Kevin Samuels Discussion Thread

[T’Challa’s Heir]

I’ve listened to his content. Yes. Most aren’t. But a lot are. Again, he is thinking about career trajectories from his own experience and generalizing.

To tell young Black women who are actually getting it that men will not make that type of money until their 40s is not accurate.

I don’t think you’re disagreeing with each other. You say it in your post, MOST men aren’t. The fact that A lot are doesn’t meant that the vast majority aren’t. The issue is that relative to the amount of young black women, the # of young black dudes w/ 5+ years of 120k/ year income is going to be scarce. And if the girls requirements are have a ton of money, she needs to expand her criteria to include older men.

And the 5 years thing is crucial. 120k/ year after spending 5 years accumulating wealth and establishing a strong financial base spends a lot differently than a dude just starting off re-paying student loans, paying a security deposit, and piecing together his wardrobe.

 

[mamba]

I disagree with you on this one, he is actually right. People in white-collar professions generally don't start making six figures until their mid 30's, most "associate" level jobs outside the major metros are going to be paying folks 65-90k for a couple of years before they start obtaining promotions. For example in law, if you are not at a big firm you are not seeing 100k+ until your mid 30's. Further, he does talk about differences in COL impacting the 100k ATL benchmark, so if you live in a Tier 1 City that means you need to be making at least 150k. But I do acknowledge that there are outliers, but he talks in generalities/base rates, and in that case, he is correct.

The weakest point he consistently makes is the argument about the percentage of Black men that are in the middle class, I've tried to find stats co-signing that argument and I haven't found anything.

I disagree. Really depends on profession. A Black software developer not making 100k until his 30s is doing something wrong.

Same with a management consultant, engineer, etc.

Again, Kev is thinking about old school careers. Maybe at an advertising firm where you have to claw your way up from making pennies.

For elite jobs, brehs are leaving undergrad making $65-75k at 22.

 

[mamba]

I don’t think you’re disagreeing with each other. You say it in your post, MOST men aren’t. The fact that A lot are doesn’t meant that the vast majority aren’t. The issue is that relative to the amount of young black women, the # of young black dudes w/ 5+ years of 120k/ year income is going to be scarce. And if the girls requirements are have a ton of money, she needs to expand her criteria to include older men.

And the 5 years thing is crucial. 120k/ year after spending 5 years accumulating wealth and establishing a strong financial base spends a lot differently than a dude just starting off re-paying student loans, paying a security deposit, and piecing together his wardrobe.

Lol. It’s $120k, now?

I’m all for tempering unrealistic expectations of delusional Black women. But, Kev’s definition of what a HVM is will lead to a defeatist mindset in a lot of our women.

A young breh making $90k in Houston for 3 years in his 20s, no kids, a solid network, etc. is a HVM. We don’t want comparable Black women thinking otherwise.

I make >$200k, have the network, been the halls of power, etc. Been making six figures since my mid 20s. Lol at somebody telling me I wasn’t high value at 28 because I hadn’t been getting it for 5+ years at that point. I’m a damn millionaire, now.

I support what he is doing at a fundamental level. But, some of it is ridiculous. He sometimes comes across as a man who isn’t really surrounded by elite, modern men.

 

[Apollo Creed]

I’ve listened to his content. Yes. Most aren’t. But a lot are. Again, he is thinking about career trajectories from his own experience and generalizing.

To tell young Black women who are actually getting it that men will not make that type of money until their 40s is not accurate.

it actually is. He is speaking in Atlanta dollars which tends to ge 1 to 1. Dudes making 105k as new grads in SF or NYC are not actually living six figure lifestyles because that translates to 55-60k in most other markets.

i crossed six figures in my late 20s in ATL but i am an exception to the rule.

 

[Deafheaven]

One thing he is totally off about is when men start making good money. He likes to suggest that men aren’t making long money until their 40s.

I reject that. Black men in high finance, big tech, management consulting, etc. are making that as early as late 20s. He is looking at it through the lens of the old school where a man had to work his way all the way up the ladder before making big money. I was making six figures long before 30 and a lot of my brehs were, too.

He also likes to suggest that men should be proposing in six months after meeting a woman. Maybe before all of this social media and dating apps. You have to do your homework on the women you are dealing with. Six months isn’t enough time to meet her family and closest friends. Six months isn’t enough to see how she reacts in a number of situations.

A lot of men will end up as part of another divorce statistic without learning as much about the woman as he can. It is the most important decision a man will make in his life.

six months

 

[Ahadi]

I’ve heard that plenty of times. You don’t see real money til you’re 40s. Especially in a big city.

But yes, there are exceptions to the rule.

 

[ogc163]

I disagree. Really depends on profession. A Black software developer not making 100k until his 30s is doing something wrong.

Same with a management consultant, engineer, etc.

Again, Kev is thinking about old school careers. Maybe at an advertising firm where you have to claw your way up from making pennies.

For elite jobs, brehs are leaving undergrad making $65-75k at 22.

There really isn't a disagreement, you and your friends represent outliers. He is discussing base rates. To provide greater perspective:

And these numbers don't take into consideration debt and COL.

