"Guns are glorified in hip-hop culture". Bob Costas

[OG Talk]

Since I see it being brought up so much in this thread, I feel it needs to be said...

The rap star vs movie star argument has always been a little dicey to me.. Rappers are held to different standards by both their fans and their detractors...


Nobody blames Arnold, Pacino or Deniro for inspiring people to commit gun violence..But on the other hand nobody is critical of them for being "actors" or "playing a character"...

But rap fans are quick to call an artist to the carpet for "not being about what he raps about"...

So we can't complain how they are treated differently (and attribute it to racism) when a lot of us our guilty of doing it ourselves...

If you want the same leeway as actors, maybe we should start by admitting that it's ALL fantasy and escapism entertainment..

But rap fans wanna have it both ways...

If you want them all to be treated equal as artists/entertainers.. Maybe we should remove terms like "he ain't REALLY about that life" from our lexicon...


Until that happens.. You can't honestly say it's the same as John Wayne...

Because John Wayne's fans never cared if he "buss his gun", like the Urban Fantasy enthusiasts that fuel hip hop culture....

 

[Heelmatic]

He might wanna check the redneck culture out. When Obama was elected, then re-elected, redneck cacs everywhere RAN to buy up as many guns as possible. It aint just the hip hop culture...

 

[Blackout]

Since I see it being brought up so much in this thread, I feel it needs to be said...

The rap star vs movie star argument has always been a little dicey to me.. Rappers are held to different standards by both their fans and their detractors...


Nobody blames Arnold, Pacino or Deniro for inspiring people to commit gun violence..But on the other hand nobody is critical of them for being "actors" or "playing a character"...

But rap fans are quick to call an artist to the carpet for "not being about what he raps about"...

So we can't complain how they are treated differently (and attribute it to racism) when a lot of us our guilty of doing it ourselves...

If you want the same leeway as actors, maybe we should start by admitting that it's ALL fantasy and escapism entertainment..

But rap fans wanna have it both ways...

If you want them all to be treated equal as artists/entertainers.. Maybe we should remove terms like "he ain't REALLY about that life" from our lexicon...


Until that happens.. You can't honestly say it's the same as John Wayne...

Because John Wayne's fans never cared if he "buss his gun", like the Urban Fantasy enthusiasts that fuel hip hop culture....

Ok now try defending rednecks or did you magically forget that people in this topic mentioned them too.

 

[mastermind]

Because John Wayne's fans never cared if he "buss his gun", like the Urban Fantasy enthusiasts that fuel hip hop culture....

well thats not true. Its very much the same.

People went to John Wayne's latest western to see him blasting guns. John Wayne was a proud member of the NRA and was proud of his guns. His whole image was built on that because that is what the people wanted to see.

The same is true with Arnold. Just like rap fans, there is a certain level of masculinity that are attached to those characters, and to those actors.

Again, its foolish to say hip hop culture doesnt promote gun use, but lets not pretend the fans of those actors (and I specifically say Wayne, Stallone, Schwarzenegger, Statham, and not a guy like Pacino who really doesnt do movies of that ilk) are not doing the same thing.


And America's gun fascination is well beyond arts as well. It is something this nation has always loved. All the art mediums do is show us what we want.

 

[OG Talk]

Ok now try defending rednecks or did you magically forget that people in this topic mentioned them too.

What is there to defend? The mention of rednecks is a red herring..

 

[Blackout]

What is there to defend? The mention of rednecks is a red herring..

The mention of rednecks are the white equivalents of ghetto blacks. They exist and yet in this case and various other cases they don't get the blame thrown at them as much as hip hop.

People name other places where guns are glorified and you come in defending those places.

I think I'm seeing some bias from you. I wonder if I'm right.

 

[No_bammer_weed]

Since I see it being brought up so much in this thread, I feel it needs to be said...

The rap star vs movie star argument has always been a little dicey to me.. Rappers are held to different standards by both their fans and their detractors...


Nobody blames Arnold, Pacino or Deniro for inspiring people to commit gun violence..But on the other hand nobody is critical of them for being "actors" or "playing a character"...

But rap fans are quick to call an artist to the carpet for "not being about what he raps about"...

So we can't complain how they are treated differently (and attribute it to racism) when a lot of us our guilty of doing it ourselves...

If you want the same leeway as actors, maybe we should start by admitting that it's ALL fantasy and escapism entertainment..

