I think the question many people here are asking is what makes the Palestinians so special? History is replete with defeated peoples and conquered territories. What you are asking from the Israelis is something that isn't asked of other victors. The Jews were once a defeated people with no power or military either, they were able to finesse their bargaining power into acquiring just that, and the root of that bargaining power stems from their self-sufficiency as a people. When we put emotional and cultural biases aside and compare apples to apples, the alternatives to a Jewish state in the Middle East aren't very favorable.
And no, we can't just toss Hamas rhetoric aside when religious propaganda plays such a vital role in the conflict. As an ex-Muslim l'm sure you're aware that the religious narrative of Islam includes episodes where whole tribes of Jews were killed and/or expelled from the Islamic state. And Islam isn't like other religions, that stuff occurred within the full light of relatively recent history, so there is a precedent that one could argue necessitates the Jews take a harder line to ensure it doesn't happen to them again.
Muslim states are not friendly towards religious and ethnic minorities, period. I don't see why a Palestinian one would be any different, so I'm sorry breh, why would anyone who isn't a Palestinian or a Muslim campaign for one?
Let me ask you an honest question, would these people be able to chant hare krishna publicly like this in any Middle Eastern country other than Israel?
I don't think so. So I don't really take all these accusations that Israel is so evil very seriously. I'm sorry, I just don't. I'm on the side of civilization, not barbarism.
Youre confusing issues, but youve raised some good ones:
1-If you want to argue that the status of current Muslim states negates the rights of the Palestinians to one, I see the appeal in a very primitive sense, but its not based on international law or any kind of sound logic. The East Timorese were not denied a state because of some failed Christian states in Africa.
2-But even accepting the logic, at best it is an argument against a Palestinian state. Great. End the occupation, provide human and civic rights. Khalas. Why wont Israel do that?
3-I accept the role of Islam and the historical anti semetism, and why this would require Israel to be ever vigilant. Perhaps this is why they will always deny a Palestinian state in their midst, and insist on full physical and military control from the RIver to the Sea. Thats great. Now, see point #2 above.
Now let me address the crux of your post. Why are the Palestinians special? Because, it literally is the last vestige of 19th century European colonialism. It is the shyt we read in history books, happening in slow fukking motion before our eyes, coupled with a massive propaganda campaign designed to convince us thats water on our leg and not piss.
Every other conflict, from Western Sahara to Xinjiang/Tibet to Crimea, the crux of the issue really is a major power re-establishing the boundaries of its former sphere of influence, which runs against the irredentist and independence drives of the local population.
Palestine is literally European Colonialism in the 21st century. It is also a conflict, unlike Balochistan or Tibet, that has much wider geopolitical, religious and cultural implications. It is the major source of tension in the Islamic world, and the original rallying cry of Islamic militancy. It is the mother of all grievances.
And on a final note, I dont see what is civilized about uprooting olive trees, denying water, forcing out homeowners, targeting civilians, torturing people, detention without due process. Just because its not Baathist Iraq, doesnt make it some paragon of virtue and civilization, no matter how many tech start ups it has
And not the Spinoza variety. Let the agent go.
I believe you.
