Jesus Was A Real Person...There's No Debate...Read a Book
- Thread starter AlainLocke
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i did, and the main take away i got from it was that pauls interpretations are a great deal of the issues between jewish interpretation of the gospels and current christian thinkingDid you watch the video?
and when i read the epistles side by side with the gospels its clear where the divinity is coming fromyet the dogma and instruction is being dictated by the epistles...and most christians are afflicted and waiting for the end because of them and revelations
so once again...who do you follow: Paul or Jesus?
Christ the Good Shepherd Icon
Eastern orthodox icon of our Jesus Christ "The Good Shepherd" "The thief comes only to steal and kill and destroy; I came that they may have life, and have it abundantly."I am t
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JoelB
All Praise To TMH
I'd like to hear your opinion on this. Do you believe Christ is YHWH or do you think he was created by YHWH?
Saysumthinfunnymike
VOTE!!!
scientists can't explain why we're here (Evolution can't even be explained if you go back far enough) but they can explain away the Bible?
do you follow Paul or do you follow Jesus?
My friend, as you know, Christianity is a creation of Paul. The Book of Romans explains it all.
The Gospels are meant to capture the 'mystery' of Jesus of Nazareth. The various letters to Christian communities detail what Christianity ought be.
Without Paul, Christianity would've been a small Jewish sect.
yet the gospels were communicated to the apostles not Paul.
are you so sure about what you are saying?
there are churches that still exist in Jerusalem that were established before his time.
yet the gospels were communicated to the apostles not Paul.
are you so sure about what you are saying?
So the story goes...
I am sure of what I am saying, regarding Paul and Christianity becoming 'Catholic' (meaning universal, ecumenical etc.). For instance, take a look at what Paul instructs Christians in Corinthians, pertaining to non-Jews (Gentiles) and male circumcision.
I believe Jesus Christ was fully human. I also believe that, in a sense, he was embodying YHWH.
I think we make the mistake of putting very Westernized, anthropomorphic, individualistic ideas of what "God" is. We think God is like Zeus, just some guy, except he happens to live in the clouds and be very powerful. He might as well be a Marvel character, hell, even inferior to certain Marvel characters in some people's reckoning.
I think when you look at God from a more Eastern sense, when you look deeper into the ancient Jewish ideas of God (pre-Christian ideas, they added a lot in reaction to Christianity later), you get something more mystical about who and what God is and the various ways that Jesus may have represented Him. These essays are helpful for me in seeing the possibilities more broadly.
Jesus and the Identity of God - NTWrightPage
Originally published in Ex Auditu 1998, 14, 42–56. Reproduced by permission of the author. To address the subject of the theological significance of the earthly Jesus I take as my topic the central question of Jesus and God. The question must be approached from both sides. First, in what...
ntwrightpage.com
Jesus’ Self-Understanding - NTWrightPage
[47] Jesus’ Self-Understanding (Originally published in The Incarnation, ed. S. T. Davis, D. Kendall, G. O’Collins 2002, Oxford: OUP, 47–61. Original pagination is retained in bold italicized numbers. Reproduced by permission of the author.) N. T. WRIGHT I INTRODUCTION (A): TODAY’S SITZ IM LEBEN...
ntwrightpage.com
JoelB
All Praise To TMH
I believe Jesus Christ was fully human. I also believe that, in a sense, he was embodying YHWH.
I think we make the mistake of putting very Westernized, anthropomorphic, individualistic ideas of what "God" is. We think God is like Zeus, just some guy, except he happens to live in the clouds and be very powerful. He might as well be a Marvel character, hell, even inferior to certain Marvel characters in some people's reckoning.
I think when you look at God from a more Eastern sense, when you look deeper into the ancient Jewish ideas of God (pre-Christian ideas, they added a lot in reaction to Christianity later), you get something more mystical about who and what God is and the various ways that Jesus may have represented Him. These essays are helpful for me in seeing the possibilities more broadly.
Jesus and the Identity of God - NTWrightPage
Originally published in Ex Auditu 1998, 14, 42–56. Reproduced by permission of the author. To address the subject of the theological significance of the earthly Jesus I take as my topic the central question of Jesus and God. The question must be approached from both sides. First, in what...
