"if em was black, he'd be the next muhammad ali of the game" - rakim

[SunZoo]

What props does he deserve that he hasn't received already?

He understands that his sales are inflated by the pop crowd and the "I don't listen to rap but I like Eminem" portion of his fanbase. It's why people often mention that he's overrated and underrated at the same time.

He never wanted their respect or the commercial accolades, he wanted ours...and with how polarizing of a figure he is due to his race, content and pop star status that's very likely in his mind still sort of a toss up.

Of course people in general respect Em as a lyricist but he still feels a strong need to prove himself to offset the Elvis effect that he's had on the genre.

 

[Wacky D]

If Jay Z was white he'd be Pete Nice

If you're talking about black emcees with similar skill sets or niche then you can certainly find some decent comparisons but they don't have his story. Of course him being relatable to white folk is one of the main catalysts but without that element the entire story changes. His story and ability to convey it in such a personal manner far outweighs his lyrical style on the list of things that made him a star. You change his race and you change the environment in which all that was cultivated.

If we have this conversation around the time Infinite drops it's a different story because at that point he was rapping to be rapping...because he could and was good at it. Had he stayed in that lane he would have remained interchangeable and would have gotten lost in the sea with the rest of the young black teenagers...but that ain't the case.

I see you conjured up a new argument.

theres plenty of black rappers who do a good job at conveying more intriguing personal stories, and nobody cares about most of em.

He understands that his sales are inflated by the pop crowd and the "I don't listen to rap but I like Eminem" portion of his fanbase. It's why people often mention that he's overrated and underrated at the same time.

He never wanted their respect or the commercial accolades, he wanted ours...and with how polarizing of a figure he is due to his race, content and pop star status that's very likely in his mind still sort of a toss up.

Of course people in general respect Em as a lyricist but he still feels a strong need to prove himself to offset the Elvis effect that he's had on the genre.

its really the opposite.

black people are the most passive race on earth when it comes to dealing with other races.

nobody is REALLY downplaying Eminem because of his race breh. his problems are that he never made a great album, let alone a classic. nor does he have a catalog of jams to compensate.

 

[SunZoo]

I see you conjured up a new argument.

theres plenty of black rappers who do a good job at conveying more intriguing personal stories, and nobody cares about most of em.

I been making that argument forever. 2pac and Eminem being the highest selling rap artists have a lot to do with how endearing they are to their fans. Unlike Jay/Nas, people care about them when the music cuts off because they are invested in them personally.

Had he stayed in that lane he was trying to occupy on Infinite his ceiling woulda been random Rawkus rapper #5.

black people are the most passive race on earth when it comes to dealing with other races.

nobody is REALLY downplaying Eminem because of his race breh. his problems are that he never made a great album, let alone a classic. nor does he have a catalog of jams to compensate.

I disagree.

And my point had less to do with how passive black people are and more to do with him understanding how inflated his sales and hype were and how he's not satisfied with the commercial accolades. He wants to be seen as one of the legit greats by the community (he is IMO) but feels like those factors play a part in him still having something to prove. It's why he tries to create separation between him and other pop acts, he knows he's a product because that's what the label calls upon him to do, but he's a MC first.

 

[Mr.Logic]

Hip Hop didn't shyt on Canibus, Canibus had one of the biggest buzzes of all time in 1997, he was next in line in that Rakim to Nas to Canibus lineage. He just dropped a mediocre debut and started a beef with an artist that had too much power.

And Hip Hop SHAT on him...

 

[SirBiatch]

black people are the most passive race on earth when it comes to dealing with other races.

nobody is REALLY downplaying Eminem because of his race breh. his problems are that he never made a great album, let alone a classic. nor does he have a catalog of jams to compensate.

THIS.

Stans really outchea trying to gymnast excuses for why we don't fukk with Em. No one really cares about his race - it's about the catalog. shyt's not hard to understand.

 

[↓R↑LYB]

i ain't never think somebody would refer to rakim as a c00n

Rakoon

 

[I love Latina women]

Rakoon

 

[BlackMamba824]

Rakoon

 

[MooseMouthMthafuga]

The interviewer low key called him out on those "c00n like" statements.

Rakim probably thought the interviewer was gonna bite on that Ali shyt, but he was like


"You wasn't feeling Scarface?"

 

[Wacky D]

I been making that argument forever. 2pac and Eminem being the highest selling rap artists have a lot to do with how endearing they are to their fans. Unlike Jay/Nas, people care about them when the music cuts off because they are invested in them personally.

