Illegals and muslims can't be central to the Democrats anymore. Voters are just stupid. Admit it.

Reality

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I think brehs in here are really struggling to understand the white fragility at play here with respect to illegal immigration. You know how we feel about gentrification of areas like SF, Harlem, Brooklyn, etc.? That's how white people feel about the entire country. Right or wrong.

Imagine if you lived in Harlem, and were voting for city council / board, whatever for that area. You've loved Harlem, Harlem's always been a place for you and people who look like you. It's familiar. It's black. You know your history and story as a Black-American is intertwined with Harlem's.

There've always been some Hispanic people in Harlem - you know them and they know you. You even have a special term for their small part of Harlem, "Spanish Harlem". Things have gotten tense at times with them, but there's still no question that Harlem is really yours.

Recently, though, white people have been moving into Harlem. And Harlem's feeling less and less familiar to you. With the influx, rents have gotten higher and things have gotten more expensive. To make it worse, you overheard one of them mentioning being new to the "SoHa" area recently. When you asked them to show some respect and refer to the area as Harlem instead, they looked at you crazy like you were out of line. "I have every right to call it SoHa," they said.

Mentioning the interaction with the "transplant" to one of your mixed buddies, he rebukes you - the proper term is unseasoned resident. "Transplant is harsh and makes it sound as if they've moved from somewhere else." But they have. The fukk?

There's an election for city council for the area that covers Harlem...

Candidate #1 says:

"We want to make Harlem a great place to live and work, for all people. We welcome all those who want to take part in what has made Harlem so great. All those who embrace it's vibrancy, energy, and creativity are welcome. Together, we will move Harlem forward so that it remains the greatest neighborhood in the world. And of course, many of you have seen rents and higher prices lately. We are going to work together so that the developers and corporations in Harlem give those who live in Harlem a fair shake."

Candidate #2 says:

"Harlem was the greatest neighborhood in the world, but unfortunately, it's been changing. I want to make Harlem great again by embracing the values that made Harlem so great for past generations: its vibrancy, energy, and creativity. And we want to make sure Harlem remains great for all the people that have made it so great. We're not going to let anyone change what Harlem is. If you live here, you don't call it NoHa, SoHa, or anything else. It's HARLEM. And Harlem's not Starbucks, Whole Foods, or luxury condominiums. Harlem is jazz. Harlem is Malcolm. And Harlem is Hughes. Harlem is HARLEM. And we're not going to let any outsiders change that."

A lot of people are going to vote number 2 no matter what, because at least candidate #2 is addressing the elephant in the room: Harlem's changing and you don't like it.

What's worse is that there are many in the country who have the perception (often correct) that their tax dollars are going to protect / serve / help the very people who they don't think should be here. The Democratic Party's economic message is bound to fall flat provided that they aren't willing to talk about illegal immigration as an economic issue. As it stands, the Democratic Party's discussion of illegal immigration is one of the least intellectually robust / honest discussions it has in my opinion.
 

88m3

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SFGATE
2 hrs ·
For the first time in nearly two decades, Ramadan has come and gone without the White House recognizing it with an iftar or Eid celebration, as had taken place each year under the Clinton, Bush and Obama administrations.


Trump just ended a long tradition of celebrating Ramadan at the White House
In the early days of December 1805, a handful of prominent politicians received formal invitations to join President Thomas Jefferson for a White House dinner.…
SFGATE.COM



@4d 6f 6e 65 79 is this what you're into?
 

Pressure

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What's worse is that there are many in the country who have the perception (often correct) that their tax dollars are going to protect / serve / help the very people who they don't think should be here. The Democratic Party's economic message is bound to fall flat provided that they aren't willing to talk about illegal immigration as an economic issue. As it stands, the Democratic Party's discussion of illegal immigration is one of the least intellectually robust / honest discussions it has in my opinion.
should we kick all the white people out of Harlem?

There's been plenty of conversation about illegal immigrantion by democrats. It was large part of the past 8 years. Most of it was detailed, intellectual, honest, and touched on real economic numbers.

But just as people want Harlem back, people who think they're getting their country back are ignoring many of the cold hard facts because they want a boogeyman.
 

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I think brehs in here are really struggling to understand the white fragility at play here with respect to illegal immigration. You know how we feel about gentrification of areas like SF, Harlem, Brooklyn, etc.? That's how white people feel about the entire country. Right or wrong.

Imagine if you lived in Harlem, and were voting for city council / board, whatever for that area. You've loved Harlem, Harlem's always been a place for you and people who look like you. It's familiar. It's black. You know your history and story as a Black-American is intertwined with Harlem's.

There've always been some Hispanic people in Harlem - you know them and they know you. You even have a special term for their small part of Harlem, "Spanish Harlem". Things have gotten tense at times with them, but there's still no question that Harlem is really yours.

