player and fan in the world unless theyre speaking from hurt lol

Yes, there were. You're just so attached to this man (which is weird) you can't see we always said this about people.

Peyton Manning got called a perrennial loser for YEARS breh......YEARS. He kept losing in the playoffs, played like ass against Chicago, then kept losing, then lost big against Seattle then played like hot ass against the Panthers but, got a win. We only stopped when he made it 2-2. Was all that about Lebron too

You can't change LeBron's win record, so instead, you're trying to attack decades of sports fan philosophy. It's sad. It's transparent. And it's never gonna work.

 

[Ozymandeas]

Arguments do not have to be bereft of emotion to be logical or make sense. One could argue that people saying LeBron is the goat is due to them having an emotional attachment to his journey in the NBA. That's certainly how I see it and why terms like Bronsexuals exist. Because his fans can't even acknowledge his short comings because of how emotionally attached they are to him either because of nostalgia or ignorance of his predecessors.

Yep. That's why they be saying stuff like "He's a black man, he got a black wife, he does for the black community" like that doesn't apply to the lionshare of players. They really look at this guy like he's Michael Jackson or something. I don't know who's worse. Beyonce fans. Jay-Z fans from the 2000s era. 50 Cent fans from the 2000s era. or Bron stans today. It's not enough for us to say he's good, we have to say he's the best (when he's not) and then we have to tear down every other player to uplift LeBron. Just like people do for Beyonce and used to do for Jay-Z and Fifty. I got friends and family that would cut me for saying something wrong about Beyonce and Bron. Shyt ain't normal man.

 

[Verbal Kint]

Yes, there were. You're just so attached to this man (which is weird) you can't see we always said this about people.

Peyton Manning got called a perrennial loser for YEARS breh......YEARS. He kept losing in the playoffs, played like ass against Chicago, then kept losing, then lost big against Seattle then played like hot ass against the Panthers but, got a win. We only stopped when he made it 2-2. Was all that about Lebron too

You can't change LeBron's win record, so instead, you're trying to attack decades of sports fan philosophy. It's sad. It's transparent. And it's never gonna work.

Homie Im not arguing for LeBron, Im arguing against bad logic. Im not invested in LeBrons greatness so all the ‘Bron stan’ arguments hold no water with me. Hell my favorite players of the last 20 years were KG and Russ. So stick to the points insstead of the silly Coli nikka insults and we may get somewhere. Manning is a somewhat decent comp but he was A- consistently underperforming in the playoffs as an individual. Having bad games and flaming out. LeBron gets clowned for losing, no matter how well he plays, how mediocre his team is or how great the opponent is. And B - Manning was constantly held up to a contemporary, Brady, who regularly won despite usually being a less productive QB. So there are slight similarities there but not a 1 to 1 comparison. And the fact that you had to go to football to find even a slight comp further proves my point. People hold LeBron to a weird standard that doesnt get applied elsewhere and judge him for things others arent. And instead of disproving that, people just try to make you look like a fanboy lol

 

[Verbal Kint]

Arguments do not have to be bereft of emotion to be logical or make sense. One could argue that people saying LeBron is the goat is due to them having an emotional attachment to his journey in the NBA. That's certainly how I see it and why terms like Bronsexuals exist. Because his fans can't even acknowledge his short comings because of how emotionally attached they are to him either because of nostalgia or ignorance of his predecessors.

This is true. The issue is when people make purely emotional/opinion based arguments but try to present them as truth. Its why most people agree that Jerry Rice is the best WR ever but someone suggesting Randy Moss is better doesnt work them up into a frenzy but someone saying LeBron is better than Mike does. Mike may be the best but the reasons most people believe that arent factual, theyre emotional. Theyre nostalgia based. I believe Mike is the best because I think thats what the facts say. The numbers, the career, etc. But because Im not emotional about this, I see the craziness in all sides. A lot of Bron fans are delusional. A lot of Jordan fans are delusional. Both sides think theyre right, but most of their arguments don’t deal with facts but on cherry picked half truths or nostalgia or a misrepresentation of history (the ‘Jordan played with plumbers’ AND ‘LeBron couldnt hack it in the Jordan era’ arguments). In short, all yall lose your minds over this when it could all be so simple. Mike was a beast. We aint seen him hoop in decades. LeBron is a beast. We got to watch him be great too. And if you can’t appreciate that because of his fans, you’re missing out on fun because you’re too tuned in to Twitter or ESPN.