Had he stayed in that lane he was trying to occupy on Infinite his ceiling woulda been random Rawkus rapper #5.

I agree. its what seperates Eminem from other white rappers.

I'm saying if he had black skin and rapped about blacker personal topics BUT he still kept the same skillset, he wouldn't see much success, if any at all.

I disagree.

And my point had less to do with how passive black people are and more to do with him understanding how inflated his sales and hype were and how he's not satisfied with the commercial accolades. He wants to be seen as one of the legit greats by the community (he is IMO) but feels like those factors play a part in him still having something to prove. It's why he tries to create separation between him and other pop acts, he knows he's a product because that's what the label calls upon him to do, but he's a MC first.

nah. he just doesn't have the cuts.

we're critical of Eminem on here because we're analysts. most black people offline aren't critical about Eminem like that. hes really not even a regular topic IRL.
in fact, when you criticize Eminem, a lot of black folks' knee-jerk reaction is to respond with some sort of consolation compliment about the guy like "well hes talented tho" because they don't want to feel racist.

trust me man. if Eminem could make at least one jam per album and drop just one album that's of at least 4 1/2 mic caliber to the general urban audience, black people would be forcing him into the bottom of their top 10s, even tho that's not enough for a black rapper to crack the top 10, they would still give it to em.

black people love when white folks try to assimilate themselves into black culture. Eminem just isn't the one.

 

[BulletProof]

I agree. its what seperates Eminem from other white rappers.

I'm saying if he had black skin and rapped about blacker personal topics BUT he still kept the same skillset, he wouldn't see much success, if any at all.





nah. he just doesn't have the cuts.

we're critical of Eminem on here because we're analysts. most black people offline aren't critical about Eminem like that. hes really not even a regular topic IRL.
in fact, when you criticize Eminem, a lot of black folks' knee-jerk reaction is to respond with some sort of consolation compliment about the guy like "well hes talented tho" because they don't want to feel racist.

trust me man. if Eminem could make jams like paul wall and say that he at least cranked out a 4 1/2 mic caliber album, black people would be forcing him into the bottom of their top 10s, even tho that's not enough for a black rapper to crack the top 10.

black people love when white folks try to assimilate themselves into black culture. Eminem just isn't the one.

Did you really just say Paul Wall?

Who the fukk made you the ambassador for black people?

You're a poster on the Internet. Your opinion, which will be forgotten by tomorrow, is overshadowed by almost every all time great who preceded Eminem.

Just make sure you pay your bills. Someone has achieved their dreams.

I hope this isn't the extent of yours.

 

[Gains]

 

[Wacky D]

Did you really just say Paul Wall?

Who the fukk made you the ambassador for black people?

You're a poster on the Internet. Your opinion, which will be forgotten by tomorrow, is overshadowed by almost every all time great who preceded Eminem.

Just make sure you pay your bills. Someone has achieved their dreams.

I hope this isn't the extent of yours.

yea I did say paul wall.

why are you so mad? your feelings are HURT I see. go sit in the corner.

I didn't claim to be the ambassador of black people. what are you talking about?

 

[Bolzmark]

Rakim and all the other legends who have said similar are right. Nobody else has the complete skillset mastered to the degree Em does. Technically he has no flaws, the other goats if they comparable lyrically don't have flows mastered or storytelling or any number of other things. Then Em also would murder the other goats in a cypher or actual freestyle or off too battle, he has it all. His only flaw is actually because of his race. ..his content sucks and even back in the day when it wasn't this bad it had a shelf life. Nobody would let him get away with typical rapper content so he had to invent a lane but now he's too old for that lane so he lost in the sauce don't know wtf to rap about but cliche inspiration bs when we know he a depressed shut in. If he was black none of that would a been a issue and who knows how far his music could have evolved with his skillset.

I have to disagree with the God MC and you as well. I honestly feel that if Em were black he would be a "B" level rapper at best. You know what his HUGE flaw is? His discography. Particularly as it pertains to records for parties/clubs and to a lesser extent, the radio. He just doesn't have that many classic songs for the parties and clubs. "Lose Yourself" is one and there are a few others, but compare him to a Jay-Z. A DJ could rock a party for a straight hour off nothing but Jay records. When compared to the greats he is sorely lacking in this area.

Gotta disagree with Ra. Being white has been Em's meal ticket. It's funny...at first it had to work against him. But once he established he was nice on the mic and got co-signed by Dre, his race became a HUGE boost to his career. Now White America for the first time had a rapper reppin them who was a legit talented MC. You think Em is selling 10 million on one album if he was black? GTFOH

 

[UserNameless]