But rap fans wanna have it both ways...

If you want them all to be treated equal as artists/entertainers.. Maybe we should remove terms like "he ain't REALLY about that life" from our lexicon...


Until that happens.. You can't honestly say it's the same as John Wayne...

Because John Wayne's fans never cared if he "buss his gun", like the Urban Fantasy enthusiasts that fuel hip hop culture....

I dont know if this position holds here. I think the movie stars mentioned carried with them a certain credibility that lent itself to the roles they were playing. Stallone, Wayne, Arnold....they werent exactly choir boys during their formulative years, which fleshed out their gritty characters. Most tough guy actors had troubled lives. Its not specific to hip hop, its just expressed in a more subtle way.

And in that same vain, its not as if most rap fans are encouraging their artists to engage in criminal activity --- just dont be melvin nerdly from Iowa, and then get behind the mic and talk like you're tookie williams.

Besides, isnt this point of analytic a bit outdated? How many big name artists glorify extreme violence nowadays? The main culprit is chief keef, and he's been HEAVILY criticized. The music has moved away from the gun culture, and most hip hop fans havent batted an eyelash over it. Biggie was exposed as having lived an upper class childhood --- Ross was exposed as being a C.O. Didnt hurt either's popularity one iota. Hip hop culture is about wanton materialism. Not gun culture. It aint 1995 no mo.

 

[OG Talk]

well thats not true. Its very much the same.

People went to John Wayne's latest western to see him blasting guns. John Wayne was a proud member of the NRA and was proud of his guns. His whole image was built on that because that is what the people wanted to see.

The same is true with Arnold. Just like rap fans, there is a certain level of masculinity that are attached to those characters, and to those actors.Again, its foolish to say hip hop culture doesnt promote gun use, but lets not pretend the fans of those actors (and I specifically say Wayne, Stallone, Schwarzenegger, Statham, and not a guy like Pacino who really doesnt do movies of that ilk) are not doing the same thing.


And America's gun fascination is well beyond arts as well. It is something this nation has always loved. All the art mediums do is show us what we want.

John Wayne was a poor example because of his conservative roots.. But there is a litany of anti gun liberal actors that have been paid handsomely over the years for promoting gun violence on film...They are rarely mocked or criticized for "not being about that life"...They're building mansions from the proceeds and continue to be respected by their fans and peers...

 

[mastermind]

John Wayne was a poor example because of his conservative roots.. But there is a litany of anti gun liberal actors that have been paid handsomely over the years for promoting gun violence on film...They are rarely mocked or criticized for "not being about that life"...They're building mansions from the proceeds and continue to be respected by their fans and peers...


Anti gun actors - YouTube

the last line of my post said its beyond actors and the arts. Their would not be guns and violence in our music, film, tv, etc were it not what Americans wanted to see.

 

[NYC Rebel]

I dont know if this positions holds here. I think the movie stars mentioned carried with them a certain credibility that lent itself to the roles they were playing. Stallone, Wayne, Arnold....they werent exactly choir boys during their formulative years, which fleshed out their gritty characters. Most tough guy actors had troubled lives. Its not specific to hip hop, its just expressed in a more subtle way.

And in that same vain, its not as if most rap fans are encouraging their artists to engage in criminal activity --- just dont be melvin nerdly from Iowa, and then get behind the mic and talk like you're tookie williams.

Besides, isnt this point of analytic a bit outdated? How many big name artists glorify extreme violence nowadays? The main culprit is chief keef, and he's been HEAVILY criticized. The music has moved away from the gun culture, and most hip hop fans havent batted an eyelash over it. Biggie was exposed as having lived an upper class childhood --- Ross was exposed as being a C.O. Didnt hurt either's popularity one iota. Hip hop culture is about wanton materialism. Not gun culture. It aint 1995 no mo.

Exactly.

shyt is tired reaches at sociological explanations for things gone wrong.

 

[Da King]

Alot of white people listen to hip hop

That's not the point, those cacs shooting up schools listened to heavy metal

 

[BrothaZay]

That's not the point, those cacs shooting up schools listened to heavy metal

Prove it.

 

[Easy-E]

my statement wasnt meant to blame pop culture, but why blame just hip hop on its own? The gun culture existed well before PSK came out.