 

[Ozymandeas]

Homie Im not arguing for LeBron, Im arguing against bad logic. Im not invested in LeBrons greatness so all the ‘Bron stan’ arguments hold no water with me. Hell my favorite players of the last 20 years were KG and Russ. So stick to the points insstead of the silly Coli nikka insults and we may get somewhere. Manning is a somewhat decent comp but he was A- consistently underperforming in the playoffs as an individual. Having bad games and flaming out. LeBron gets clowned for losing, no matter how well he plays, how mediocre his team is or how great the opponent is. And B - Manning was constantly held up to a contemporary, Brady, who regularly won despite usually being a less productive QB. So there are slight similarities there but not a 1 to 1 comparison. And the fact that you had to go to football to find even a slight comp further proves my point. People hold LeBron to a weird standard that doesnt get applied elsewhere and judge him for things others arent. And instead of disproving that, people just try to make you look like a fanboy lol

It's not bad logic. No one in the sports world cared about this before LeBron. It was accepted you needed to win rings to be great. Everyone was fine with this (including LeBron fans) until LeBron started piling up losses. Now you want to question the logic. Lol. That's why I say you're too connected to this man. Yall only wanted to kick over the table like children when the "rules" started to affect him unfavorably. I brought up Peyton Manning because he was a guy that had all the tools/talent/pedigree and was supposed to be great like LeBron but, kept shrinking in the playoffs. And he was ridiculed for it until he made it at least 2-2. For basketball though, there's not alot of examples to go off of. Pretty much all the guys in the basketball Top 15 have winning records All these excuses are just that, excuses. Basketball is a team sport but, if you're the best player of all time "supposedly", and you get to ten finals, you're supposed to have a winning record. He didn't have to win all 10 but, he at least should have won 6 rings. But to go deeper. If someone actually remembers how he played in 2007, 2011 and 2014, that's enough to say he's not the GOAT. And for me personally, his losses in 2008, 2009 and 2010 show me he never would've done anything in the league if he didn't create a superteam in Miami. He never beat Boston like Jordan beat Detroit. A true GOAT (Jordan, Brady, Gretzky) would have recruited a good #2 to Cleveland and made Boston his bish for the next few years....not run away.

 

[Verbal Kint]

It's not bad logic. No one in the sports world cared about this before LeBron. It was accepted you needed to win rings to be great. Everyone was fine with this (including LeBron fans) until LeBron started piling up losses. Now you want to question the logic. Lol. That's why I say you're too connected to this man. Yall only wanted to kick over the table like children when the "rules" started to affect him unfavorably. I brought up Peyton Manning because he was a guy that had all the tools/talent/pedigree and was supposed to be great like LeBron but, kept shrinking in the playoffs. And he was ridiculed for it until he made it at least 2-2. For basketball though, there's not alot of examples to go off of. Pretty much all the guys in the basketball Top 15 have winning records All these excuses are just that, excuses. Basketball is a team sport but, if you're the best player of all time "supposedly", and you get to ten finals, you're supposed to have a winning record. He didn't have to win all 10 but, he at least should have won 6 rings. But to go deeper. If someone actually remembers how he played in 2007, 2011 and 2014, that's enough to say he's not the GOAT. And for me personally, his losses in 2008, 2009 and 2010 show me he never would've done anything in the league if he didn't create a superteam in Miami. He never beat Boston like Jordan beat Detroit. A true GOAT (Jordan, Brady, Gretzky) would have recruited a good #2 to Cleveland and made Boston his bish for the next few years....not run away.

Yea you had some good points but the emotion is strong lol. You went off the rails into fantasy land those last few points. Jordan aint win a title till his 8th or 9th year in the league and was losing to Detroit yearly but you were convinced LeBron would never do anything in the league because he couldnt beat that Boston team? Cmon now. Thats a wild take. Greatness wasnt defined by losses but by wins. And making it to the finals was never a bad thing, even if you didnt win the title, until LeBron. Saying he’s not the best because he only won 4 chips makes perfect sense. Saying he aint the best because he lost in the finals doesnt. It’s objectively better to make it to the finals than to not make it. So logically if youre going to use Finals losses as a negative, then losses before the finals should be even more negative. Im a KG fan and when discussing his greatness nobody says ‘well yea but he couldnt get out of the first round for 6 straight years in MN’. And thats objectively worse than losing in the Finals. Hell even Karl Malone, who everyone hates, doesnt get defined by losing in the Finals. This Finals record thing is a LeBron only phenomenon because people wanted to discredit him once he was being compared to Jordan and honestly once he surpassed Kobe. Im sure you wont admit it but donyou know, off the top of your head, how many Finals losses Bird, Magic, Kareem have? Of course not! Because its a stupid way to measure success. Jordan going 6-0 in the Finals is amazing because he did it in 6 full years in a row (though i dont pretend like ‘95 never happened like most people). If we went 6-0 with trips spread out over the years with playoff Ls in between it wouldnt be as impressive.

 

[TEH]

Stop comparing goats from different eras. Jordan was the best at his time and LeBron is the best now, Jordan wouldn't be the best today and LeBron would be all-time great back then because of how the sport has progressed, it makes no sense to compare them. shyt the fact that it's even an argument proves MJ isn't the goat.

