*Briahna Joy Gray* looking mad grifterish

[storyteller]

of course not. Thats why they're all so shocked he endorsed biden. Bernie clearly knows the bigger picture but he gassed his fans into thinking he was something he never was. They even had to dump Briahna for being so clingy when the campaign was finished.

He didn't gas his fans into anything, which is why the vast majority of his fans don't subscribe to dumb accelerationist arguments (which is why so many more of them voted for Hillary than otherwise).

As for why his campaign had to take shots on first-timers and newbies, that's because anyone who wanted to continue getting jobs with the rest of the Dems was worried that working on Bernie's campaign would torpedo their future opportunities with Democratic politicians. Add in that 2016 saw Bernie with limited resources and his options were basically progressive activists only...but without the funding returns, grifters were way less likely to try and jump into the fold than they would be in 2020...Here's a story about 2016

How Bernie Sanders Accidentally Built a Groundbreaking Organizing Movement

Activists working on Sanders’s 2016 campaign innovated an approach to organizing that was replicated in Europe and now drives his current presidential bid.

theintercept.com

His 2016 presidential campaign was no different — in part because nobody who wanted a future in Democratic Party politics thought they’d survive coming near his challenge to Hillary Clinton. Jeff Weaver, who left Sanders’s office in 2009 to run a comic book store, came out of retirement to work as campaign manager, but few others joined the official campaign.

“You have to remember in the very beginning, it was very hard for the Bernie campaign to hire pros,” said Becky Bond, an adviser to the 2016 Sanders campaign, “because it was just very clear that you’d be totally blackballed, not just from a White House or a federal agency job, but from any of the Democratic-aligned institutions. Even vendors who weren’t employed by the Clinton campaign didn’t want to work for the Bernie campaign, because they were worried about not getting business in the future.”

That meant that, by definition, the staff had to be filled out by renegades, people with activist rather than campaign backgrounds, and operatives accustomed to taking on the establishment.

The upside to having inexperienced staff was that folks like Trent were willing to try things that campaign veterans would have laughed off the whiteboard. At each event, Trent and Exley tried to figure out why the barnstorms just weren’t clicking. Toward the end of each gathering, they would ask who there was willing to host an event at their house — a phone bank, for instance — and often 10 to 20 percent of the crowd would volunteer. Despite that enthusiasm, however, almost nobody would show up to the event that had been planned.

...

By the time the campaign had finally figured things out, the end was approaching. “We didn’t even hire most of our distributed team until January 2016,” said Sandberg, “and we’d only hit a million calls, out of the 85 million that we ended up making, by Iowa.”


Sanders stunned the political world by effectively tying Clinton in Iowa on February 1 and crushing her in New Hampshire, but she had locked in nearly all the superdelegates. She eked out a win in Nevada, crushed him in South Carolina, and ground out a victory.

Then fast forward to 2020, and Sanders' campaign had way more resources, but tried to repeat this grass-roots approach. Part of that is because the people that made 2016 happen had split into different places some started organizations like Justice Democrats; others started helping progressive campaigns and lefties overseas; and others just didn't agree with where Bernie wanted to take his 2020 campaign (I think it was over digital focuses, if I'm not mistaken).

But either way, there was a lot more room for grifters by 2020. The new strategies were so accessible that everyone thought they could make a cottage industry of it...hence the Maryanne Williamsons, Andrew Yangs, etc. Meanwhile, the people who cared AND had real talent were split among a handful of progressive campaigns, which thinned out the impact.

The idea that Bernie's a secret accelerationist is nuts. He didn't blindside anybody with his Biden endorsement except for the slim margins that are represented by BJG and Jimmy Dore's weird and very online audiences. Kyle represents what the broadest take from Bernie's wing is in the clip with BJG; "I know I'm in a safe blue area, so I can afford to vote third party. But if I was in a purple state, I'd vote lesser of two evils."

 

[mastermind]

He didn't blindside anybody with his Biden endorsement except for the slim margins that are represented by BJG and Jimmy Dore's weird and very online audiences.

This is why I don't understand any of the focus on that cohort, or this thread. The AI behind Nap thinks it's important to update us on BJG happenings and then the people who enjoy dunking on leftists pile on. They are talking to a tiny audience that influences no one.

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

He didn't gas his fans into anything, which is why the vast majority of his fans don't subscribe to dumb accelerationist arguments (which is why so many more of them voted for Hillary than otherwise).

