in the early 90's if you weren't street/thug/calling women bytches, you weren't popping -Kid N Play

kingofnyc

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all this time, i can't believe i just realize why kid n play fell off :mindblown:

they were teenage rappers that grew up & couldn't transition into making music for young adults

while in '92 hip hop introduced a new child rap duo
ironically, both rappers real name is Christopher... as well Christopher Reid & Christopher Martin aka kid n play




























RIP daddy mac

 

tuckgod

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Dude....you name dropping 90's mags and we talking about the 80's.

In the 80's it was Fresh, Black Beat, Word Up and Right On.....Jet and Ebony still counted as well...or am i going to far back for you.

Like I said, we didnt care about album sales in the 80's. Every rappers story is you get hood approval first then u blow up, thats common knowledge, unless u The Rapping Duke or Rapping Rodney(am I going to far back for you again?). But again, no one was talking album sales in the 80's.


The post of yours that I responded to included Z-Ro, clearly not a 80s or 90s artist.

The post I responded with included Naughty By Nature, a 90s group.

I've been talking 80's to mid 90's this whole time breh.
 

delnegro

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Another thing some of you should recognize is the numbers don't reflect hood impact or target audience. If that was the case Gangstarr would have never made the amount of albums they did.
 

IllmaticDelta

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Another thing some of you should recognize is the numbers don't reflect hood impact or target audience. If that was the case Gangstarr would have never made the amount of albums they did.

facts...I already made this point that you can't compare the top 40-demographics charts to the urban market
 

Ron Fox

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The post of yours that I responded to included Z-Ro, clearly not a 80s or 90s artist.

The post I responded with included Naughty By Nature, a 90s group.

I've been talking 80's to mid 90's this whole time breh.

I was still stuck on who went platinum before Kane in the 80's.


We originally was talking about how the hood pushes someone platinum and you gave me info with no stats so i was still stuck on who went platinum before Kane.


Lets move on cuz we not really going anywhere with this.
 

Wacky D

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:dwillhuh:there was and still is a "black chart"


i know.

but what is it really based off of? spins on black radio and things of that nature.

theyre not going out and polling black people. shoot, billboard/soundscan didn't even register a lot of mom-n-pop retail sales. i wouldn't be surprised if the majority wasn't registered.

:gucci:

What are you talking about?

We're talking about Com at the start of his career....through "The bytch In Yoo", which was around '96. We're talking about an era where cats could be lyrical as they want and not be considered nerds or weirdos or soft....back then "Triumph" was the lead single off an album that went 4x plat and the first verse is the definition of "rappity rap".

The general rap listener probably had no idea Com and Cube were even going at it. They had no input at all into rap back then, anyway. Sure they were buying albums but they wasn't sitting around talking about who got who in a rap beef.

Fred.


i don't think i fully articulated my point. and in fairness, i may have gone too far with the weirdo tag. corny would be the better word.

by general rap fan, i don't necessarily mean the casual audience. i mean the average dedicated rap fan in general that's heavily consumed with hip-hop.

common was moreso a purist favorite. all die-hard rap fans arent in that boat. purists are just a segment. outside of "used to love her", he was kinda corny to a lot of people. and was just one of those rappers that were mainstays on rap city that weren't really important like that. i know a lot of yall respected rap vets on here will get mad, but i guarantee 95% of yall are purists or have an extra-liking for rap that's geared towards that crowd.

just real talk, a lot of rappers that get praised to high noon on here, legends included were considered corny or just kinda ignored by a lot of people.

it is what it is.:manny:
 
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IllmaticDelta

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I'm not sure what any of this has to do with my argument.

Its like that in every era.

It backs up my point about the way overstated and so-called engulfing of variety that people THINK Gangsta Rap had. What black people rocked with/was popping in the black community was totally different from what was popping in the higher ends of top 40 radio




you can see the shift in the '92 video.

....to me it was nothing more that a newer dynamic more than an actual shift. Most HipHop was still non-gangsta

A look at what made the billboard hot 100 (white chart) in a random week of 92



The top 15 rap songs on the Billboard Hot 100 in the issue dated May 30, 1992.
 

tuckgod

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I was still stuck on who went platinum before Kane in the 80's.


We originally was talking about how the hood pushes someone platinum and you gave me info with no stats so i was still stuck on who went platinum before Kane.


Lets move on cuz we not really going anywhere with this.

:salute:
 

Sensei

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you is a gottdamn idiot....

COMMON's diss song to cube and Westide connect was entitled the B1TCH IN YOU

And is without doubt one of the hardest diss songs of all time up thier with the BRIDGE IS OVER and ETHER

i first heard it on a DJ CLUE tape matter of fact it was a banger on a lot of cats mixtapes.....S&S...GRANDMASTER VIC...and MISTER CEE and DOO WOP tapes.....

you don't know wtf you talking about...and again WHERE DA FUKK ARE U FROM??....cause i doubt you even lived in a urban area ..

much less the USA with your pathetic hip hop knowledge.....

matter of fact im thru having dialogue with buffoons like you...TAKE THIS NEG HOE :camby:

nikka I don't need to know the name of Common's diss song I already know the fukking name, what did Mack 10 say in one of the ''Beef'' docs that Common's diss repy was soft and nobody took him seriously since he a conscious rapper nobody expects him to come out with something hard hitting.
See that's thing about conscious rappers people don't have the expectation of them being confrontational or making any diss records,mofos expect them to stay in the lane.We ain't talking about no old school BDP you washed up never been nikka.

