Wtf
Dirk says Lebron passes MJ when he becomes the all-time scorer
- Thread starter HandyWithTheSteel
- Start date
Piff Perkins
Veteran
Yup. And Bron better than Jordan at most of them.
Js >>>>>>> Lebrons
Therefore Jordan is better.
murksiderock
Superstar
Dog Mike didn't have Bron's versatility as a defender. Peak for peak it isn't close. Bron was often guarding multiple threats throughout a game or series, from the opp's best ball handler, to best scorer, to best big. And he was doing this with effect, Mike was never on this level...
Bron was a linebacker calling the plays on defense, his versatility and defensive skillset allowed him to anchor a variety of different coverages, and there were elite defensive units fielded around Bron's dexterity as a jack-of-all-trades defender. No ELITE defensive unit ever featured Michael Jordan as the centerpiece, ever. When paired with other great defenders and a real anchor he could excel...
Mike wasn't calling no plays, wasn't guarding the best player on the other team and certainly wasn't taking multiple assignments in one game with any regularity. Mike was not a rim deterrent, his athleticism gave him a spark in transition but in the half court he was not a threat at the rim. Mike was a gambler who played in an era where defensive metrics were less sophisticated. Defensive basketball was less understood, period. He was a good defender, strong, decent hands, played in position well, but his defense overall is overrated...
BK The Great
Veteran
fukk outta here 
Not Lebron or Dirk touching Jordan no matter how many times you spin it.
Not Lebron or Dirk touching Jordan no matter how many times you spin it.
murksiderock
Superstar
My only thing with people who say Bron had all these premier teammates, is damn near every GOAT has that on the road to championships. I'm not talking about counting HOF'ers, I'm talking the actual construction of rosters relative to The Field in a given era...
Mike's 90s Bulls were absolutely stacked relative to peers in the 90s. Guys rebutting with "Pippen was the only All-Star" or "he only had a couple HOF teammates", is irrelevant because dudes are arguing from an intellectually dishonest place, comparing the Bulls to teams not of that era...
So it's a nonstarter for me when people say Mike never had all these premier players, Mike played on three or four rosters better than Bron's best roster. Every great player had help on the road to riches. There's Ewings and Reggies and Barkleys who wish they had the teams around them Mike had on the same era...
Pippen at peak was a borderline Top 5 player, I don't doubt he's overrated. Mike's success without him is nearly nothing though. I don't think he was That Guy but he was the perfect wingman for Mike, if nothing else he deserves his due for that...
Ethnic Vagina Finder
The Great Paper Chaser
People forget the road the bulls took and the games they won when Jordan played like shyt just to get to the Finals.
Jordan never gets to the finals with the team Lebron took his first stint in Cleveland.
Boonapalist
Superstar
@murksiderock breh I’m sorry but you know as amazing as Lebron’s performance was it’s only a subset of heads that rate that run that high lol. But I respect the opinion regardless.
The 16 Finals has the narrative and storybook ending but to me Lebron in 09 against the Magic was the best I’ve seen. It just gets forgotten about because it wasn’t in the finals, people were disappointed Lebron and Kobe didn’t meet in the finals that year, his teammates let him down, the 09 Magic aren’t highly regarded at all, and incorrect narratives on how he was being defended.
But they were a great defense anchored by one the best rim protectors in his prime and Lebron. Yet he was able to get attack and get to the line at an insane rate, while playmaking at an all time level and was everywhere on defense. The problem was his teammates didn’t do their part. I knew than what it was with him. He just didn’t have the longevity or accolades yet.
But after 2018 seeing how he just continually dominated an entire conference year in and out (idc how weak it was or perceived to be). On top of everything else. I had to put him #1.
The 16 Finals has the narrative and storybook ending but to me Lebron in 09 against the Magic was the best I’ve seen. It just gets forgotten about because it wasn’t in the finals, people were disappointed Lebron and Kobe didn’t meet in the finals that year, his teammates let him down, the 09 Magic aren’t highly regarded at all, and incorrect narratives on how he was being defended.
But they were a great defense anchored by one the best rim protectors in his prime and Lebron. Yet he was able to get attack and get to the line at an insane rate, while playmaking at an all time level and was everywhere on defense. The problem was his teammates didn’t do their part. I knew than what it was with him. He just didn’t have the longevity or accolades yet.
But after 2018 seeing how he just continually dominated an entire conference year in and out (idc how weak it was or perceived to be). On top of everything else. I had to put him #1.
The Last Dance Part II Coming Soon
No he doesn't. I swear MJ's rep as a defender is solely based off of what he did from '84-90' because he wasn't even his own team's best or primary defender [for the other team's best offensive perimeter player] afterwards.
Bron was MUCH more versatile while still being elite at defending multiple positions. MJ having a DPOY doesn't negate that.
rbksNgirbauds
Even on the court we stay flyy, Jada & A.I.
Nah, I just don't fundamentally think he's a better hooper, like artistically. Don't let these cacs trick y'all into only looking at a poetic game like basketball too numerically bent. And the resumes are kinda disparate as well..... everyone doesn't value longevity over peak value.
But this debate is exhausting, how long have we been going at it ? Lol
But this debate is exhausting, how long have we been going at it ? Lol
at what exactly?Yup. And Bron better than Jordan at most of them.
I agree that he wouldn't have a 2011, but at the same time, I don't think he would've had a 2016 because Jordan just wasn't as good at the overall game of basketball as LeBron is.
He didn't have the playmaking ability, nor did he have the defensive IQ and switchability that Bron had.
fifth column
Superstar
There is also the dominate his era better that Bron did his era, higher peak etc.. but I don’t see your point