As for why his campaign had to take shots on first-timers and newbies, that's because anyone who wanted to continue getting jobs with the rest of the Dems was worried that working on Bernie's campaign would torpedo their future opportunities with Democratic politicians. Add in that 2016 saw Bernie with limited resources and his options were basically progressive activists only...but without the funding returns, grifters were way less likely to try and jump into the fold than they would be in 2020...Here's a story about 2016

How Bernie Sanders Accidentally Built a Groundbreaking Organizing Movement

Activists working on Sanders’s 2016 campaign innovated an approach to organizing that was replicated in Europe and now drives his current presidential bid.

theintercept.com

Then fast forward to 2020, and Sanders' campaign had way more resources, but tried to repeat this grass-roots approach. Part of that is because the people that made 2016 happen had split into different places some started organizations like Justice Democrats; others started helping progressive campaigns and lefties overseas; and others just didn't agree with where Bernie wanted to take his 2020 campaign (I think it was over digital focuses, if I'm not mistaken).

But either way, there was a lot more room for grifters by 2020. The new strategies were so accessible that everyone thought they could make a cottage industry of it...hence the Maryanne Williamsons, Andrew Yangs, etc. Meanwhile, the people who cared AND had real talent were split among a handful of progressive campaigns, which thinned out the impact.

The idea that Bernie's a secret accelerationist is nuts. He didn't blindside anybody with his Biden endorsement except for the slim margins that are represented by BJG and Jimmy Dore's weird and very online audiences. Kyle represents what the broadest take from Bernie's wing is in the clip with BJG; "I know I'm in a safe blue area, so I can afford to vote third party. But if I was in a purple state, I'd vote lesser of two evils."

These are political neophytes who thought the only reason democrats weren't literally unicorn socialists...were the fact bernie isn't president.

CONGRESS is a thing, FYI.

Bernie can tell people lies and sell snake oil because he doesn't have to be responsible for showing and proving anything or being held accountable for what he accomplishes or not.

 

[storyteller]

This is why I don't understand any of the focus on that cohort, or this thread. The AI behind Nap thinks it's important to update us on BJG happenings and then the people who enjoy dunking on leftists pile on. They are talking to a tiny audience that influences no one.

I think there's two-fold value in pointing out grifters like BJG and Jimmy Dore:
1. They create opportunities for liberals to paint progressives and the policies they support as harmful to democrats, which in turn gives them rationalizations for limiting progressives' access to resources and electoral success (both in primaries and generals).

2. Progressives could be better about pointing out when accelerationists or reactionaries misuse Leftist beliefs toward ends that could be harmful to people. If we want to build serious movements and momentum, we have to take strategic discussions seriously and draw distinctions. Because the Nap's of the world have zero ability to differentiate and will consistently try to convince everyone they can that BJG is indicative of the broader movement.

 

[storyteller]

These are political neophytes who thought the only reason democrats weren't literally unicorn socialists...were the fact bernie isn't president.

CONGRESS is a thing, FYI.

Bernie can tell people lies and sell snake oil because he doesn't have to be responsible for showing and proving anything or being held accountable for what he accomplishes or not.

The whole point of my post was Bernie didn't tell anyone lies, and to paint it as such is as stupid as BJG claiming Joe Biden lied about student loan forgiveness. You just struggle with reading comprehension on anything that's not a tweet size.

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

The whole point of my post was Bernie didn't tell anyone lies, and to paint it as such is as stupid as BJG claiming Joe Biden lied about student loan forgiveness. You just struggle with reading comprehension on anything that's not a tweet size.

Bernie did lie. He was talking about executive orders like he was King George to the point where he was making the entire Democratic Caucus look like they were powerless and simply didn't want to do things. Now, we see, it's not that easy and bernie bros still think the problem is the guy at the top.

The bernie bros were trained to eschew electoralism and adopted an anti-system critique. Then when they failed they didn't do anything to win elections but adopted a purely adversarial and contrarian viewpoint to the system.

 

[storyteller]

Bernie did lie. He was talking about executive orders like he was King George to the point where he was making the entire Democratic Caucus look like they were powerless and simply didn't want to do things. Now, we see, it's not that easy and bernie bros still think the problem is the guy at the top.

