BREAKING:US forces shoot down Syrian jet for the first time in move described as 'self defence'

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

The force (of idiocy) is very strong with that one, he's too far gone to the darkside. All we can do is poke fun at him at this point.

Nothing you've said challenges Russia.

Because I guess thats where your interests are?

This is how the world works.

You eat, or be eaten. Nations don't just sit aside.

 

[Loose]

America did not start the Syrian civil war. Assad did that by cracking down on protests.

ISIS exploited a vacuum from real reformers in syria

Go chew on Putin's dikk with all this slobbering you're doing

lol at you believing this bs; the us backed failed arab spring is the reason why we are in the situation we are in now. the us tried to install several figure head allies by supporting "rebel terrorist" around the middle east as usual. as always it didn't work and we have cake filled blowback in our faces.

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

lol at you believing this bs; the us backed failed arab spring is the reason why we are in the situation we are in now. the us tried to install several figure head allies by supporting "rebel terrorist" around the middle east as usual. as always it didn't work and we have cake filled blowback in our faces.

of course we backed it.

we didn't start it.

Syria is Assad's fault.

 

[ZoeGod]

Regime change has been an epic fail. Look at Libya and Iraq. Libya is in the middle of a 3 way civil war. Iraq is in a mess and even when ISIS is defeated there is still major issues. In Syria the rebels had and still have unlimited support but they fight each other more than they fight Assad. Thing I find funny is how the US government complains about Iranian influence in Iraq but forget that they overthrew Saddam and put a Shia majority government in Iraq. Iran is Shia and so is 60-65% of Iraq. Of course they would have influence! Are they that stupid! Now there is talk of trying to stop this influence but it's too little too late. If anything ISIS rampaging Iraq was a boon for Iran and their proxies.

America really as no idea what they are doing in the region. It's easy to overthrow a government but it is hard to govern. America foreign policy should just give on regime change because there has been no successful case of regime change in the mideast.

 

[thekingsmen]

of course we backed it.

we didn't start it.

Syria is Assad's fault.

... Bs again.

 

[ZoeGod]

ISIS exploited a vacuum from real reformers in syria

Ehhh it's more complicated than that. ISIS grew out of Sunni resentment in Syria and Iraq. In Iraq we back Malaki who was the prime minister and member of the powerful Shia Dawa party which is backed by Iran. He oppressed Sunnis and we did nothing. Also if we didn't invade Iraq there wouldn't be AQI (predecessor of ISIS) and ISIS.

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

Regime change has been an epic fail. Look at Libya and Iraq. Libya is in the middle of a 3 way civil war. Iraq is in a mess and even when ISIS is defeated there is still major issues. In Syria the rebels had and still have unlimited support but they fight each other more than they fight Assad. Thing I find funny is how the US government complains about Iranian influence in Iraq but forget that they overthrew Saddam and put a Shia majority government in Iraq. Iran is Shia and so is 60-65% of Iraq. Of course they would have influence! Are they that stupid! Now there is talk of trying to stop this influence but it's too little too late. If anything ISIS rampaging Iraq was a boon for Iran and their proxies.

America really as no idea what they are doing in the region. It's easy to overthrow a government but it is hard to govern. America foreign policy should just give on regime change because there has been no successful case of regime change in the mideast.

What are you bytching about? (despite your post on the first page that I actually liked?)

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

Ehhh it's more complicated than that. ISIS grew out of Sunni resentment in Syria and Iraq. In Iraq we back Malaki who was the prime minister and member of the powerful Shia Dawa party which is backed by Iran. He oppressed Sunnis and we did nothing. Also if we didn't invade Iraq there wouldn't be AQI (predecessor of ISIS) and ISIS.

I'm not disagreeing with you.

But so what?

I want America to have a say in the affairs over there.

 

[ZoeGod]

What are you bytching about? (despite your post on the first page that I actually liked?)

What I am saying regime change as a policy in the mideast has backfired dummy. All the mess we see in the mideast all goes back to the failed project of regime change. We tried intervention with nation building and ground troops in Iraq=fail. We tried regime change with limited intervention in Libya=fail. We tried regime change in Syria with no intervention=fail. Plus instead of mediating the sunni/Shia mess we have chosen to stock with the sunni faction of the mideast increasing sectarianism in the mideast.
You say you want the US have a say in the affairs in the mideast but with who? The Kurds? Which Kurds? Kurds in Iraq and Syria can't stand each other. The sunnis? Which sunni groups? The sunni force in Iraq has been broken and destroyed. In Syria they are divded and fragmented. All the major sunni cities (Homs,Tikrit,Ramadi,Mosul) are destroyed. The shiites? Iran got them on lock. The mideast is very complex. It isn't just as simple saying we should have a say over there. To have a say you must have influence. To have influence you need partners on the ground. We have no partners on the ground we can trust or trust us. Once the war with ISIS Baghdad is gonna tell us . We won't back the Syrian Kurds cuz of their "ties" with the PKK which is at war with NATO ally Turkey. The Kurds in Iraq want to secede from Iraq which means conflict with Baghdad and Iran. Plus both Iran and the US want a united Iraq ironically. In Syria we have no influence or partners. The rebels have been influenced by jihadist and Islamist who are against democracy. We can't be seen backing Assad. In the end regime change and attempted regime change lead to this and now we have little to no influence on the ground. You will see once ISIS is defeated.