Recently, though, white people have been moving into Harlem. And Harlem's feeling less and less familiar to you. With the influx, rents have gotten higher and things have gotten more expensive. To make it worse, you overheard one of them mentioning being new to the "SoHa" area recently. When you asked them to show some respect and refer to the area as Harlem instead, they looked at you crazy like you were out of line. "I have every right to call it SoHa," they said.

Mentioning the interaction with the "transplant" to one of your mixed buddies, he rebukes you - the proper term is unseasoned resident. "Transplant is harsh and makes it sound as if they've moved from somewhere else." But they have. The fukk?

There's an election for city council for the area that covers Harlem...

Candidate #1 says:

"We want to make Harlem a great place to live and work, for all people. We welcome all those who want to take part in what has made Harlem so great. All those who embrace it's vibrancy, energy, and creativity are welcome. Together, we will move Harlem forward so that it remains the greatest neighborhood in the world. And of course, many of you have seen rents and higher prices lately. We are going to work together so that the developers and corporations in Harlem give those who live in Harlem a fair shake."

Candidate #2 says:

"Harlem was the greatest neighborhood in the world, but unfortunately, it's been changing. I want to make Harlem great again by embracing the values that made Harlem so great for past generations: its vibrancy, energy, and creativity. And we want to make sure Harlem remains great for all the people that have made it so great. We're not going to let anyone change what Harlem is. If you live here, you don't call it NoHa, SoHa, or anything else. It's HARLEM. And Harlem's not Starbucks, Whole Foods, or luxury condominiums. Harlem is jazz. Harlem is Malcolm. And Harlem is Hughes. Harlem is HARLEM. And we're not going to let any outsiders change that."

A lot of people are going to vote number 2 no matter what, because at least candidate #2 is addressing the elephant in the room: Harlem's changing and you don't like it.

What's worse is that there are many in the country who have the perception (often correct) that their tax dollars are going to protect / serve / help the very people who they don't think should be here. The Democratic Party's economic message is bound to fall flat provided that they aren't willing to talk about illegal immigration as an economic issue. As it stands, the Democratic Party's discussion of illegal immigration is one of the least intellectually robust / honest discussions it has in my opinion.
Bingo.

And people ignore the fact that LEGAL immigrants DO NOT LIKE illegals.
 

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People who want their country back don't make that distinction. Just as how you don't make a distinction between illegal immigrants and refugees. :francis:
Stop putting words in my fukking mouth. I have NEVER said this.

Refugees are legally permitted, accounted for, and accommodated.

You're going to debate me, quote me directly or ask me.

Stop making shyt up.

I know where I stand.
 

88m3

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illegal immigration is down and deportations have been increasing as long as I can remember

:mjlol:
 

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They lost the blue collar white vote

Republicans have somehow become the party for the white working class the past few years

It's this whole new/alt-right movement. They have provided a compromising position for white voters on both sides.

The left has to compromise IMO. No matter how far left you go, they keep dragging you even further.

People just get tired of it. I know I have.
 

Reality

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should we kick all the white people out of Harlem?

There's been plenty of conversation about illegal immigrantion by democrats. It was large part of the past 8 years. Most of it was detailed, intellectual, honest, and touched on real economic numbers.

But just as people want Harlem back, people who think they're getting their country back are ignoring many of the cold hard facts because they want a boogeyman.
I agree, but there's a certain level of jingoism certain voters need these days. Add to that the Spanish language rallies, campaign posters, etc. and the optics aren't as great by comparison.

At the end of the day, a lot of it comes down to tone. The Dems tend to strike an apologetic one (or one that seems apologetic by comparison) when talking about illegal immigration. It's a delicate balance.
 

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I agree, but there's a certain level of jingoism certain voters need these days. Add to that the Spanish language rallies, campaign posters, etc. and the optics aren't as great by comparison.

At the end of the day, a lot of it comes down to tone. The Dems tend to strike an apologetic one (or one that seems apologetic by comparison) when talking about illegal immigration. It's a delicate balance.
Precisely.

I'm not advocating a Trump-style approach.

I AM saying that Democrats need to figure out what their morals are because ignoring immigration law isn't a good starting place.

And keeping these illegals is not beneficial.
 

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@Call Me James

What exactly is your position on illegal immigration and how it should be handled?
He doesn't care. Borders don't exist to these people.

Thats the fukking problem.

I support overhauling and modernizing the LEGAL immigration statues and provisions. Even for refugees (which are accounted for, monitored, and regulated, etc.)

But illegals have been abusing the liberalized nature of American politics and society for decades then running to emotional pleas to escape accountability for their undeniable impact on the country.
 
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