"Death to the Pessimistic State of Mind" - Nas Voice: NYK '23 Pre-Season Thread

[storyteller]

Who cares what kind of barometer is that? Number one option on a .500 team over 2 months

Stop it son isn’t impactful like that

Last 20 games averaging 23.5 points, 6 boards, 3 assists on an awful 39/30/76 splits. Just volume box score stats from having a high usage. Dude specifically said he and his trainer made the goal to average 20 points per game.

Herro and Bane were both better this season…

Herro’s shooting and microwave ability is more valuable to a team than whatever the hell it is y’all think Barrett is doing out there.

Bane’s 3&D is more valuable than whatever the hell y’all think Barrett is doing out there.

To mention anyone’s defense is bullshyt Barrett is not a defensive stopper and is not a strong defender off-ball.

Well no, he literally was that impactful. He was the number one option on the team and they went 11-11 post-ASB. 24, 6, 3 on a .500 team without the luxury of Ja Morant and Jaren Jackson Jr or Kyle Lowry, Jimmy Butler, and Bam Adebayo to make things easier efficiency-wise. RJ didn't even get to run with a point guard.

 

[Wargames]

Sochan is Ron Artest’esque as a wing. Really good defender. I have him, Kendall Brown, and Mark Williams as guys flagged who aren’t in the lottery discussion now, but will likely be once workouts start.

 

[Wargames]

Kendall Brown has Kuminga type hops. If it doesn’t come together he might plateau into a Kelly Oubre level player but the upside is there.

 

[Wargames]

I like his fit next to IQ as a backcourt partner long term. Some Frank “vibes” but his game is a lot more advanced than Frank’s was and currently is.

 

[ISO]

Well no, he literally was that impactful. He was the number one option on the team and they went 11-11 post-ASB. 24, 6, 3 on a .500 team without the luxury of Ja Morant and Jaren Jackson Jr or Kyle Lowry, Jimmy Butler, and Bam Adebayo to make things easier efficiency-wise. RJ didn't even get to run with a point guard.

Going .500 () over an arbitrary stretch isn’t a good point.

Nobody can state why he should definitely be top 25 under 25, or how he was snubbed, or how this is at all disrespectful to a guy that just hasn’t been that good through three seasons no matter the excuses that are made.

It’s a fact he was not better than Bane or Herro this season. It’s a fact that at this juncture Bane’s 3&D and Herro’s ability as a shooter and microwave scorer brings more value to a basketball team than Barrett’s bully ball drive and kick game.

Why should Barrett be on the list because of box score stats despite garbage analytics and inefficient shooting splits? Because he plays in New York? Because of all this supposed potential he has?

Y’all gonna get this man his $181M

 

[storyteller]

Going .500 () over an arbitrary stretch isn’t a good point.

It's over a quarter of the season, and the particular part of the year when the offense shifted to running through RJ. It's not arbitrary, it's literally the only stretch we have to go off and also the most recent.

Nobody can state why he should definitely be top 25 under 25, or how he was snubbed, or how this is at all disrespectful to a guy that just hasn’t been that good through three seasons no matter the excuses that are made.

Actually, it's been stated plainly. He was the focal point of the offense for a team that went .500 for over a quarter of a season.

It’s a fact he was not better than Bane or Herro this season. It’s a fact that at this juncture Bane’s 3&D and Herro’s ability as a shooter and microwave scorer brings more value to a basketball team than Barrett’s bully ball drive and kick game.

It's not a fact. Context matters, like what a team actually needs. Need spacing? Bane is the guy. Need scoring and absolutely nothing else? Herro. Do you need a number one option? RJ's probably the choice. Swap RJ with either of those guys and his efficiency improves while the raw stats drop some. The reverse happens if you swap them onto this roster and make them shoot as much as RJ had to.

Why should Barrett be on the list because of box score stats despite garbage analytics and inefficient shooting splits? Because he plays in New York? Because of all this supposed potential he has?

Again...he put up big box score stats while leading a team to a .500 record over the stretch where he took over the offense. His "supposed potential" comes from being 21 years old and averaging 20 ppg on the year with more 30-point games than all but 20 players in the entire league or so.

Y’all gonna get this man his $181M

They've got another season to go before they worry about his extension. I wouldn't rush to pay him, decide after we see him lead the team for a full season. The only thing they've gotta do is trade Randle, so that it's clear who the focal point is.

 

[AntoineWalkerShimmy]

What do we think about the idea of Randle + our 1st this year (assuming it falls between 8-10) for Gobert?

Not the name you'd think we'd be linked to from Utah but;

1.) he makes us better at a position of question
2.) he's not Randle
3.) Lets us keep a core/lineup of IQ-Grimes-RJ-Toppin with Cam and Sims in the mix as well.

