Joe Budden and Crooked I say "It Was Written" was even better than "Illmatic"

[Art Barr]

i can understand the sellout arguement to a certain degree. i mean iww did have more commercially presentable singles with rnb hooks. trackmasters worked on alot of the tracks. the videos for the singles were big budget with nas dressing in suits instead of army fatigues. he did switch it up to a degree.

but you know what, i enjoyed the album. i mean, lyrically nas was spittin like crazy, and even though it was trackmasters, the production was still very dark, even moreso than illmatic and definitely more than any other "commercial" album at the time. it wasn't boom bap but it wasn't light either. also, i dont just listen to boom bap and reject everything else.

as far as content, its not like nas went from being phife dog to becoming eazy-e or mc hammer or something. he was talking about drug deals and shootouts on illmatic too. sure iww was a little more mafioso, but it really didn't seem like that much of a drastic change from what he was talking about on illmatic. it was still very much centered around things going on in the projects, only this time it was from the perspective of a dude who had dough instead of a dude scramblin on the street corner. but it is still a project narrative. the escobar persona was not about flying around the world, eatin breakfast in paris and dinner in japan, it was about a nikka being known in his projects and dealing with the drama that comes with that, which really kinda paralells where nas was at in life after illmatic.

nikkaz blaming nas for the commercialization of hip-hop is fukkin idiots. that shyt would have happened regardless. badboy, deathrow and defjam were already doing the radio friendly rnb joints in a major way. nas isn't the god of hip-hop, he is just one dude who is nice on the mic.

sorry,...joe!!

in 96,..that was the first fully culturally disrespectful years for hiphop as a culture.

when it came to our artist representing the pillars as a business for the culture.

what nas did in 96,..effectitvely lessen the culture protection mechanisms for puff to come through with his weakest deathblow with ll's stolen excalibur.

nas pretty much was the lethal encounter with commercialism.

that hurt the protection mechanism past a point of no return.

or repair it could typically do from an act such as hammer and vanilla ice a year and a half after they weakened the protection mechanisms.

significantly enough to open space for more unactualized non knowledgeable gsteway rap fans.

plus more discoveryzone press/marketing/production representatives,..who soon became an untrained voice culturally for rap erroneously. which soon also gave way to the culture eventually, as well.

who by the time nas, the lenchpin.

by the time nas, came along with iww.

nas's evil heel long term swerve hurt the culture's protection mechanism, on the emcee side.

so LETHALLY,...the culture itself had been breached in large mass quantity.

by a later non culturally actualized popualtion of gateway fans.

that in the cultures protection mechanism of leniency was compromised for an influx of new fans.

something no other pillar does or will do.

plus, those other pillars eliminated, if their cultural integrity was compromised.

yet,..on the pillar of the emcee side.

the business occupation of rapper, which was just a working title.

not an actual culturally resident individual.

had reached critical mass influx population wise.

when it came to the overwhelming population, of gateway fan rappers.

that overflow of non-fully knowledgeable rapper/press/marketing productions individuals and gateway fan rappers,...

plus, the subsequent heel swerve of nas,.....

mixed in with non-knowing gateway fan rappers,..and puff's fatally killin blow.

smashed the protection mechanism and the impending flood from that seige.

created by the overwhelming population and influx of any gateway fan.

that created the cultural erosion of the pillars and skillsets.

that governed the culture of hiphop,..all together.



art barr

 

[Art Barr]

I can actually picture this.











More insults.
That's typically what you resort to.
So because I like "It Was Written" and think it was a great album.
I'm a "goof lame ass boi".
Well okay then.

And I'll readily admit I don't have the context you guys have.
Clearly you guys would be better judges on the climate and people opinions
but hey that's all they are OPINIONS.

stfu,...and refer to the numerous sig's,...you former repeated tabled crippled hurt ass boi,.....

you are nowhere near me culturally, or my knowledge culturally,...ever in ya life.

you jealous hurt non -knowledgeable inferior deflection artist of the highest order.


art barr

 

[up in here]

sorry,...joe!!

in 96,..that was the first fully culturally disrespectful years for hiphop as a culture.

when it came to our artist representing the pillars as a business for the culture.

what nas did in 96,..effectitvely lessen the culture protection mechanisms for puff to come through with his weakest deathblow with ll's stolen excalibur.

nas pretty much was the lethal encounter with commercialism.

that hurt the protection mechanism past a point of no return.