The bernie bros were trained to eschew electoralism and adopted an anti-system critique. Then when they failed they didn't do anything to win elections but adopted a purely adversarial and contrarian viewpoint to the system.

Biden lied too then. He made promises that he couldn't keep due to make up of Congress and the system. You're literally making BJG's arguments in the other direction . You see how it sounds goofy with BJG? It's the same when you try to apply it to promises Bernie made as if he wouldn't TRY to pass the things he promised. Biden is working toward his promises, which is why most Bernie-folk give him his due.

The "Bernie Bros" were always a tiny slither of his base that you love to focus in on. Which is weird, because Bernie Bros were the reactionary wing of his campaign and the people still using "Bernie Bro" as an insult sure seem like reactionaries for the centrist wing (and you certainly seem to lean that way with your obsession with tweets and headline but inability to contend with actual context).

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

Biden lied too then. He made promises that he couldn't keep due to make up of Congress and the system. You're literally making BJG's arguments in the other direction . You see how it sounds goofy with BJG? It's the same when you try to apply it to promises Bernie made as if he wouldn't TRY to pass the things he promised. Biden is working toward his promises, which is why most Bernie-folk give him his due.

The "Bernie Bros" were always a tiny slither of his base that you love to focus in on. Which is weird, because Bernie Bros were the reactionary wing of his campaign and the people still using "Bernie Bro" as an insult sure seem like reactionaries for the centrist wing (and you certainly seem to lean that way with your obsession with tweets and headline but inability to contend with actual context).

So?

Thats the point. Biden can lie knowing that we dont expect him to do all that. BJG thinks Biden could be literally god but chooses not to and that Bernie would do every single thing he claimed.

Elizabeth Warren ran the math on his Medicare for All program and the Bernie bros got mad and called her unrealistic and against the cause

 

[storyteller]

So?

Thats the point. Biden can lie knowing that we dont expect him to do all that. BJG thinks Biden could be literally god but chooses not to and that Bernie would do every single thing he claimed.

Elizabeth Warren ran the math on his Medicare for All program and the Bernie bros got mad and called her unrealistic and against the cause

So, BJG isn't indicative of the typical Bernie supporter. "Biden knows we don't expect him to do all that," ditto for the vast majority of Bernie supporters including people you typically paint as extreme like Krystal and Kyle.

People didn't get mad at Warren for running the math; you must have just been reading tweets again. The problem with Warren's plan was that she promised M4A on a scale that required two terms minimum and likely a third for implementation. Her plan was unrealistic because it assumed the makeup of Congress would keep a Dem majority empowered to push M4A for a minimum of 8 years and probably 12 if we were really being real about it.

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

So, BJG isn't indicative of the typical Bernie supporter. "Biden knows we don't expect him to do all that," ditto for the vast majority of Bernie supporters including people you typically paint as extreme like Krystal and Kyle.

Fair point. Except...they certainly are the most vocal bernie supporters and are actively undermining any political progress

People didn't get mad at Warren for running the math; you must have just been reading tweets again. The problem with Warren's plan was that she promised M4A on a scale that required two terms minimum and likely a third for implementation. Her plan was unrealistic because it assumed the makeup of Congress would keep a Dem majority empowered to push M4A for a minimum of 8 years and probably 12 if we were really being real about it.

This. Is. my. point.

You all want everything 1 year terms. This is American healthcare. It's going to take some fukking time.

 

[storyteller]

Fair point. Except...they certainly are the most vocal bernie supporters and are actively undermining any political progress



This. Is. my. point.

You all want everything 1 year terms. This is American healthcare. It's going to take some fukking time.

The most vocal Bernie supporters should include Krystal, Kyle, Sam Seder, David Pakman, Thom Hartmann and a gang of other people who have been completely reasonable about lesser of two evils voting and it's necessity in electoral politics, while also pushing to try and pull the Democrats left on issues.

No one said it needed to be a one-year term. However she proposed a path that required passing multiple pieces of legislation across multiple Congressional iterations. That's not a likely path to success, given how election cycles have historically gone. Biden passing prescription drug negotiations that will take 10 years to take full effect is damn-near universally praised despite the timeline. But that one has been set into motion and won't be so easy to reverse.

 

[mastermind]

I think there's two-fold value in pointing out grifters like BJG and Jimmy Dore:
1. They create opportunities for liberals to paint progressives and the policies they support as harmful to democrats, which in turn gives them rationalizations for limiting progressives' access to resources and electoral success (both in primaries and generals).