Jesus’ Self-Understanding - NTWrightPage
[47] Jesus’ Self-Understanding (Originally published in The Incarnation, ed. S. T. Davis, D. Kendall, G. O’Collins 2002, Oxford: OUP, 47–61. Original pagination is retained in bold italicized numbers. Reproduced by permission of the author.) N. T. WRIGHT I INTRODUCTION (A): TODAY’S SITZ IM LEBEN...
Read the first link...very good.
If im not mistaken 2nd century Essenes shared similar views
ill check out the 2nd link in the morning
Essenes are a great window into early Judaism because they don't have all the baggage that came from reacting to Christianity present in modern Judaism. The first part of the Talmud wasn't even written until 200 AD and was clearly in places set forth as a rejection of Christian theology, but there was a thousand years of Jewish history before that. I don't think the Essenes were necessarily the same as the Jews around Jesus in his day, they were their own sect with their own beliefs, but I'd bet they were a lot closer to the Judaism that Jesus grew up in than modern Judaism is.
I remember watching this movie that made me think about that too
Starts around 2:50
Nah, I watched the video and that's a popular urban legend that has virtually nothing to do with anything in the Bible or in Buddhism. (Or in pagan mythology, to address the other tangent that guy throws in.)
When you read actual academic scholars of religion, neither Jesus's actions nor his words align with any sort of Buddhist understanding of the world. His motivations were different, his ways of thinking were different, his prescribed actions were different, his end goals were different, his entire context of worldview was different....there's a reason why people who really care about Jesus's teachings tend to be uninterested in Buddhism, and why people who really care about Buddhism tend to be perturbed by Christianity. The idea that our ultimate goal is merely to extinguish ourselves, cease caring about reality, renounce everything, and then salvation will be found (salvation meaning nothingness), is almost the opposite of the Christian goal which is to love each other, give oneself fully to others, build community together, and perfect the world. When you read the Eightfold Path of Buddhism it's entirely negative "Don't do all bad things", take yourself out of the equation, and eventually you'll be perfected, while the essence of the Christian path is to LOVE others and to DO unto others and to SERVE others, it's a positive, active orientation. Buddhism asks us to eliminate ourselves, as if humans were a mistake. Christianity asks us to become our best selves, the humans we were truly meant to be.
I think people who distort Christianity into a moralistic "don't sin" set of rules feed into that misinterpretation. But when you read the Book of Acts, they never focus on how little the Christians were sinning. They focus on how much joy they were having living and eating and celebrating in community together, doing good works and sharing with each other and spreading the Good News. It's not remotely a Buddhist way of interpreting the world, and the Jesus who feasted and drank (unlike the stoic Pharisees who looked down on him) and appealed to the common man doesn't fit that either.
For those who want to understand comparative religion as it pertains to Jesus, I really recommend reading the academic scholars and religious experts on these ideas, not the pop theology that comes from movies and youtube videos. Those people get a neat idea in their head and then put it into art, but they're not basing their ideas on actual familiarity with either religion's foundings or any sort of deep historical knowledge. There are many different, competing views of the origin of Christianity, some of them quite contradictory, but being founded by a Buddhist isn't one that's taken very seriously.
Y’all know Jesus had half-siblings?
And just to clarify, that doesn't mean there aren't intersections between Jesus's teachings and Buddhist teachings. I just see those intersections as universal human truths that wise spiritual teachers can gain from experience, and which show no evidence of having been derived from each other. Jesus didn't need to go to India to know that material possessions often get in the way of our good deeds, or that those who wish others to do good to them should strive to themselves do good to others. But I find the moral program in Jesus's way of life and teachings far more complete, far more elevating to the human experience, than the general renunciation found in Buddhism, even if the Buddhist teachings are sprinkled with a few gems here and there.
lol, been way too long since I saw that.
@Rhakim great post, thanks for breaking it down
Unrelated note do you think Mr. Miyagi from the Karate Kid films embodied a Christ like way of living as opposed to a Buddhist way?
lol, been way too long since I saw that.
