"Death to the Pessimistic State of Mind" - Nas Voice: NYK '23 Pre-Season Thread

tremonthustler1

aka bx_representer
Joined
Apr 30, 2012
Messages
83,540
Reputation
9,194
Daps
207,183
Reppin
My Pops Forever RIP
I don’t think the fanbase is enthralled with overpaying for Mitchell.
:hubie:

The media keeps trying to make this hype but the FO is right to say fukk it. There is a difference between paying a premium and the bullshyt Ainge is asking for.
Barring a huge market correction going forward, you're gonna overpay for whoever shows up. If it's Mitchell, all the picks. These supermax guys in a year or two: all the picks. Adding a solid starter might cost you 1-2 picks. A fringe kinda all-star costs you 3 and swaps and stuff. If those rates scare y'all off, I understand, but then y'all deserve to get ripped for what y'all did on draft night.
 

Wargames

One Of The Last Real Ones To Do It
Joined
Apr 1, 2013
Messages
26,211
Reputation
4,888
Daps
99,075
Reppin
New York City
Barring a huge market correction going forward, you're gonna overpay for whoever shows up. If it's Mitchell, all the picks. These supermax guys in a year or two: all the picks. Adding a solid starter might cost you 1-2 picks. A fringe kinda all-star costs you 3 and swaps and stuff. If those rates scare y'all off, I understand, but then y'all deserve to get ripped for what y'all did on draft night.
No player in the history of the nba has ever cost 6 picks in a trade, and Ainge asked for 6-8 draft… not swaps, just 6-8 draft picks, plus a collection of young players and probably swaps in there as well. Doing that trade isn’t being being proactive, it’s malpractice or at least a form of negligence.

The trade can still happen but it ain’t that.

I keep saying this but Leon Rose basically orchestrated the Melo and Bargnani trades and Aller robbed the Knicks for JR Smith and Shump. To me it says a lot that those two leading the Knicks FO backed out and told Ainge go see what the rest of the league can offer and then come back.

What Ainge got for Gobert 4 draft picks, 1 swap, 2 Vets, and 3 young guys is a more realistic range of what he should be asking for Mitchell
 

tremonthustler1

aka bx_representer
Joined
Apr 30, 2012
Messages
83,540
Reputation
9,194
Daps
207,183
Reppin
My Pops Forever RIP
No player in the history of the nba has ever cost 6 picks in a trade, and Ainge asked for 6-8 draft… not swaps, just 6-8 draft picks, plus a collection of young players and probably swaps in there as well. Doing that trade isn’t being being proactive, it’s malpractice or at least a form of negligence.

The trade can still happen but it ain’t that.

I keep saying this but Leon Rose basically orchestrated the Melo and Bargnani trades and Aller robbed the Knicks for JR Smith and Shump. To me it says a lot that those two leading the Knicks FO backed out and told Ainge go see what the rest of the league can offer and then come back.

What Ainge got for Gobert 4 draft picks, 1 swap, 2 Vets, and 3 young guys is a more realistic range of what he should be asking for Mitchell
15 years ago, nobody had traded 5 players and 2 picks for 1 player before. Then KG got moved. Back in the day, you needed a player on Mitchell's level to entertain the other team in trade talks, real blockbusters. 15-20 years ago, Mitchell's not getting moved for anything less than Jaylen Brown for example, or Ingram. Then it was the "give me a huge expiring so I can get these free agents with this cap space" era. Then teams had to draft well and hope their prospect stable was enough for a deal. Then the Jrue trade happened and now we're in the picks + pick swaps era. In this instance, aside from maybe Grimes, I don't even feel like the players are holding up the deal as much as it is which picks are involved and how they're protected.

the trade from earlier this summer went down and put a stop to anything major because now the league gotta adjust. On draft night, you mighta gotten Mitchell for young players, #11 and maybe 2 other picks. shyt changes that fast and when it does, everyone's caught off guard but that's gonna be the new currency. OKC was one step ahead of everybody in that regard and even if that big doesn't get traded from Utah, someone was gonna press OKC for those picks simply because they have so many of them. If I have 20 other firsts, asking me for 5 doesn't feel like I'm asking for much, so all this was inevitable. The Knicks just happen to be the first team getting tested in the pick inflation era (for lack of a better term)
 

RickyGQ

No nikkas!
Supporter
Joined
May 2, 2012
Messages
15,475
Reputation
1,956
Daps
56,979
Reppin
NJ
Again I never said that those players weren’t upgrades..... what I specifically said was that the Lakers would and should ask for picks in the deal seeing as they would taking on longer contracts and be arguably losing for that very reason. Put your team bias aside and look at the bigger picture of that deal.

They’d literally be taking on over $100 million dollars even with those options, so of course they’d ask for shyt in return. Again, let’s not act like that hasn’t happened with previous deals like that. That’s literally the reason why Love is still in Cleveland till this day.
They’re taking on those contracts because that’s their only way to improve the roster, this year AND going forward. They literally can’t afford to wait.
 

RickyGQ

No nikkas!
Supporter
Joined
May 2, 2012
Messages
15,475
Reputation
1,956
Daps
56,979
Reppin
NJ
Barring a huge market correction going forward, you're gonna overpay for whoever shows up. If it's Mitchell, all the picks. These supermax guys in a year or two: all the picks. Adding a solid starter might cost you 1-2 picks. A fringe kinda all-star costs you 3 and swaps and stuff. If those rates scare y'all off, I understand, but then y'all deserve to get ripped for what y'all did on draft night.
Meh, we did those trades before Minnesota threw a grenade at trade value and severely overpaid for a player that people were questioning if Utah would even be able to move just weeks ago.