EDIT: Probably would need to be something like Randle + Noel (cap purposes) + our 1st this year + 2023 Dallas 1st

 

[RickyGQ]

Well no, he literally was that impactful. He was the number one option on the team and they went 11-11 post-ASB. 24, 6, 3 on a .500 team without the luxury of Ja Morant and Jaren Jackson Jr or Kyle Lowry, Jimmy Butler, and Bam Adebayo to make things easier efficiency-wise. RJ didn't even get to run with a point guard.

WHAT ARE WE EVEN ARGUING!!!

 

[RickyGQ]

Sochan is Ron Artest’esque as a wing. Really good defender. I have him, Kendall Brown, and Mark Williams as guys flagged who aren’t in the lottery discussion now, but will likely be once workouts start.

Sochan is already starting to get end of lottery looks in mocks. You think he can play behind Obi if we trade Randle?

Schmitz has Mathurin falling to 12 to us in his Mock. Would you take Sochan over him?

 

[RickyGQ]

What do we think about the idea of Randle + our 1st this year (assuming it falls between 8-10) for Gobert?

Not the name you'd think we'd be linked to from Utah but;

1.) he makes us better at a position of question
2.) he's not Randle
3.) Lets us keep a core/lineup of IQ-Grimes-RJ-Toppin with Cam and Sims in the mix as well.

EDIT: Probably would need to be something like Randle + Noel (cap purposes) + our 1st this year + 2023 Dallas 1st

That’s ALOT of money to the center position for a player that can be just as toxic as Randle. Everyone seems to blame Mitchell for not getting along with him as if we haven’t seen Gobert be a fukking crybaby for years now. If he was making half that salary I’d be all over it. But Mitch at 4/65 (the highest end of what he could get most likely) while being what, 70% of the player Rudy is?, is a WAY better option than the 4/170 Rudy has left.

 

[RickyGQ]

I can’t believe people can defend Randle after the season we just saw.

 

[Wargames]

Sochan is already starting to get end of lottery looks in mocks. You think he can play behind Obi if we trade Randle?

Schmitz has Mathurin falling to 12 to us in his Mock. Would you take Sochan over him?

I don’t see Mathurin falling to 12. He is a high floor player with legit upside. I could see him developing into a Josh Hart/Aaron Afflalo type of NBA scorer, but there is some upside there for him to develop into something more.

my top 15 in no particular order (pre-workouts)

Chet
Jabari
Ivey
Paolo
Murray
Mathurin
Duren
Sharpe
Davis
M. Williams
AJ Griffin
Dyson
Sochan
Tari
Abaji

i actually think all of these guys are better than Washington. Who might be the best PG in this draft if you don’t think Dyson is a PG.

 

[Wargames]

Sochan is already starting to get end of lottery looks in mocks. You think he can play behind Obi if we trade Randle?

Schmitz has Mathurin falling to 12 to us in his Mock. Would you take Sochan over him?

I don’t think Randle is here next year. Though I also don’t like the fit behind Obi. He is talented though, at the same time I am hesitant to add a PF behind Obi who can’t play Center as well. You have to bake in flexibility like that on this roster or Thibs won’t play them.

Fit wise I like Dyson Daniels for this team the most…. if he shows he can shoot a C&S 3 reliably.

Talent wise at 12 is a whole other matter because we don’t know who falls. I do think there will be a run on Centers and PF this draft. It’s a big man draft. Mark Willians and Duren can probably start next season and teams ahead of the Knicks can use starting centers.

Then you add the FO reliance on hard data/insider information when making draft decisions and it gets even more complicated. If there was a guy this draft I could see the FO loving it’s Johnny Davis even more than Mathurin.

 

[RickyGQ]

I don’t think Randle is here next year. Though I also don’t like the fit behind Obi. He is talented though, at the same time I am hesitant to add a PF behind Obi who can’t play Center as well. You have to bake in flexibility like that on this roster or Thibs won’t play them.

Fit wise I like Dyson Daniels for this team the most…. if he shows he can shoot a C&S 3 reliably.

Talent wise at 12 is a whole other matter because we don’t know who falls. I do think there will be a run on Centers and PF this draft. It’s a big man draft. Mark Willians and Duren can probably start next season and teams ahead of the Knicks can use starting centers.

Then you add the FO reliance on hard data/insider information when making draft decisions and it gets even more complicated. If there was a guy this draft I could see the FO loving it’s Johnny Davis even more than Mathurin.

They do love an upperclassmen.

 

[Fresh]

How yall think the Knicks will do next year my fellow Coli Knick brehs ?