in the early 90's if you weren't street/thug/calling women bytches, you weren't popping -Kid N Play

[Dafunkdoc_Unlimited]

No. Just......no.

I was there. East AND West Cost.

There was a veritable avalanche of 'non-thug' rap acts at that time that were competing with 'New Jack Swing'/RnB and House artists.

IT WAS A GREAT TIME TO BE CLUBBIN' !!!!!!!​

 

[Art Barr]

I remember seeing this book but I never picked it up

Back in the day I remember our white classmates clowning hip hop, "yo yo yo!! AAAAIIIGHT!!" fukking with us, and also VH1 not playing the rap part of Paula Abdul's song with the cartoon cat

Hip hop use to get shyt on, it wasn't "pop" enough I guess...but when Snoop/Dre came out it was like all that shyt slowly changed

And I do think there is a "trip to the zoo" element of it, white kids from mainstream America are drawn to the hood stereotypes, like an escape from their boring hallmark channel lives

oh definately...
that is why i lol, at people who's gateway is late nineties viacom based rap.
when, mtv outside of yo did not play rap at all past rock box, and then walk this way early on.
till pretty much naughty by nature's everything gonna be alright debuted.



[this could be listed as the oversaturated video that would lead to rap's downfall]


which we can say was the gateway prison industrial economy marketed song in full from visual to radio back then.

plus, which setup the mtv oversaturation playlist for prison industrial economy rap.
as before that mtv did not play rap outside of demme's time slot during the weekday and weekend for yo.

or it was so commercial and sellout based like hammer and vanilla ice you could easily see the issue.

as before hammer and vanilla ice were popular they were first BET mainstays solely in hammer.
while vanilla ice was a COMPLETE VIDEO BOX THE BOX add, and was ignored by mtv completely when ice ice baby first dropped and was a slow burn sales single success.

as before both sold out with disparaging pr, both hammer and vanilla ice were highly regarded culturally as performance acts.
they just had poor pr and poor content and direction that eventually they succumbed to themselves and not being able to showcase what culture they used to easily convey.

as both hammer and vanilla ice were talented for their type of original music they made originally.
they just got lost being to large and had no filter in pr. which lead to their downfall.

same as kid n play, as kid n play had no filter to say no, to certain damning direction culture wise.

art barr

 

[Wacky D]

i know you ain't a outkast fan BUT stop it

and BTW

90's


ATCQ
'90 PITTPOR - gold
'91 low end theory - plat
'93 midnite marauders - plat
'96 BRL - plat


kast
'94 southernplayer.... - plat
'96 ATliens - 2x plat
'98 aquemini - 2x plat

you can name plenty of artists that's had success like this over a span of time ???

that's the best you can come up with? those aren't huge numbers breh.

I didn't say they weren't successful. I was responding to you claiming that they were 2 of the most successful acts of the '90s.

going 1 or 2x plat isn't chit compared to the big dogs of the '90s. that's all I was saying.....along with the fact that both groups conformed in the mid-90s, which I guess you agree with since you didn't argue.

 

[Art Barr]

lol....you're not gonna find it because it never happened. Death row is/was a "black" creation based around what Dre already learned about the market from his NWA days. Remember, Gangsta rap as conceived by NWA was originally and only meant for their "hood". Noone knew it was going to crossover into white america

when this happened and it happened early on.




all of rap would eventually be compromised because it started the real discovery zone.
into misappropiating rap and then coding it with a hidden government marketed agenda based on cultureless black genocide devoid of black nationalism.