I'm not disagreeing with you.

But so what?

I want America to have a say in the affairs over there.

What I saying is America had a hand in the rise of ISIS as well.

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

What I am saying regime change as a policy in the mideast has backfired dummy.

And?

All the mess we see in the mideast all goes back to the failed project of regime change. We tried intervention with nation building and ground troops in Iraq=fail. We tried regime change with limited intervention in Libya=fail. We tried regime change in Syria with no intervention=fail. Plus instead of mediating the sunni/Shia mess we have chosen to stock with the sunni faction of the mideast increasing sectarianism in the mideast.

And? Whats your policy suggestion? You're just repackaging history and passing it off as nutrition.

You say you want the US have a say in the affairs in the mideast but with who? The Kurds? Which Kurds? Kurds in Iraq and Syria can't stand each other. The sunnis? Which sunni groups? The sunni force in Iraq has been broken and destroyed. In Syria they are divded and fragmented. All the major sunni cities (Homs,Tikrit,Ramadi,Mosul) are destroyed. The shiites? Iran got them on lock. The mideast is very complex. It isn't just as simple saying we should have a say over there. To have a say you must have influence. To have influence you need partners on the ground.

again. No shyt.

I'd like to see the Kurds get some serious spoils of war though. They've earned it.

We have no partners on the ground

we can trust or trust us. Once the war with ISIS Baghdad is gonna tell us . We won't back the Syrian Kurds cuz of their "ties" with the PKK which is at war with NATO ally Turkey. The Kurds in Iraq want to secede from Iraq which means conflict with Baghdad and Iran. Plus both Iran and the US want a united Iraq ironically. In Syria we have no influence or partners. The rebels have been influenced by jihadist and Islamist who are against democracy. We can't be seen backing Assad. In the end regime change and attempted regime change lead to this and now we have little to no influence on the ground. You will see once ISIS is defeated.

Yes. its difficult. Whats your point?

You're just ranting.

What outcomes do YOU want?

You keep just explaining the situation.

What I saying is America had a hand in the rise of ISIS as well.

Again. More useless talking points.

Whats your goal in mind.

Y'all spend 90% of the commentary on here talking about HISTORY AND CAUSES. You all DO NOT ever focus on solutions or goals. Thats why when I talk my shyt on here, y'all get #triggered and start ranting all this anti-USA shyt. Fact is, the reality is dirty and the solutions make you cringe. All you can do is re-explain things we already know and describe the situation.

@FAH1223 masquerades as some expert here too when he does that shyt. He NEVER introduces any novel thoughts. All he can do is express what things are, not what he wants them to be. He has no interests or goals.

 

[ZoeGod]

And?

And? Whats your policy suggestion? You're just repackaging history and passing it off as nutrition.

again. No shyt.

I'd like to see the Kurds get some serious spoils of war though. They've earned it.


Yes. its difficult. Whats your point?

You're just ranting.

What outcomes do YOU want?

You keep just explaining the situation.


Again. More useless talking points.

Whats your goal in mind.

Y'all spend 90% of the commentary on here talking about HISTORY AND CAUSES. You all DO NOT ever focus on solutions or goals. Thats why when I talk my shyt on here, y'all get #triggered and start ranting all this anti-USA shyt. Fact is, the reality is dirty and the solutions make you cringe. All you can do is re-explain things we already know and describe the situation.

@FAH1223 masquerades as some expert here too when he does that shyt. He NEVER introduces any novel thoughts. All he can do is express what things are, not what he wants them to be. He has no interests or goals.