And you said Ether,really Ether by Nas, nikka what is you trying to say Nas ain't conscious rapper fukk boy, the fukk is you punk ass talking about?Nas does have conscious content on his albums and I respect that but for the most part the nikka ain't conscious.

Im from all over DC,CA and living in NYC bytch nikka.

Where you from ,ain't you supposed to be some South nikka that lived in NYC or some shyt,
Any way you yee ass nikka . I got knowledge of hip hop but don't give a fukk about it,Im not from NYC and aint tryna act like some back pack rapper.

You on here fronting like a mothafukka, you still can't name me hot mixtapes with conscious rappers or some 5 conscious rappers who went platinum in the 2000s or even past decade.Only hoe ass nikkas like you on the internet that want to tell the story the way want to and not deal with facts.Take your bytch ass on you fake assa lamma lakum punk.

Kid N Play ain't the only ones who said gangsta shyt took full steam, Big Daddy Kane said this shyt too.
 

IllmaticDelta

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i know.

but what is it really based off of? spins on black radio and things of that nature.

theyre not going out and polling black people. shoot, billboard/soundscan didn't even register a lot of mom-n-pop retail sales. i wouldn't be surprised if the majority wasn't registered.

yes..a combination of the two

I Know You Got Soul: The Trouble With Billboard’s R&B/Hip-Hop Chart


By the end of the 70s, acts like Parliament/Funkadelic, Teddy Pendergrass, and Tyrone Davis essentially had core R&B careers. A track or two by these acts would make the lower rungs of the pop Top 40, but the bulk of their Top 10 R&B hits wouldn’t even touch the Hot 100’s upper half, if at all. The bad news for such acts was that their lack of crossover generally meant lower label promotional budgets; the good news was that R&B success could sustain a career. And when pop crossover did happen, it really meant something. By the time the Commodores and Kool & the Gang started scoring Hot 100 No. 1’s at the turn of the 80s, they’d already racked up strings of R&B chart toppers since the mid-70s, presaging their pop success.

It also meant something when a white act charted R&B—the crossover validation worked the other way, too. Scores of acts that normally dominated the Hot 100 would occasionally record a song embraced by the R&B audience. Elton John has long attested to how thrilled he was when his “Bennie and the Jets” was the top song on black radio in Detroit and ultimately crossed to the R&B chart, where it peaked at a respectable No. 15. Other hits by white acts did even better, reaching the R&B chart’s Top Five: Average White Band’s “Pick Up the Pieces”, KC and the Sunshine Band’s “Get Down Tonight”, Wild Cherry’s “Play That Funky Music”, Bee Gees’ “You Should Be Dancing”, Rod Stewart’s “Da Ya Think I’m Sexy”, and, by the early 80s, Daryl Hall and John Oates’s “I Can’t Go for That (No Can Do)”. These songs didn’t chart high on Hot Soul Singles because someone in charge of the charts thought they sounded black enough—they crossed over because black radio stations and core R&B stores were playing and selling them in quantity.

(Payola surely played a role in those good-old-bad-old days, as it did throughout the 70s and 80s on the pop charts and rock radio. But R&B chart success in and of itself likely wasn’t a lucrative enough prize for labels to budget serious “incentives.” Anyway, as the evidence shows, the aforementioned white acts only occasionally scored serious R&B hits. If Warner had wanted Rod Stewart to have more than one R&B smash—rather than the solitary one he did—they’d have greased more palms.)

By the 80s, the R&B chart was its own demimonde with its own lineup of stars. On the surface, the chart had a more racially defined identity: In 1982 Billboard, not without controversy, renamed the chart Hot Black Singles, even though white acts like Hall & Oates, Madonna, Phil Collins, George Michael, and Lisa Stansfield sporadically charted R&B.

But these occasional appearances by white acts didn’t affect the chart in any major way during the decade of Michael, Lionel, Prince and Whitney—black music was doing just fine, thank you, both on the Hot Black Singles chart and on the Hot 100. In addition to the major inroads made at Top 40 radio by these megastars, a lower tier of core black superstars gave the 80s R&B chart its own distinct identity: Luther Vandross, the Gap Band, Freddie Jackson, Maze, Stephanie Mills, Melba Moore, Guy—with rare exception, these artists’ strings of top-charting R&B hits would bypass the pop Top 40 entirely. Indeed, what made the 80s one of the richest decades for black pop in a generation could be seen each week right at the top of Hot Black Singles—one week, Michael Jackson’s über-crossover hit “Billie Jean” could be on top, and then a week later, it would be replaced by a record as un–Top 40–friendly as George Clinton’s “Atomic Dog”.