or repair it could typically do from an act such as hammer and vanilla ice a year and a half after they weakened the protection mechanisms.

significantly enough to open space for more unactualized non knowledgeable gsteway rap fans.

plus more discoveryzone press/marketing/production representatives,..who soon became an untrained voice culturally for rap erroneously. which soon also gave way to the culture eventually, as well.

who by the time nas, the lenchpin.

by the time nas, came along with iww.

nas's evil heel long term swerve hurt the culture's protection mechanism, on the emcee side.

so LETHALLY,...the culture itself had been breached in large mass quantity.

by a later non culturally actualized popualtion of gateway fans.

that in the cultures protection mechanism of leniency was compromised for an influx of new fans.

something no other pillar does or will do.

plus, those other pillars eliminated, if their cultural integrity was compromised.

yet,..on the pillar of the emcee side.

the business occupation of rapper, which was just a working title.

not an actual culturally resident individual.

had reached critical mass influx population wise.

when it came to the overwhelming population, of gateway fan rappers.

that overflow of non-fully knowledgeable rapper/press/marketing productions individuals and gateway fan rappers,...

plus, the subsequent heel swerve of nas,.....

mixed in with non-knowing gateway fan rappers,..and puff's fatally killin blow.

smashed the protection mechanism and the impending flood from that seige.

created by the overwhelming population and influx of any gateway fan.

that created the cultural erosion of the pillars and skillsets.

that governed the culture of hiphop,..all together.



art barr

son you need to cut all that writing down. i realize you're trying to write single sentences instead of paragraphs now, which is cool, but you said the same thing like 5 times in that post.

like gza once said "make it breif son, half short and twice strong".

 

[keon]

the majority Nikkas outside the east ain't care about nas like that before iww..

fixed but c/s for the most part

i remember nas before illmatic, so i knew about'em already..and i wasn't all that impressed with "halftime", but once i heard "it ain't hard to tell" and "life's a bytch", i knew he was that nikka

 

[Art Barr]

you have to kinda have an innate bullshyt detector in hip hop to really avoid being duped.

cosign,...i really believe you either have a cultivated bullshyt barometer culturally.


or you will fall,..this land we live in..

this land, doesn't ever contribute wholely to a impoverished culture that has unified the world!!

the disrespect to those before, and after you.

in the culture of hiphop is one of the bigges atrocities in babylon ever.

for babylon and gateway fans to desecrate our culture.

then systematically, accuse and use it as a scapegoat in a deflectionary tactic.

via rap music as a business is a cultural crime.

in general, most of the dudes who are in the business of rap are not even mindful or respectful of the culture.

the same culture, that enables them to make a living.

do it right all the time,...keep it true.

it is not about and bigger than you, just doing you,...



art barr

like, De La Soul can sample disco songs and still be as fresh as they want because they're intent is pure plus they're in on the joke and irony.

same thing with DOOM. he can go in on quiet storm records all day and stay true simply by the way he hooked them up and his intent with the record.

now you'll ask "how can you prove intent?"


that's where the innate BS detector comes in.


that gussied up shyt on IWW was not pure.

 

[Art Barr]

son you need to cut all that writing down. i realize you're trying to write single sentences instead of paragraphs now, which is cool, but you said the same thing like 5 times in that post.

like gza once said "make it breif son, half short and twice strong".

you haven't had a decorated brief enough career, yet.

to even say anything about brief,..

when your career has not had a strong enough brief showing, thus far.

i see you got a new username,..because you trying to get a new identity over here.

only thing is,..you are still just the same wack user with a new wack pixar-like user name.


gtfoh,...with that new guy, same ol guy bullshyt!!


art barr

 

[Art Barr]

fixed but c/s for the most part

i remember nas before illmatic, so i knew about'em already..and i wasn't all that impressed with "halftime", but once i heard "it ain't hard to tell" and "life's a bytch", i knew he was that nikka

nas is...or was the new school new gen era's herald.

it wasn't chosen he embraced that,...

when he pulled the heel swerve from his own failure's to appear and do more himself.

he flipped just for the evil spoils.....

he ruined that next culturally aware skillfully advanced kid's/bboy/bgirl's chances rappin.

practicing watching their reflection in their project window.

to anywhere the impoverished cultured voice of hiphop is heard.

that was no mistake on nas's part at all.

nas knew what he was doing when he sold out making iww.

how you go from it ain't hard to tell to luke bootyshake contest.

sorry,..but it ain't hard to tell,..i ain't goin, joe!!



art barr

 

[Big Mel]

and again. even subtracting all the negative implications from the IWW situation and you're still left with a truly unremarkable project. it's like...a solid 3.5-4 mics.

i'm not in the business of denying myself music that my ears enjoy simply because it goes against the greater good of hip hop. i will guilty pleasure away the best of them.