Eazy-E's status as a controversial figure took an unusual turn when he accepted an invitation to a lunch benefitting the Republican Senatorial Inner Circle hosted by President George Bush in March of 1991, a little less than a year after conservatives had deemed his music obscene in Florida. Since his presence among the right-wing politicians struck the media as somewhat absurd, the event was reported across the country over the next 24 hours.
Not surprisingly, Eazy-E found it necessary to explain in a brief television interview that his invitation was the result of a $2,500 campaign contribution, which he had made to a Republican politician who stood against censorship. Although this made the point that freedom of speech debates cut through party lines, the rapper's appearance among the Republican powers still left many of his fans ill at ease, since Bush's economic policies generally were not seen to be promoting the welfare of inner-city African-Americans. When Eazy-E spoke with Light about the incident that year, he denied any allegiance to the G.O.P. "How the f-- can I be a Republican when I got a song called 'F-- tha Police'?" he asked. "I ain't shyt--ain't a Republican or Democrat. I didn't even vote. My vote ain't going to help! I don't give a f-- who's the president."

also, we don't know how early on ruthless was compromised.

as the mtv banned video to soc, debuted in prime time on 20/20 uncensored, too.
until later on it was never seen again.
till years later when the box offered it as a retro play selection.
as originally soc was not even featured on the box.

of which i know so and vividly remember.
as the box originally oversaturated and spammed vanilla ice.
before it was moved from the east coast to national cable outlets.
this was way before luke went solo and crushed the building, too.

as all in the same gang was released in 05/1990.
almost a year prior to the republican eazy visit on 03/1991



which was a long time from the original release points of nwa's debut and the followup on soc.
we don't know if any of this was republican setup.
as republicans always in capitalism.
look to provide a system that absolves them of blame.
yet that system adds and enhances the ills they purposefully create.

art barr

 

[Dafunkdoc_Unlimited]

I LOVE when cats who weren't there try to tell us how things were.......as if the shyt wasn't documented facts.........









THUGGIN' DID NOT RUN THE 90'S!!!!​

 

[feelosofer]

Ok here is the thing. Kid and Play were actually skilled when it came to rapping and they hit a lick when they managed to market themselves through movies, merch, cartoons shows etc. But the problem was that a lot like Nice N Smooth, they came out at the end of an era but even with that said they could have pretty cleanly transitioned into an R&B hybrid lane if they had really wanted to. But they are reaching to an extent at least with the idea that gangsta rap ruined their careers or cut it short.

 

[KENNY DA COOKER]

The problem I got is when you say the media labeled it ''happy rap'' ,how would the mainstream white American media label it happy rap when they didn't even take rap as a genre seriously or even have it as a category at the Grammy's?
The streets labeled groups like Kid N Play happy go lucky rap.But they actually had a better edge because they were more party oriented rap then the conscious kind of rap.

The reality is ,yes; some groups like Brand Nubian, A Tribe Called Quest, Leaders of The New School,Das Efx were popular non-gangsta rap acts, but the fact is gangsta rap was far more popular because for many people on the streets they related to it more and tpp many people saw conscious rap as soft.Whether its right or wrong its reality.

I use MEDIA as a blanket term...also referring to Black publications and media outlets like the black owned radio station I worked for....

In fact the first time I came across the term HAPPY RAP was in the monthly magazine known as WORD UP that was owned and edited by an african American woman Cynthia Horner...

And was used alot amongst my peers whom were African American in the industry

And as far as Conscious rap it was NEVER SEEN AS SOFT...

where the hell are u from??

I got threatned many times by my PD at the station for trying to sneak in tracks by PUBLIC ENEMY and BDP..

PE and BDP was well respected in the streets..they just weren't popular with the club hopping hoes whom wanted something more DANCE FRIENDLY

Conscious Rap had a HARDER TIME getting airplay than the GANGSTA SHYT!

 

[Booker T Garvey]

I LOVE when cats who weren't there try to tell us how things were.......as if the shyt wasn't documented facts.........









THUGGIN' DID NOT RUN THE 90'S!!!!​

Whoa hold up bruh. This discussion is about HIP HOP.

Rnb RAN the 90's, even rappers will tell you that,

I mean even after this era laface came and cleaned up - nah man, this is just about hip hop, just hip hop.

 

[Harry B]

I swear about 70% of y'all dudes are ignoring the EARLY 90's part of the thread title...this criticism by Kwame was not about the whole 90's




So will smith is refusing to be wrong?