SoundScan Ushers in an R&B/Hip-Hop Chart Boom

The deep-data era on the U.S. charts began in May 1991, with the introduction of SoundScan (later Nielsen SoundScan) technology—accurate tallying of sales at the retail counter, through scanned UPC barcodes on music purchases to Billboard's flagship album chart. Immediately, this revolutionized the chart, giving a boost to genres that the old manual-charts system had underreported. In particular, hip-hop and country artists benefited massively when sales were tallied more accurately.

Then in November 1991, the magazine brought SoundScan technology to the Hot 100. Because the Hot 100 was based not only on sales of singles but also radio airplay, Billboard introduced a computerized data feed from Broadcast Data Systems, which counted radio plays via a sonic fingerprint. While BDS didn’t eliminate recording industry payola, it made it much harder for labels to pay for a “paper” (phony) playlist add; the Hot 100 was now based on songs receiving actual airplay. Once again, the changes to the Hot 100, thanks to both BDS and SoundScan, were profound—it’s difficult to imagine Sir Mix-a-Lot topping the Hot 100 for over a month in the summer of 1992 without the more accurate technologies.

In 1992, the SoundScan and BDS technologies made their way to the black-music chart (two years earlier, the chart had been renamed again, this time as Hot R&B Singles). Billboard was so careful about not screwing up their R&B retail/radio formula—many small retailers couldn’t afford barcode scanners at first—that the magazine phased in the new technologies over several months to be sure they didn’t misrepresent what black retailers and stations were playing. But once the new formula was in full effect, by the start of 1993, rap’s profile on Hot R&B Singles improved almost immediately. Within the first three months, Naughty by Nature and Dr. Dre scored their first No. 1 hits on the more data-accurate R&B chart.

For the rest of the 90s, rap became so omnipresent on Hot R&B Singles—with 2Pac, Notorious B.I.G., Puff Daddy, Ma$e, and Missy Elliott scoring hits—that in 1999 Billboard finally added hip-hop to the name of the chart, redubbing it Hot R&B/Hip-Hop Singles & Tracks (a mouthful of a name that was mercifully shortened to Hot R&B/Hip-Hop Songs in 2005).

Of course, hip-hop wasn’t only dominating the R&B chart in the 90s—it was steadily taking over the Top 40, too. As early as 1993, black music was already so dominant on the Hot 100 that all but two of Billboard’s top 25 pop singles of the year were crossover tracks from the Hot R&B Songs chart (the only exceptions that year: one track each by UB40 and Soul Asylum). There were periods in the late 1990s and early 2000s where the Top 10 of the Hot 100 and R&B chart looked very similar. But that was largely because so many R&B and hip-hop tracks were legitimately crossing over to the pop charts—phenomena that SoundScan and BDS tracked accurately.

I Know You Got Soul: The Trouble With Billboard’s R&B/Hip-Hop Chart | Pitchfork
 

Sensei

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Y'all nikkas and this revisionist history..

Com didn't get nothing but the utmost praise and respect back then for making that record.

As a matter of fact, there was no such thing as a "conscious" rapper back then.

EVERYBODY was conscious.

Even the most gangsta acts alway peppered a couple "conscious" records on their projects.

You couldn't be embraced by the culture if you didn't.

Hip Hop in and of itself was a "conscious" art form until the mid/late 90s.









Haha dude I know from this post you grew up sheltered or your telling revisionist lies, the cold part about this is that your big named MCs have already said that gangsta rap was the thing to do in the 90s and took a backseat.

Yes I never said they weren't any conscious raps that rappers dropped here and there but for the most part it wasn't in abundance.

Com ain't get no respect because he ain't get no real accolades even in his home town, he ain't start getting bigger until late 90s. Common ain't go platinum and hardly got any features from even the your favorite underground Southern artists.

Whats so ironic is that those rappers you named like Ice Cube pushed all kind of gangsta shyt in their content and the consicous shyt wasn't far in between their rhymes. Cube likes to dub himself the father of gangsta rap,Pac called himself a thug who made songs like ''Gangsta Party'',and NWA made all kind of trail blazing gangsta shyt to kick it off into mainstream.Only one you kind of cool in is Too Short but that nikka was on playa macking shyt.

Making one song about life going through the Ghetto(Too Short), who could talk a good game(Ice Cube),expressing yourself censor free on records(NWA),and talking about crack babies in the trash can (2Pac) ain't really conscious nikka,its about TALKING ABOUT LIFE IN THE EVERYDAY STRUGGLE.
He wasn't at the time, I'm kinda confused what you mean. This wasn't "Electric Circus" era Com....he was shouting out BDs and Vice Lords on "Resurrection". Nobody thought he was super thug gangsta #1 but he wasn't seen as soft, at all, back then.

Fred.

Truthfully you couldn't be soft at all back then, there were was no room for any Drakes or Kanyes coming out, you wouldn't of made it as a rapper.

But just because he gave a shot out to them in they rhymes don't mean he was on some hardcore or gangsta shyt, in any case Common did not hit big until the late 90s or 2000 going gold.
 
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