in the early 90's if you weren't street/thug/calling women bytches, you weren't popping -Kid N Play

[spliz]

you referred to kid n play as teenage rappers in your previous post. you thought they were teenagers. just admit it. I thought they were teenagers/early 20s for a long time myself, before I found out they were the same age as my parents. YOU AINT GOTTA LIE TO KICK IT.

they didn't just make music for teenagers. lol. theyre from the '80s & made party music. they had a large base of fans their age & older.

AGAIN, I never said anything about tribe's clothes. why do you keep trying to force this argument? I simply said that I thought they were some fakkits when they came out, and you've been trying to argue with me about their clothes ever since. this whole entire exchange is bizarre.

as for this outkast stuff, I don't discredit anybody's achievements. I even said that they were successful. I simply said that they weren't amongst the most successful acts of the '90s. youre just mad that I don't sit on my hands when I see people trying to push agendas. I keep telling yall, I don't care about no outkast. the only time yall see me talking about them is when yall try to rewrite history. if yall stop doing that, then you wont see me talking about them much at all. I'm not even talking about them in a negative light in this thread, and I usually don't speak bad of them actually.

DOG, you str8 listed their actual album sales, which totaled 5 million. then when I said, that's not nearly enough, you came back in the next post and said they sold 10 million ALBUMS. now ur claiming that you were including singles when you clearly used the word "ALBUMS". and for the record, their singles catalog wasnt all that big either breh. and now youre reaching for straws, trying to include industry props and chit like that which means nothing to the conversation.

and I'm gonna start calling out all these people that are patting you on the back. I already scolded @amerikkkan idol for his last post. now, I gotta call out @IllmaticDelta for continuously dapping you, knowing that youre bullchittin, all because he likes outkast. stuff like this is why this board fell off. yall need to man up and cut the chit.

@spliz too, talembout "great post". now if youre cosigning the tribe portion where he was arguing with someone else, then just quote that part. but you quoted his entire post, so you gotta get called out too.

Fam I was mainly focused on the Tribe part which is why I replied to the dude he was talkin to. And as far as the Kid N Play shyt. I disagree with u. Cause honestly. Them nikkas music changed in the early 90s from the 80s and as a matter of fact @Art Barr articulated it as well as anyone could when it came to them. Them nikkas got on that "Funhouse" shyt and started making cartoons n shyt. They was obviously aiming their shyt towards the youth. Their whole brand became youth based until House Party 3. I'm not even shytting on Kid N Play cause I have more respect for them than alotta people do. But come on fam. Them nikkas was 28 making high school movies n shyt. Lol. Their whole brand revolved around the youth in the early 90s when they were way older than alotta rappers out at the time. And way older than they looked. As far as Outkast goes. Overall. They were one of the most successful if u counting everything all together. Longevity. Critical acclaim and fan reception. And they had great album sales. Not the most. And I don't know about that 10 million number. That def is inflated. Maybe he was just tryna make a point. Lol. But great nonetheless. I dapped him cause I agreed with multiple aspects of his post. And I said good post cause it overall was a good post imo. I don't check who u dapping. There's plenty of nikkas u dapped in this thread that I didn't agree with but I didn't "call" u out for it. Who do u think u are fam? The fukk? Chill out bro it's a healthy conversation between multiple people who know what they talking about we not always gonna agree on everything. shyt me and @kingofnyc always go back n forth especially when it comes to PAC and Biggie but the nikka is an overall a pretty good poster outside of that. Lol

 

[PhonZhi]

nikkaz acting like C.Delores Tucker wasn't going on a crusade to end gangster Rap...Tupac was mentioned by Bob Dole lol

Yes there are anomalies were rappers who were conscious broke through & had successful careers or some platinum success but they are the EXCEPTIONS
And honestly its not just gangster rap but the whole lifestyle that encompasses said music, I think of THE ROOTS & their video for "what they do" in 96 where they had the crystal, rented luxury cars, rented mansions, Video Vixens & just basically parodied rap music up until to that point & i think that's what Kid N Play was getting at ....The music came with a script & the rappers became actors doing their best renditions & it was enormously profitable for the labels so it became the standard form of hip hop for years....I think of Charles Barkleys Campaign in the 90s "I'm Not a role model" basically putting the onus on the parents of the millions of children who idolize these larger than life characters but theres one thing he forgot to mention....Almost 70% of these kids in the black community are raised in single parent households, so who are the kids going to gravitate & look up ?? I digress rap music is a tool that has been weaponized & wielded against the black community

All facts

 

[Wacky D]