2. Progressives could be better about pointing out when accelerationists or reactionaries misuse Leftist beliefs toward ends that could be harmful to people. If we want to build serious movements and momentum, we have to take strategic discussions seriously and draw distinctions. Because the Nap's of the world have zero ability to differentiate and will consistently try to convince everyone they can that BJG is indicative of the broader movement.

I genuinely don't think BJG is a grifter. There isn't much money in the online leftist space and she not that influential or have a major following. I think she is an annoying idiot.

Dore, I don't know much about him, tbh. I don't think he is that good of a person from what I've read, tbf.

I don't think the idea is to create dissent on the left by disavowing those types. Just go on those shows and debate them/have convos, like what Krystal Ball and Kyle Kulinski did here. Actually go out there and let the ideas win instead of doing the mainstream dem thing and saying, "you aren't serious people," which also the right does with any Democrat.

 

[nyknick]

I love the fact that anyone that ever worked for Bernie was officially knighted by him as a soldier of the revolution.

Was Symone Sanders joining Joe Biden's campaign in 2020 after working for Bernie in 2016 treason and a stab in the back to socialist everywhere? Or just a DC professional trying to move up in politics, at best get a job in the White House and at worst work as an MSNBC contributor?

@storyteller while I agree that it's important to call out grifters, Briahna Joy Gray is largely irrelevant. She's not even close to Jimmy Dore's reach but yet she still has a 520 post thread here, which is a testament that liberals will invent and prop up people like BJG in order to slander progressives no matter what you do.

Maybe I'm missing something but just scrolling through her channel shows that her most viewed video is only 152k views from 2 years ago. Even with The Hill push she is not gaining any traction, she never had a single viral clip from The Hill and it doesn't look like being there propped up her individual podcast.

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

The most vocal Bernie supporters should include Krystal, Kyle, Sam Seder, David Pakman, Thom Hartmann and a gang of other people who have been completely reasonable about lesser of two evils voting and it's necessity in electoral politics, while also pushing to try and pull the Democrats left on issues.

No one said it needed to be a one-year term. However she proposed a path that required passing multiple pieces of legislation across multiple Congressional iterations. That's not a likely path to success, given how election cycles have historically gone. Biden passing prescription drug negotiations that will take 10 years to take full effect is damn-near universally praised despite the timeline. But that one has been set into motion and won't be so easy to reverse.

YOU JUST SAID WARRENS PLAN WAS TOO LONG

Fam Obamacare took YEARS just to expand medical coverage. Biden's drug payment scheme is going to take another 3-4 years just to implement! What are you talking about?

 

[storyteller]

YOU JUST SAID WARRENS PLAN WAS TOO LONG

Fam Obamacare took YEARS just to expand medical coverage. Biden's drug payment scheme is going to take another 3-4 years just to implement! What are you talking about?

This is what I mean by, you can't read beyond a tweet length before your brain malfunctions. You latched onto years when I was talking about getting multiple iterations of Congress to pass multiple pieces of legislation to pass...

The most vocal Bernie supporters should include Krystal, Kyle, Sam Seder, David Pakman, Thom Hartmann and a gang of other people who have been completely reasonable about lesser of two evils voting and it's necessity in electoral politics, while also pushing to try and pull the Democrats left on issues.

No one said it needed to be a one-year term. However she proposed a path that required passing multiple pieces of legislation across multiple Congressional iterations. That's not a likely path to success, given how election cycles have historically gone. Biden passing prescription drug negotiations that will take 10 years to take full effect is damn-near universally praised despite the timeline. But that one has been set into motion and won't be so easy to reverse.

Obamacare and Biden's Drug Payment taking years to implement is my point. I literally pointed out that it will take around 10 years to fully implement Biden's plan, but everyone praises it. It keeps expanding the list of negotiable until 2030 if I'm not mistaken. But we PRAISE that plan, just like we give credit where it's due on Obamacare. Those plans were put in place in a manner that makes them difficult to reverse. Warren was counting on passing multiple pieces of legislation across terms. The years isn't the issue, it's assuming that multiple Congressional bodies will all just pass what she wanted rather than blocking it or pushing to reverse it. There's a serious reading comprehension problem here if you got that confused.