IWW is just kinda dull.


that Lupe Fiasco, Joe Budden & Crooked I, Three of the most unremarkable "skilled" rappers of the moment champion the record speaks volumes.

 

[Insensitive]

stfu,...and refer to the numerous sig's,...you former repeated tabled crippled hurt ass boi,.....

you are nowhere near me culturally, or my knowledge culturally,...ever in ya life.

you jealous hurt non -knowledgeable inferior deflection artist of the highest order.


art barr

Nobody is jealous.
You're just doing what you do best.
Quoting somebody, then passing off your OPINION as FACT.
You write up these elaborate narratives and try to paint people in certain
ways to make yourself look better and if we don't agree with your OPINIONS you try to pull our Hip Hop cards.

It's cool you drop knowledge here and there but
you can't tell me what my ears SHOULD or SHOULDN'T like
And I personally feel IWW is a great album, if you don't that's perfectly
FINE.

 

[Art Barr]

B.I.G.'s first records of real note were P&B, the Supercat remix, and Juicy. He was a natural at that lane, he was like a Grisham type of author who was also capable of dropping an artsy novella here and there.

Nas was more darling of the literary elite who suddenly began writing contrived Robert Ludlum thrillers. And it does seem contrived as fukk. You couldn't tell me a single bad thing about Nas back in the day, but that changed with every successive r&b feature. He was just... terrible on those songs. Oil and water terrible. B.I.G. fit on that type of tack, Nas didn't. Same with Jay-Z, that was his lane. Hearing Nas awkwardly labor over the Jermaine Dupri track that sampled Sledgehammer was like watching Shaq try to play point guard and continually getting ripped or dribble it off his foot.



The context is out there for sure, though I agree it's difficult to sort through all the different information (or lack thereof in some cases) and get to the heart of it. I think some of the people who were living and breathing hip hop back then do their perspectives a disservice at times by being so condescending and even nasty in presenting them, and that can lead to arguments instead of conversations. The level of fanaticism doesn't help matters either. People have so much invested in these artists that any critique is taken as blasphemy, something to rage against.

I find an overwhelming amount of honest assessment in many of Big Mel's post, but occasionally those are colored by a degree of frustration and condescension. And Art Barr's posts are... well, very much their own unique brand of posts. And I don't say that as a knock on either person, because on 80% of shyt Big Mel expresses an opinion completely in line with how I see things. And Art Barr is pretty much an entity of sorts as far as I'm concerned.

I think argument has replaced conversation in general. It wasn't always like that on SOHH. which is the reason I first started posting there.

cosign,......an entity,...

i like that,......

one resson why i enjoyed sohh was originally,..i co-existed amoung culturally enriched minds.

over time, a different realm of non knowledgeable era arose.

which is directly attributed to the number of gateway rap fans.

who were not actualized or cognitive of the culture of hiphop.

yet were big enough gateway rap fans.

they sought out more dialogue on rap.

discovring, the actual realization of hiphop as a culture in smaller doses.

than what typically occurred, in past era's in general.

plus hiphop is even more tolerant.

as a collective culture because of its commercialization as a device and product in the pop realm.




art barr

 

[Art Barr]

Nobody is jealous.
You're just doing what you do best.
Quoting somebody, then passing off your OPINION as FACT.
You write up these elaborate narratives and try to paint people in certain
ways to make yourself look better and if we don't agree with your OPINIONS you try to pull our Hip Hop cards.