They fukking Zillow’d the trade market
 

Thavoiceofthevoiceless

Veteran
Supporter
Joined
Aug 26, 2019
Messages
44,148
Reputation
5,308
Daps
136,602
Reppin
The Voiceless Realm
They’re taking on those contracts because that’s their only way to improve the roster, this year AND going forward. They literally can’t afford to wait.

Still doesn’t change the fact that it’s not a good trade for the Lakers if they aren’t getting any picks in the deal. If it was that easy to move Randle, then the Knicks would have already done so by now.
 

RickyGQ

No nikkas!
Supporter
Joined
May 2, 2012
Messages
15,475
Reputation
1,956
Daps
56,979
Reppin
NJ
Still doesn’t change the fact that it’s not a good trade for the Lakers if they aren’t getting any picks in the deal. If it was that easy to move Randle, then the Knicks would have already done so by now.
If the Knicks had to get off Randle they could have. They just wouldnt like the return and felt like he’s worth more to them than a trade. The lakers need to get off Westbrook and literally can’t.
 

Thavoiceofthevoiceless

Veteran
Supporter
Joined
Aug 26, 2019
Messages
44,148
Reputation
5,308
Daps
136,602
Reppin
The Voiceless Realm
If the Knicks had to get off Randle they could have. They just wouldnt like the return and felt like he’s worth more to them than a trade. The lakers need to get off Westbrook and literally can’t.
The Lakers can get off Westbrook's contract if they really wanted to. They just don't want to give up the picks that it would take to move him.
 

DPresidential

The Coli's Ralph Ellison
Supporter
Joined
Oct 31, 2012
Messages
25,148
Reputation
13,332
Daps
102,024
Reppin
Old Brooklyn
15 years ago, nobody had traded 5 players and 2 picks for 1 player before. Then KG got moved. Back in the day, you needed a player on Mitchell's level to entertain the other team in trade talks, real blockbusters. 15-20 years ago, Mitchell's not getting moved for anything less than Jaylen Brown for example, or Ingram. Then it was the "give me a huge expiring so I can get these free agents with this cap space" era. Then teams had to draft well and hope their prospect stable was enough for a deal. Then the Jrue trade happened and now we're in the picks + pick swaps era. In this instance, aside from maybe Grimes, I don't even feel like the players are holding up the deal as much as it is which picks are involved and how they're protected.

the trade from earlier this summer went down and put a stop to anything major because now the league gotta adjust. On draft night, you mighta gotten Mitchell for young players, #11 and maybe 2 other picks. shyt changes that fast and when it does, everyone's caught off guard but that's gonna be the new currency. OKC was one step ahead of everybody in that regard and even if that big doesn't get traded from Utah, someone was gonna press OKC for those picks simply because they have so many of them. If I have 20 other firsts, asking me for 5 doesn't feel like I'm asking for much, so all this was inevitable. The Knicks just happen to be the first team getting tested in the pick inflation era (for lack of a better term)
You make some good points. That being said, the Knicks have a vested interest in not being that first team to take the damage during this inflation era.

Leon Rose didn't take on this position to be included in the "inept FO" collage that is the laughing stock of the NBA. He's not trying to be in the history books for that.

If the Knicks are going to be doing this trade; they will make every effort to NOT make it appear to adhere to the stereotypes of "Ainge fleeces yet another team. Knicks are same ole LOLknicks."

Interestingly, I don't see why anyone would think the Knicks are desperate. Nothing about the way they have been making moves for the last 3 years indicates they are willing to destroy their plan for WIN NOW.

They accumulate the young players and picks to do effective moves. Not to just do moves to do them.
 
Last edited:

Thavoiceofthevoiceless

Veteran
Supporter
Joined
Aug 26, 2019
Messages
44,148
Reputation
5,308
Daps
136,602
Reppin
The Voiceless Realm
You make some good points. That being said, the Knicks have a vested interest in not being that first team to take the damage during this inflation era.

Leon Rose didn't take on this position to be included in the "inept FO" collage that is the laughing stock of the NBA. He's not trying to be in the history books for that.

If the Knicks are going to be doing this trade; the will make every effort to NOT make it appear to adhere to the stereotypes of "Ainge fleeces yet another team. Knicks are same ole LOLknicks."

Interestingly, I don't see why anyone would think the Knicks are desperate. Nothing about the way they have been making moves for the last 3 years indicates they are willing to destroy their plan for WIN NOW.
Ehhhh a counterpoint to that is they haven't really had any higher tier players that have been clamoring to go to New York to even destroy those current plans to win now.
 

Peter Popoff

Baba Yega in black uptowns
Joined
Dec 25, 2012
Messages
30,321
Reputation
11,219
Daps
88,337
No more stupid that you and other posters in this thread insisting that you're going to get off the contract of Randle and Fournier without giving up any picks in return.
No seriously, which GM is goofy enough to willingly want Westbrick? I'll wait.

Knicks have 8 picks and can give with Randle, yes.
 

Thavoiceofthevoiceless

Veteran
Supporter
Joined
Aug 26, 2019
Messages
44,148
Reputation
5,308
Daps
136,602
Reppin
The Voiceless Realm
No seriously, which GM is goofy enough to willingly want Westbrick? I'll wait.

Knicks have 8 picks and can give with Randle, yes.

He's an expiring contract. Why wouldn't they want him especially if the Lakers offer up those picks to do so. Let's not act like expiring contracts don't have value in this league especially if Russ would agree to a buyout, which he won't nor shouldn't.
 
Top