As far as Outkast goes. Overall. They were one of the most successful if u counting everything all together. Longevity. Critical acclaim and fan reception. And they had great album sales. Not the most. And I don't know about that 10 million number. That def is inflated. Maybe he was just tryna make a point. Lol. But great nonetheless. I dapped him cause I agreed with multiple aspects of his post. And I said good post cause it overall was a good post imo. I don't check who u dapping. There's plenty of nikkas u dapped in this thread that I didn't agree with but I didn't "call" u out for it. Who do u think u are fam? The fukk? Chill out bro it's a healthy conversation between multiple people who know what they talking about we not always gonna agree on everything. shyt me and @kingofnyc always go back n forth especially when it comes to PAC and Biggie but the nikka is an overall a pretty good poster outside of that. Lol

bullchit.

they sold 5 mil total off of 3 albums. that's nowhere near the most successful. and most of the rappers that sold more records, also had more longevity and bigger fanbases throughout the decade - so yall can stop tryna move the goal post, cuz you still wont score. lol. they didn't even have haters. they weren't important.

and youre still trying to cover up for the bul. I even re-posted the transcript. he wasn't tryna make a point. he was clearly lying. so yea, I still gotta call you out.

I may have dapped people that you don't agree with, but I didn't dap anybody that pulled chit out of their ass or posted blatant lies. if I did, then feel free to call me out on it. I deserve.

I guess these nikkas rockin some long dress homo shyt too huh?

Smh. U admit it's Afrocentric but call it homo at the same time? Disrepectful ass lil nikkas these days man.

I wasn't involved in this argument.

but lets be real, tribe isn't dressed like these fellas in that picture posted earlier.

these look like Africans proud of their heritage. tribe looked like they were goofin off, playing dress-up in mis-matched clothes. especially q-tip.

If this is after 8 Mile then that's the reason. Lol

they always had a large white base.

theyre gangsta rap for the backpacks.

Sir Mix A lot wasn't a thug and didn't need to call women bytches to be popular.

I never heard an unreleased mix-a-lot cut but dude was ranchy as hell.

 

[spliz]

bullchit.

they sold 5 mil total off of 3 albums. that's nowhere near the most successful. and most of the rappers that sold more records, also had more longevity and bigger fanbases throughout the decade - so yall can stop tryna move the goal post, cuz you still wont score. lol. they didn't even have haters. they weren't important.

and youre still trying to cover up for the bul. I even re-posted the transcript. he wasn't tryna make a point. he was clearly lying. so yea, I still gotta call you out.

I may have dapped people that you don't agree with, but I didn't dap anybody that pulled chit out of their ass or posted blatant lies. if I did, then feel free to call me out on it. I deserve.





I wasn't involved in this argument.

but lets be real, tribe isn't dressed like these fellas in that picture posted earlier.

these look like Africans proud of their heritage. tribe looked like they were goofin off, playing dress-up in mis-matched clothes. especially q-tip.





they always had a large white base.

theyre gangsta rap for the backpacks.





I never heard an unreleased mix-a-lot cut but dude was ranchy as hell.

Well I wasn't paying attention to y'all whole argument. I never said they were the most successful. I said they were one of the most successful. Overall. Success isn't just about sales. To say they weren't even important at all is just plain retarded and a million posters from all over the country on this site and even back on Sohh have called u out for that shyt. U have a clear bias against Outkast and always have. Lol. And I have my own issues with the rewriting of history with Andre 3K and they wasn't even my fav group. Mobb Deep and Bone Thugs >>>> Outkast for me in the 90s. By far. Son I don't care what u say. There was nothing GAY about the clothes Tribe was wearing. A little Afrocentric? Yes. A little weird? Yes. But not gay. That's some bullshyt I don't care how much u try to spin it. I know plenty of people that knew Q Tip in real life and NONE of them thought of him as some soft gay nikka ever. I got fam who was around the nikka when he was on his come up. Male and Female. If anything bytches used to sweat that nikka back then. And Mobb Deep was gold selling artists in the 90s. I didn't know many white people personally back then to tell u the truth but I know for sure that Shook Ones love by white people is heavily attributed to 8 Mile.

 

[hex]

I'm white....from midtown KCMO, which is (or was, prior to gentrification) mostly black in the 80's and 90's. The schools were literally 99% black back then, to the point that they had to go to court to try and reverse desegregate the schools.

Mobb Deep had no white fans. At all. I mean....if you want to count me, but as I said, I was an outlier. Maybe later they had white fans but their first 2 albums only went gold and the height of their popularity was 1x plat....hardly numbers that would reflect a large white fan base.

Fred.