And listening to his statement, this idiot was specifically targeting hip hop only. I am assuming because its black players in the NFL and NBA, but its still bullshyt.

My post was directed at Costas, not you

I agree with you

 

[OG Talk]

I dont know if this positions holds here. I think the movie stars mentioned carried with them a certain credibility that lent itself to the roles they were playing. Stallone, Wayne, Arnold....they werent exactly choir boys during their formulative years, which fleshed out their gritty characters. Most tough guy actors had troubled lives. Its not specific to hip hop, its just expressed in a more subtle way.

And in that same vain, its not as if most rap fans are encouraging their artists to engage in criminal activity --- just dont be melvin nerdly from Iowa, and then get behind the mic and talk like you're tookie williams.

Besides, isnt this point of analytic a bit outdated? How many big name artists glorify extreme violence nowadays? The main culprit is chief keef, and he's been HEAVILY criticized. The music has moved away from the gun culture, and most hip hop fans havent batted an eyelash over it. Biggie was exposed as having lived an upper class childhood --- Ross was exposed as being a C.O. Didnt hurt either's popularity one iota. Hip hop culture is about wanton materialism. Not gun culture. It aint 1995 no mo.

Of course it is.. But this is Bob Fukkin Costas here..He's been fighting Nixon era culture wars his whole career.. That's his shtick..He treats end zone celebrations as a sign of the pending apocalypse..

Hip hop is not under attack or being used as a scape goat..

50 Cent is friends with Bette Midler on Oprah now.. Jay-Z sat front row at the inaugaration and performs 99 Problems at Democratic fundraisers.. Snoop Dogg is as American as apple pie at this point.. He's doing Hot Pocket commercials for christsake.. Nobody is afraid of hip hop in 2013...



But even you admit it yourself.. Nobody wants to see Melvin Nerdly from Iowa rap like Tookie Williams in a song...But Melvin Nerdly from Iowa can act like Tookie Williams in a film and receive an Oscar and nobody will care.. There lies the difference..So you can't demand the same leeway if you yourself have different standards...

 

[cornercommission2k12]

Since I see it being brought up so much in this thread, I feel it needs to be said...

The rap star vs movie star argument has always been a little dicey to me.. Rappers are held to different standards by both their fans and their detractors...


Nobody blames Arnold, Pacino or Deniro for inspiring people to commit gun violence..But on the other hand nobody is critical of them for being "actors" or "playing a character"...

But rap fans are quick to call an artist to the carpet for "not being about what he raps about"...

So we can't complain how they are treated differently (and attribute it to racism) when a lot of us our guilty of doing it ourselves...

If you want the same leeway as actors, maybe we should start by admitting that it's ALL fantasy and escapism entertainment..

But rap fans wanna have it both ways...

If you want them all to be treated equal as artists/entertainers.. Maybe we should remove terms like "he ain't REALLY about that life" from our lexicon...


Until that happens.. You can't honestly say it's the same as John Wayne...

Because John Wayne's fans never cared if he "buss his gun", like the Urban Fantasy enthusiasts that fuel hip hop culture....

i get where you coming from, but the angle that whites dont look upon they superstars to be believable is a bit false

there is a reason, the jean claude van dam, and the steven segal's fell out of favor with audiences and hollywood wouldnt put the money behind them anymore. and that is because at some point they became slower, more stunt doubles seemed to have to be used or scenes being sped up seemed so unbelievable to the viewer who would watch them.

its the equivalent of saying they not about that life, cause all they saying is those guys are not believable in action roles

hell stallone bascially admitted this as such and said this is the reason he was taking hgh because hollywood aint buying a action hero who aint believable.

then add on, what is the selling point of modern video games these days, its to get the graphics more real and make the experience more believable. its the equivalent of saying a video game is not about that life if one trying to play the game aint hearing the realistic guns sounds and the image of death and giving that person a close idea of what it would be like to kill many people and continue on maliciously. many black children play these games as well

and most of these massive shootings are more identical at what is being displayed in those video games and in those die hard type movies than what is being spoken on a rap song or shot in a youtube video

now if that white dude who shot up that movie theater was wearing skinny jeans, baby dreads and shot a youtube clip with the guns flashing just minutes before he shot the place up, then i would be inclined to believe hip hop had a influence

but detectives said he was trying to mock the villain from the dark knight. sure the writers of the dark knight didnt base bane off a hip hop artist.