Delusional

Those bigs would put his cry baby ass in the hospital. Think shyt is sweet brehs

 

[Ozymandeas]

Yea you had some good points but the emotion is strong lol. You went off the rails into fantasy land those last few points. Jordan aint win a title till his 8th or 9th year in the league and was losing to Detroit yearly but you were convinced LeBron would never do anything in the league because he couldnt beat that Boston team? Cmon now. Thats a wild take. Greatness wasnt defined by losses but by wins. And making it to the finals was never a bad thing, even if you didnt win the title, until LeBron. Saying he’s not the best because he only won 4 chips makes perfect sense. Saying he aint the best because he lost in the finals doesnt. It’s objectively better to make it to the finals than to not make it. So logically if youre going to use Finals losses as a negative, then losses before the finals should be even more negative. Im a KG fan and when discussing his greatness nobody says ‘well yea but he couldnt get out of the first round for 6 straight years in MN’. And thats objectively worse than losing in the Finals. Hell even Karl Malone, who everyone hates, doesnt get defined by losing in the Finals. This Finals record thing is a LeBron only phenomenon because people wanted to discredit him once he was being compared to Jordan and honestly once he surpassed Kobe. Im sure you wont admit it but donyou know, off the top of your head, how many Finals losses Bird, Magic, Kareem have? Of course not! Because its a stupid way to measure success. Jordan going 6-0 in the Finals is amazing because he did it in 6 full years in a row (though i dont pretend like ‘95 never happened like most people). If we went 6-0 with trips spread out over the years with playoff Ls in between it wouldnt be as impressive.

He quit and took the easy road everytime. So, how can I know? He didn't do it.

I'll say this one last time. Going undefeated in the Finals is always better than going 4-10. You don't get points for making it to the Finals. Only a Bron Stan would even try to make that argument. We care about winning. With your logic, I should be excited that my Eagles made the Superbowl this year. We can get blown the fukk out tomorrow and lose horrifically like the 49ers did but, its all good because at least we made it With your logic, as I said before, the Buffalo Bills are one of the Greatest Teams of All Time. You and I both know every person in Buffalo right now would trade all of those four superbowl appearances for one ring even if it meant playoff losses afterward. That invalidates your entire talking point.

This is a waste though. You say you're not a LeBron stan yet, all you're doing is giving excuses for LeBron. Like a LeBron stan.

 

[DrexlersFade]

Speaking of ignoring history

He was a plumber who played against plumbers Bron stans and you new era dudes always want it both ways.

Is it Ochie Wally or is it One Mic

 

[Mister Terrific]

Delusional

Those bigs would put his cry baby ass in the hospital. Think shyt is sweet brehs

Jeff Hornacek was a top 10 guard in the 90’s. Ain’t nobody putting Lebron no where. F outta here

 

[TEH]

Jeff Hornacek was a top 10 guard in the 90’s. Ain’t nobody putting Lebron no where. F outta here

I said bigs

Illiterate Bronsexuals

Smh

 

[Osmosis]

He couldn't survive the Boston big 3, the Spurs big 3, the Dwight Orlando magic and the pistons. But he can hang with the Utah jazz, rockets, bulls, sonics, and even the Knicks from the 90s?? Really??

These stans just ignore history and say anything

Lebron beat all of those teams in the playoffs except the Magic, a team he dropped a 40 point triple double against in the playoffs.

Those 90s teams were mediocre. The only elite teams Jordan faced were the 80s Pistons and Celtics, and surprise surprise, Jordan was 1-5 against them. I'm convinced Jordan stans never watched a single minute of the NBA.

 

[Osmosis]

Yea you had some good points but the emotion is strong lol. You went off the rails into fantasy land those last few points. Jordan aint win a title till his 8th or 9th year in the league and was losing to Detroit yearly but you were convinced LeBron would never do anything in the league because he couldnt beat that Boston team? Cmon now. Thats a wild take. Greatness wasnt defined by losses but by wins. And making it to the finals was never a bad thing, even if you didnt win the title, until LeBron. Saying he’s not the best because he only won 4 chips makes perfect sense. Saying he aint the best because he lost in the finals doesnt. It’s objectively better to make it to the finals than to not make it. So logically if youre going to use Finals losses as a negative, then losses before the finals should be even more negative. Im a KG fan and when discussing his greatness nobody says ‘well yea but he couldnt get out of the first round for 6 straight years in MN’. And thats objectively worse than losing in the Finals. Hell even Karl Malone, who everyone hates, doesnt get defined by losing in the Finals. This Finals record thing is a LeBron only phenomenon because people wanted to discredit him once he was being compared to Jordan and honestly once he surpassed Kobe. Im sure you wont admit it but donyou know, off the top of your head, how many Finals losses Bird, Magic, Kareem have? Of course not! Because its a stupid way to measure success. Jordan going 6-0 in the Finals is amazing because he did it in 6 full years in a row (though i dont pretend like ‘95 never happened like most people). If we went 6-0 with trips spread out over the years with playoff Ls in between it wouldnt be as impressive.

these dudes are legitimately dumb. All Lebron had to do was lose in the ECF in 2007, 2015, and 2018 (his three worst squads to make the finals) and their argument would fall flat on its face. He would have more finals wins than losses. According to their twisted logic, that would make him a better player . These cats don't have the capacity to analyze the game beyond narratives.