He's the one that said black radio stopped playing his music in 1991

I did miss it, but then again multiple albums have already been dropped from the early 90s.

 

[Booker T Garvey]

I use MEDIA as a blanket term...also referring to Black publications and media outlets like the black owned radio station I worked for....

In fact the first time I came across the term HAPPY RAP was in the monthly magazine known as WORD UP that was owned and edited by an african American woman Cynthia Horner...

And as far as Conscious rap it was NEVER SEEN AS SOFT...

where the hell are u from??

I got threatned many times by my PD at the station for trying to sneak in tracks by PUBLIC ENEMY and BDP..

PE and BDP was well respected in the streets..they just weren't popular with the club hopping hoes whom wanted something more DANCE FRIENDLY

Conscious Rap had a HARDER TIME getting airplay than the GANGSTA SHYT!

All of this is true, and that whole 3 or 4 year era really warrants a feature length documentary...

but the powers that be will never let that happen

 

[Wacky D]

I did miss it, but then again multiple albums have already been dropped from the early 90s.

the results really showed circa '92, definitely '93.

that's where the focus of this discussion should really be at.

I take what you're saying as "hardcore" as just reality, and how people were at the time. You say that Heavy D, Queen Latifah, Tribe, MC Lyte, etc. took on a more street persona. They're from New York, that's a part of their reality. They dressed in the fashion that was hot at the time. Since everyone was wearing Carhartts, Timberlands, and Guess jeans, then they incorporated that into their style. They spoke on the situations that were going on at the time, and had mature subject matter. Kid N Play did not adjust or evolve into anything different than what they were on their debut.

they took on more street personas as a result of the dominance of gangsta rap.

its not so much about the fashion. its moreso the imagery of the videos. everything took a whole different tone, as a result of gangsta rap.

LOTNS - Broke up over bullshyt, popular in the East. Busta becomes a superstar.

Pharcyde - Gold

Das Efx - Platinum

These nikkas, mane..

busta became a superstar in '97. whole different time period.

going gold circa '93 wasn't some great feat.

 

[hustlemania]

Could be Boss. She's not from the East Coast though...and I don't remember whether she had a video with a lowrider.

Rage is also from the East Coast..

 

[Wacky D]

As well as......

Kid N Play need to get on with that garbage.

nah

by '93, x-clan was gone.
by '93, brand Nubian looked like a different group. and to a lesser extent, de la soul did as well.

 

[Larry Lambo]

I remember seeing this book but I never picked it up

Back in the day I remember our white classmates clowning hip hop, "yo yo yo!! AAAAIIIGHT!!" fukking with us, and also VH1 not playing the rap part of Paula Abdul's song with the cartoon cat

Hip hop use to get shyt on, it wasn't "pop" enough I guess...but when Snoop/Dre came out it was like all that shyt slowly changed

And I do think there is a "trip to the zoo" element of it, white kids from mainstream America are drawn to the hood stereotypes, like an escape from their boring hallmark channel lives

White kids had already been listening to violent music for 20 years via heavy metal. Since R&B music isn't really conducive to tales of murder, black people usually sang about love, sex, injustice, etc.

Once hip hop came around and street cats used it as an outlet to portray their life, white kids gravitated to that same desire to hear about violence.

Violence and sex will always sell, it's just a matter people figure out how to incorporate it into their product.

 

[IllmaticDelta]

when this happened and it happened early on.




all of rap would eventually be compromised because it started the real discovery zone.
into misappropiating rap and then coding it with a hidden government marketed agenda based on cultureless black genocide devoid of black nationalism.





art barr

that's after the fact..the original architects of the style were black people doing music for their hood. Whiyte people didn't force them into that type of music. White people were never the market at that time because no one even knew they would support it. Gangsta rap was never thought to have commercial value by the higher ups until it actually happened like Melle Mel points out @ 1:08





Even white label exects were liketo early NWA and later with Dre/The Chronic before it blew up