It's cool you drop knowledge here and there but
you can't tell me what my ears SHOULD or SHOULDN'T like
And I personally feel IWW is a great album, if you don't that's perfectly
FINE.

man,...most of the concepts and mores of this culture you don't understand.
as you have no connection to the other pillars mores or norms.

most of the stuff i discuss was originally ex'd out in graf from arthouses.

looking to take graf in an erroneous culturally divisive direction.

also,...the loss of breaking as a domestic large draw.

is attributed to breaking as a drawing industry.

losing its drawing potency and permeation from this cultural erosion,..

which are attributed to personalities and errant commercialized moves.

that destroyed the public and cultural sentiment.

that made breaking a draw,...

in the same manner, rap has also done the same.

then, watched these errant commercialized directives ruin its once potent mainstream draw as well.

these are simple old lessons,..anyone really into hiphop really already knows.

keeping it true is built into to that.

the same keeping it true perspective that missed you,...thinking you are above it,..and don't know and not aware.

it is what humanizes and exposes you to someone really apart of this culture.


art barr


is a bboy,..and part of the culture of hiphop,..for real

 

[zerozero]

,...nikka, nas had a luke bootyshake contest at a daytime all ages show cause he could not remember the words to his own records.

 

[Wacky D]

im not trying to take this off-topic but i peeped this meek mill chit yall were talking about on the side. homie, meek is not to be grouped with the big seans of the world. hes the 1st breakout mainstream star that we had in years that isnt pop AND ACTUALLY PAID HIS DUES AND WORKED HIS WAY UP THE LADDER. not to mention he actually had a legit buzz and not some fabricated internet chit, he didnt have secret money behind him and hes not some industry plant. whether you like meek or not, you should be celebrating that man.

and to the other dude a few posts under you, hes not a version of ace hood. he was out before that nicca, and youre listening to a dumbed-down version of meek. shouldve been paying attention the past 5-6 years on sohh when niccas was droppin gems about him & other underground artists that are actually buzzin in their cities.

well if you went to your shows...instead of no showing you would not be broke.

how az at the show and common gotta host and take your place,...

nikka fukk nas bullshyt deflectuon gamesmanship......

nikka i was at three shows when nas ain't show up my damn self from 94-95 for starters. not to mention nas started off 96 no showing amd my guy in the d,..with the candy paint caddy got you smokimg blunts with him in michigan. with pix for proof,...i grab the pix and i am like man,..this nikka was supposed ti be at depaul. my nikka is like,..yeah nas did say he was supposed to be in the chi.

when nas supposed to be aT depaul.

when nas finally did perform, my guys opened up for him.

outclassed him and rap nowhere near nas level all becaue they were prepared, in 2ooo.

,...nikka, nas had a luke bootyshake contest at a daytime all ages show cause he could not remember the words to his own records.

plus his giys backing him up were awful. how do you perform wacker tham odb amd odb has a great shoe and you are nas? odb is supposed to come out all unprepared and unprofessional.

if you went to an odb show he was clear and did not need his backup guys at all.

i seen odb twice and it was all tight amd professional. why in the fukk is nas got luke records playin with bootyshake contests,...like wtf!!!??!?!

nikka please,...nas been on bullshyt,.....

well dam.

good point.

 

[spliz]

This nikka keep on bringin up that Luke shyt...everybody know NAS was wildin then and was still too much in the streets...getting caught up and it was affecting his work schedules n all dat...the nikka DEF made some mistakes in his career but u talkin like ALL his shows was like that...I seen Nas perform in 96...it wasn't like that...I ALSO could tell u a bunch of bullshyt some of ur FAV artists was on at the time as well...and these nikkas was WAY older than Nas...Nas was just a young nikka who was stuck in the streets and didnt know how to manage his money...hell yea if he was unprepared he was gonna have a booty shakin contest on purpose...lol...and I'm NOT sayin that's right at all..but what it does show me is..yall.have a PERSONAL.issue with Nas...its not about the rhymes.or the music...I do understand why u be pissed about that tho..

 

[zerozero]

This nikka keep on bringin up that Luke shyt...everybody know NAS was wildin then and was still too much in the streets...getting caught up and it was affecting his work schedules n all dat...the nikka DEF made some mistakes in his career but u talkin like ALL his shows was like that...I seen Nas perform in 96...it wasn't like that...I ALSO could tell u a bunch of bullshyt some of ur FAV artists was on at the time as well...and these nikkas was WAY older than Nas...Nas was just a young nikka who was stuck in the streets and didnt know how to manage his money...hell yea if he was unprepared he was gonna have a booty shakin contest on purpose...lol...and I'm NOT sayin that's right at all..but what it does show me is..yall.have a PERSONAL.issue with Nas...its not about the rhymes.or the music...I do understand why u pissed tho..

this is my feeling too, alright he was on some bullsh1t for 4,5 years... but post stillmatic he's had his head straight while everyone else was going insane