 

[saturn7]

So I Married a Proud Boy

Is she being fair or wench splainin'?

 

[™BlackPearl The Empress™]

It’s not really an argument. His show isn’t really built around testimonials. The calls consist of a woman calling in asking about HVM and how she thinks she should qualify for one. And then him digging into her background and finding out she has kids, herpes, mountain of debt, and is 43. Then her doubling down and ignoring what he’s saying. Those clips are more likely to go viral and put more eyes on him, than a happy house wife calling in and saying he’s 100% right.

It's not an argument. Its you trying to tell me that someone who actually meets his standard or benefited from his advice having a conversation with him about it would be almost impossible.

I know that the show is based on telling woman they don't meet the standard. But how is one successful without results? As if one call from someone saying what that his advice helped him is going to ruin the show.

If anything it would benefit him because he could always reference back to it.

Anyway, you clearly haven't seen it. If anyone has shoot me the link.

 

[bucks3115]

this went pretty well
the girl was very nice and she was listening

kevin samuels gave her some real advice without shouting or bein rude

@™BlackPearl The Empress™

 

[Nigerianwonder]

I disagree. Really depends on profession. A Black software developer not making 100k until his 30s is doing something wrong.

Same with a management consultant, engineer, etc.

Again, Kev is thinking about old school careers. Maybe at an advertising firm where you have to claw your way up from making pennies.

For elite jobs, brehs are leaving undergrad making $65-75k at 22.

As someone in tech there are hardly any black software engineers so thats a mute point. These high paying tech firms ain't hiring a bunch of young black kids. We got the data on that. Kevin is speaking facts and you can't argue with statistics.

Engineers, lawyers, and consultants don't see 6 figures in their 20s either outside of maybe new york or the bay area. I know Engineers making 50k in their first year. Can take 10 years to reach 6 figures.

Less than 1 percent of black men in their 20s are making 6 figures. And most people spend their 20s paying off school debt and bills so they are not even living a 6 figure lifestyles even if they make that much. The vast majority Men definitely don't come into their own until the late 30's and 40s.

You are speaking on a rare subset of outliers. A black 20 year old making 6 figures is not normal and the number that are is so small its not worth discussing.

 

[Apollo Creed]

As someone in tech there are hardly any black software engineers so thats a mute point. These high paying tech firms ain't hiring a bunch of young black kids. We got the data on that. Kevin is speaking facts and you can't argue with statistics. Less than 1 percent of black men in their 20s are making 6 figures. And most people spend their 20s paying off school debt and bills so they are not even living a 6 figure lifestyles even if they make that much. The vast majority Men definitely don't come into their own until the late 30's and 40s.

You are speaking on a rare subset of outliers. A black 20 year old making 6 figures is not normal and the number that are is so small its not worth discussing.

exactly breh, majority of the black folks who land good jobs spend their 20s paying off debt because they are often first gen to make it to that level (whether ADOS or Immigrant neither of them going into college with their parents footing the full bill, and full rides are a minority).

Everyone I knew making six figures right out of college were in Cali and NYC, and everyone I know making 65-80 were in the DMV, all of those salaries translate to 45-55k in an ATL or Dallas which is the baseline for standard of living in the USA.

I've literally always been the youngest person in every company I worked for until recently, and even then majority of my colleagues (in my level/salary band) have 10-20 yrs on me, and the people younger than me are all entry level.

 

[Roid Jones]

Lol. It’s $120k, now?

I’m all for tempering unrealistic expectations of delusional Black women. But, Kev’s definition of what a HVM is will lead to a defeatist mindset in a lot of our women.

A young breh making $90k in Houston for 3 years in his 20s, no kids, a solid network, etc. is a HVM. We don’t want comparable Black women thinking otherwise.

I make >$200k, have the network, been the halls of power, etc. Been making six figures since my mid 20s. Lol at somebody telling me I wasn’t high value at 28 because I hadn’t been getting it for 5+ years at that point. I’m a damn millionaire, now.

I support what he is doing at a fundamental level. But, some of it is ridiculous. He sometimes comes across as a man who isn’t really surrounded by elite, modern men.

KS definition of HVM is not solely about money

 

[Apollo Creed]

It's not an argument. Its you trying to tell me that someone who actually meets his standard or benefited from his advice having a conversation with him about it would be almost impossible.

I know that the show is based on telling woman they don't meet the standard. But how is one successful without results? As if one call from someone saying what that his advice helped him is going to ruin the show.

If anything it would benefit him because he could always reference back to it.

Anyway, you clearly haven't seen it. If anyone has shoot me the link.

do you even watch the show or are you just here to debate? There have been numerous callers who are married to HVM and HENRYs and all of them said Kev is 100% right in what he is saying. A common example is The doctor lady who used to call in.

 

[Apollo Creed]

KS definition of HVM is not solely about money

exactly, HVM men tend to also have assets also taking their net worth to the millions hence the salary has been had for years.

Most these black folks making 100k have negative net worths because they are drowning in debt so the salary becomes a non factor