 

[Newzz]

I'm white....from midtown KCMO, which is (or was, prior to gentrification) mostly black in the 80's and 90's. The schools were literally 99% black back then, to the point that they had to go to court to try and reverse desegregate the schools.

Mobb Deep had no white fans. At all. I mean....if you want to count me, but as I said, I was an outlier. Maybe later they had white fans but their first 2 albums only went gold and the height of their popularity was 1x plat....hardly numbers that would reflect a large white fan base.

Fred.

Wu and Mobb Deep always had a large white fan base from what I've witnessed

 

[kingofnyc]

you referred to kid n play as teenage rappers in your previous post. you thought they were teenagers. just admit it. I thought they were teenagers/early 20s for a long time myself, before I found out they were the same age as my parents. YOU AINT GOTTA LIE TO KICK IT.

they didn't just make music for teenagers. lol. theyre from the '80s & made party music. they had a large base of fans their age & older.

believe me, i meant they made teenage music NOT THEM BEING TEENAGERS
im damn near the oldest nikka on here & i knew back then they was damn near 10 years older then me
cause they were dancing for salt n pepa in da 80's


house party came out when i just started high school & ironically the movie was about 2 high school TEENAGERS trying to throw a party while (play's) parents were out of town

AGAIN, I never said anything about tribe's clothes. why do you keep trying to force this argument? I simply said that I thought they were some fakkits when they came out, and you've been trying to argue with me about their clothes ever since. this whole entire exchange is bizarre.

I asked you who were ALL of these artists that did huge numbers then flopped on the next album. I'm waiting for some sort of list and you gave me just one example in vanilla ice. the most generic go-to example, and that's it.

as for this outkast stuff, I don't discredit anybody's achievements. I even said that they were successful. I simply said that they weren't amongst the most successful acts of the '90s. youre just mad that I don't sit on my hands when I see people trying to push agendas. I keep telling yall, I don't care about no outkast. the only time yall see me talking about them is when yall try to rewrite history. if yall stop doing that, then you wont see me talking about them much at all. I'm not even talking about them in a negative light in this thread, and I usually don't speak bad of them actually.

DOG, you str8 listed their actual album sales, which totaled 5 million. then when I said, that's not nearly enough, you came back in the next post and said they sold 10 million ALBUMS. now ur claiming that you were including singles when you clearly used the word "ALBUMS". and for the record, their singles catalog wasnt all that big either breh. and now youre reaching for straws, trying to include industry props, and how much promotion they got from the huge laface/arista machine and chit like that; which means nothing to the conversation.

and I'm gonna start calling out all these people that are patting you on the back. I gotta call out @IllmaticDelta for continuously dapping you, knowing that youre bullchittin, all because he likes outkast. stuff like this is why this board fell off. yall need to man up and cut the chit.

@spliz too, talembout "great post". now if youre cosigning the tribe portion where he was arguing with someone else, then just quote that part. but you quoted his entire post, so you gotta get called out too.

breh
you replied to my post in which my OP was a reply to the poster consigning kid statement of street/thugs/calling women bytches nonsense

i used 3 examples that disprove kid statement
the fugees, outkast & tribe - you replied on some 'i can name plenty of acts that were more successful during that era'..... which you never did (besides anybody on bad boy / death row or jay z) name these plenty of hip hop acts that was more successful during da whole entire 90's

with that said - you left out fugees (probably cause your fan of them)
yet went in on kast & tribe (probably cause your not a fan of them)
-with this nonsense of kast only getting big unitl dre started dressing like a drag queen
-with this nonsense of tribe having this different look from the early 90's to the mid 90's & you believing them to be on some gay shyt

 

[kingofnyc]

and this is the chit that these muphukkas will dap, cosign, say "great post".

or they'll act like they didn't read it, then try to save face by arguing with me about some chit that I didn't say.

this board disgusts me half the time. MAN UP!!!!!

they dap me cause they both have the sense enough to understand i meant records (which includes everything they was part of & put out - singles / collaborations / producing / writing etc... )

you taking shyt WAYYYY too serious
why in da hell would i break down their 3 albums with posting the sales of them, then right after pdouble those numbers

 

[spliz]

Wu and Mobb Deep always had a large white fan base from what I've witnessed

Wu? Yea I could see that. Like I said I wasn't around much white people if any at all at the time. But I know they had a huge overseas fanbase. But Mobb Deep? Nah I don't see it. Again. Maybe it's just from my lack of interaction with white people in that time frame.

 

[DANJ!]

This thread didn't let me down,

Got a lil' bit of everything here: people who were there speakin' truth, people who weren't there speakin' Wiki, people who were 3 years old when all this shyt was goin' on, etc...