You want my solution? Simple we accept that Iran will have influence in Iraq. Iran isn't going anywhere. Matter fact we work with them in Iraq. We should also accept that Iraq will breakup. If the Saudis want the sunni parts to break away let them deal with a resource poor rump jihadist sunnistan. We have to let the Gulf nations know that Iran is here to stay and have a detene with Iran that Obama was about to do. That means lifting sanctions and bring Iran back to fold. Pressure the Gulf States to better treat their Shia minorities and if they do not tell them that we will not help you if they rise up in rebellion. In Syria my solution would be to let Bashar Assad stay in power. Allow Turkey to have limited control of North Syria. Tell the Kurds that they will have to work with Assad. Have what is left of the sunni moderate rebels, the Kurds, what is left of the SAA to create a new Syrian military to fight the jihadist and Islamist elements. In the long run we should abandon the Saudis as its an artifical state and will one day collapse. We should slowly but surely work with Iran. Work with moderates like Rhouhani. Sooner than later they could be an ally and out the Russian and Chinese axis. Iran like Turkey is a stable nation that we could benefit to have in our side. Younger Iranians are more pro western and could care less about Israel and such. What Trump is doing is putting us in a bad spot historically. We are putting our Stock behind weak sunni artifical states with vulnerable economies. Iran plays the long game and are smart strategists they are better as allies and dangerous as foes.

Again which Kurds are you gonna support? The YPG in Syria or the Iraqi KRG? If you back the Syrian Kurds what will you do if Turkey starts a conflict against them? Which side will you back? A NATO ally or the Kurds. If you back the Kurds you risk Turkey getting more closer with Russia. Or do you back the Iraqi Kurds? They want independence and are more closer to Turkey. Thing is the govt in Baghdad with Iran are dead set against it again meaning more war. And what if the PKK start a civil war with help from the battle hardened YPG? Me personally I would back the Iraqi amd Syrian Kurds at the same time. To hell with Turkey. And Iraq as a nation-state doesn't exist. Kurdistan is meant to happen. Convince the YPG to disavow and distance themselves from the PKK. If they refuse tell them we won't support them if the Turks go on a rampage against them. And in Iraq let Iran rule the rump Iraq.

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

You want my solution? Simple we accept that Iran will have influence in Iraq. Iran isn't going anywhere. Matter fact we work with them in Iraq. We should also accept that Iraq will breakup. If the Saudis want the sunni parts to break away let them deal with a resource poor rump jihadist sunnistan. We have to let the Gulf nations know that Iran is here to stay and have a detene with Iran that Obama was about to do. That means lifting sanctions and bring Iran back to fold. Pressure the Gulf States to better treat their Shia minorities and if they do not tell them that we will not help you if they rise up in rebellion. In Syria my solution would be to let Bashar Assad stay in power. Allow Turkey to have limited control of North Syria. Tell the Kurds that they will have to work with Assad. Have what is left of the sunni moderate rebels, the Kurds, what is left of the SAA to create a new Syrian military to fight the jihadist and Islamist elements. In the long run we should abandon the Saudis as its an artifical state and will one day collapse. We should slowly but surely work with Iran. Work with moderates like Rhouhani. Sooner than later they could be an ally and out the Russian and Chinese axis. Iran like Turkey is a stable nation that we could benefit to have in our side. Younger Iranians are more pro western and could care less about Israel and such. What Trump is doing is putting us in a bad spot historically. We are putting our Stock behind weak sunni artifical states with vulnerable economies. Iran plays the long game and are smart strategists they are better as allies and dangerous as foes.

So...the Biden plan?

Was Biden right?

Again which Kurds are you gonna support? The YPG in Syria or the Iraqi KRG? If you back the Syrian Kurds what will you do if Turkey starts a conflict against them? Which side will you back? A NATO ally or the Kurds. If you back the Kurds you risk Turkey getting more closer with Russia. Or do you back the Iraqi Kurds? They want independence and are more closer to Turkey. Thing is the govt in Baghdad with Iran are dead set against it again meaning more war. And what if the PKK start a civil war with help from the battle hardened YPG? Me personally I would back the Iraqi amd Syrian Kurds at the same time. To hell with Turkey. And Iraq as a nation-state doesn't exist. Kurdistan is meant to happen. Convince the YPG to disavow and distance themselves from the PKK. If they refuse tell them we won't support them if the Turks go on a rampage against them. And in Iraq let Iran rule the rump Iraq.

Give the Kurds their own country.

The world is in need of a few border changes.

And the PKK is an extreme example of a stateless people. They're relatively secular and progressive individuals. Could be a blessing. Who knows.

and THANK YOU for taking this seriously and not just doing what everyone else does by ranting about obvious shyt. We need more of THIS and less of that.

 

[FAH1223]

Kurdish source says the pilot is fine. Looks like they are pissed that this incident happened.

 

[88m3]

@ZoeGod as a casual observer it seems like you're happy as long as Sunni Arabs are being oppressed

 

[Colilluminati]

America did not start the Syrian civil war. Assad did that by cracking down on protests.

The protests America started ?