There's a little bit of truth in both arguments. YES, the popularized 'gangsta' element of the early-90s DID cause certain facets/artists of that era to be phased out due to changing tastes. At the same time, some of these artists were simply not able to adapt to the times, but they for some reason have still not embraced that truth about their careers.

It's all about adaptation, especially during those times... because hip-hop changed often, and the changes were so fast-paced at times, that it was easy to be left behind. There were even groups who were hot in '91/'92 who were catchin' bricks by '94. Some were able to keep up, and some weren't. Kid-n-Play is an example of a group that couldn't. They had become big stars with the movie, the cartoon, etc., but they also had a style/sound that was running its course, and they did nothing to stay in the loop. And this didn't mean they had to start wearin' ski masks and rap about robbin' nikkas... but they could've transitioned into something other than that same thing they had been doing for years. Same with people like Kwame, Kane, etc. Rappers like Heavy D/LL/Latifah weren't necessarily the hottest thing on the street by the time Death Row was poppin', but they were still in the game because they knew how to do them without getting lost in the sauce. Even acts like KRS-One were still in the loop because they were able to adapt- and sure, he wasn't moving Snoop/Ice Cube units, but he also wasn't out there clinging on to his glory days and refusing to stay current. Artists like Kid-n-Play, Kool Moe Dee, Kwame, Kane, etc have only been halfway willing to admit that their music wasn't strong enough to compete during that time.

 

[IllmaticDelta]

I'm white....from midtown KCMO, which is (or was, prior to gentrification) mostly black in the 80's and 90's. The schools were literally 99% black back then, to the point that they had to go to court to try and reverse desegregate the schools.

Mobb Deep had no white fans. At all. I mean....if you want to count me, but as I said, I was an outlier. Maybe later they had white fans but their first 2 albums only went gold and the height of their popularity was 1x plat....hardly numbers that would reflect a large white fan base.

Fred.

In NY, Mobb Deep def had white fans from Infamous on down. They had some of the same fans that listened to Wu-Tang. Go on instgram and you'll see many whites with mobb deep tats lol

 

[spliz]

In NY, Mobb Deep def had white fans from Infamous on down. They had some of the same fans that listened to Wu-Tang. Go on instgram and you'll see many whites with mobb deep tats lol

I'm born and raised in NYC and I didn't really see it like that but then again that might been cause I didn't fukk wit white people like that in the 90s lol

 

[hex]

In NY, Mobb Deep def had white fans from Infamous on down. They had some of the same fans that listened to Wu-Tang. Go on instgram and you'll see many whites with mobb deep tats lol

They couldn't have had white fans in any kind of significant numbers if their base sales were gold and the height of their popularity was 1x plat.

And I meant where I was from. Wu had a few white, skateboarder fans in '94 or '95 but the vast majority of their fans were black....but I didn't know of a single white Mobb Deep fan, aside from myself.

I'm born and raised in NYC and I didn't really see it like that but then again that might been cause I didn't fukk wit white people like that in the 90s lol

I'm saying. My boy Phil is from Brooklyn, he was basically the plug for NY rap when I was a teen....never heard of white Mobb Deep fans at any point back then. The white kids were mostly into underground rap....Lyricist Lounge type shyt.

Fred.

 

[IllmaticDelta]

They couldn't have had white fans in any kind of significant numbers if their base sales were gold and the height of their popularity was 1x plat.

their white fanbase grew larger by/during the their 4th album

And I meant where I was from. Wu had a few white, skateboarder fans in '94 or '95 but the vast majority of their fans were black....but I didn't know of a single white Mobb Deep fan, aside from myself.

yeah,I know. Wu was bigger than the Mobb but they had some of the same fans in NY

I'm saying. My boy Phil is from Brooklyn, he was basically the plug for NY rap when I was a teen....never heard of white Mobb Deep fans at any point back then. The white kids were mostly into underground rap....Lyricist Lounge type shyt.

Fred.

I remember alot of white kids listening to mobb/ghost/rae etc...in 95/96....they were like JoJo Pelligrino types lol

 

[Booker T Garvey]

okay, about 10 of you dudes have said kid n play didn't "ADAPT TO THE TIMES"

you all do realize that "THE TIMES" was that street/hard/thug look and sound - that's the point of the thread; you're canceling out your own arguments all up and down this thread.

as others have pointed out, this doesn't mean that you had to rap about CRIME around this time, but you had to come with a harder, grittier look and sound

take THE FUGEES for example; they weren't THUGS promoting negativity, but they came with a harder sound and look than kid n play/kwame did

these are just facts.