Afghanistan Thread | Taliban Rule

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Utah's Spencer Cox and 10 other US governors want to open their states to resettle Afghan refugees

Here are the US governors who have publicly spoken on accepting refugees:
  • Gov. Spencer Cox (R-Utah).
  • Gov. Charlie Baker (R-Massachusetts), criticized "mismanagement" of the Afghanistan withdrawal and said that "Massachusetts is ready to assist Afghan refugees seeking safety and peace in America" in a pair of Tuesday tweets.
  • Gov. Larry Hogan (R-Maryland), said in a Monday video statement that Maryland is on track to welcome 180 Afghan visa holders and "stand ready and willing to do even more," adding, "it's the least we can do."
  • Gov. Brian Kemp (R-Georgia), said that "it is vitally important to keep those who partnered with American armed forces over the last 20 years safe from harm," the Atlanta Journal-Constitution reported.
  • Gov. Henry McMaster (R-SC), told reporters that those fleeing and "now it is our duty to help them. We need to help them," The State reported.
  • Gov. Kim Reynolds (R-Iowa)'s spokesperson told Axios that Reynolds wants to assist efforts to resettle Afghan refugees.
  • Gov. Gavin Newsom (D-California), said Monday that he's "proud" California is already home to a sizeable community of Afghan refugees and immigrants and is "working in terms of a lot of those refugees coming in and working with CBOs and non-profit organizations" to resettle more.
  • Gov. Ralph Northam (D-Virginia), tweeted Monday that he's "coordinating with DC and have made it clear: we're ready and willing to take thousands more. Virginia will continue to serve as safe harbor."
  • Gov. Tony Evers (D-Wisconsin), tweeted that the state "is ready to assist" efforts to resttle refugees in Wisconsin and "help these individuals who served our country and are now seeking refuge."
  • Gov. Laura Kelly (D-Kansas) said that "Shall we be asked, the State of Kansas would welcome refugees and families who supported American troops, our operations, and our cause during our time in Afghanistan."
  • Gov. Jared Polis (D-Colorado) sent a letter to Biden "letting him know that our state is willing and able to do whatever we need to do to help Afghans who played a vital role in assisting the U.S. military overseas."





Not being received well by some folk.

Georgia governor's proposal to take in Afghans leaves conservatives outraged





 

mastermind

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It didn't fall faster because a lot of narratives are exaggerated bullshyt.

The #1 reason Afghanistan went down so fast is because too many people knew that resistance was a lost cause. What's the point of going out and shooting someone when literally nothing can be gained? All you gonna do it get yourself shot, make your wife a widow and your children orphans to be preyed upon by the Taliban as they step over your bled-out corpse. Best case scenario was perpetual war until....what exactly? And who is going to put their neck out there and start trying to achieve this perpectual, unwinnable war once it became clear that no one else was on board? What did ANYONE have to gain by resisting once it became clear that they weren't going to be able to hold off the Taliban via military means?

Afghans will continue to resist. In some regions warlords hold enough power and have strong enough defensible space that they technically could continue fighting if they desire. More importantly, in certain regions an effort will be made to resist by means outside of force - refusal to cooperate with Taliban demands or potentially being able to negotiate a middle ground.
This cowardly Afghani shyt is MIC propaganda that Biden endorsed, while ignoring our failures.
 

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How Russia-China are stage-managing the Taliban
By Pepe Escobar


The first Taliban press conference after this weekend’s Saigon moment geopolitical earthquake, conducted by spokesman Zabihullah Mujahid, was in itself a game-changer.

The contrast could not be starker with those rambling pressers at the Taliban embassy in Islamabad after 9/11 and before the start of the American bombing – proving this is an entirely new political animal.

Yet some things never change. English translations remain atrocious.

Here is a good summary of the key Taliban statements, and

Here (in Russian) is a very detailed roundup.

These are the key takeaways.

– No problem for women to get education all the way to college, and to continue to work. They just need to wear the hijab (like in Qatar or Iran). No need to wear a burqa. The Taliban insists, “all women’s rights will be guaranteed within the limits of Islamic law.”

– The Islamic Emirate “does not threaten anyone” and will not treat anyone as enemies. Crucially, revenge – an essential plank of the Pashtunwali code – will be abandoned, and that’s unprecedented. There will be a general amnesty – including people who worked for the former NATO-aligned system. Translators, for instance, won’t be harassed, and don’t need to leave the country.

– Security of foreign embassies and international organizations “is a priority.” Taliban special security forces will protect both those leaving Afghanistan and those who remain.

– A strong inclusive Islamic government will be formed. “Inclusive” is code for the participation of women and Shi’ites.

– Foreign media will continue to work undisturbed. The Taliban government will allow public criticism and debate. But “freedom of speech in Afghanistan must be in line with Islamic values.”

– The Islamic Emirate of Taliban wants recognition from the “international community” – code for NATO. The overwhelming majority of Eurasia and the Global South will recognize it anyway. It’s essential to note, for example, the closer integration of the expanding SCO – Iran is about to become a full member, Afghanistan is an observer – with ASEAN: the absolute majority of Asia will not shun the Taliban.

For the record, they also stated that the Taliban took all of Afghanistan in only 11 days: that’s pretty accurate. They stressed “very good relations with Pakistan, Russia and China.” Yet the Taliban don’t have formal allies and are not part of any military-political bloc. They definitely “won’t allow Afghanistan to become a safe haven for international terrorists”. That’s code for ISIS/Daesh.

On the key issue of opium/heroin: the Taliban will ban their production. So, for all practical purposes, the CIA heroin rat line is dead.

As eyebrow raising as these statements may be, the Taliban did not even get into detail on economic/infrastructure development deals – as they will need a lot of new industries, new jobs and improved Eurasian-wide trade relations. That will be announced later.

The go-to Russian guy

Sharp US observers are remarking, half in jest, that the Taliban in only one sitting answered more real questions from US media than POTUS since January.

What this first press conference reveals is how the Taliban are fast absorbing essential P.R. and media lessons from Moscow and Beijing, emphasizing ethnic harmony, the role of women, the role of diplomacy, and deftly defusing in a single move all the hysteria raging across NATOstan.

The next bombshell step in the P.R. wars will be to cut off the lethal, evidence-free Taliban-9/11 connection; afterwards the “terrorist organization” label will disappear, and the Taliban as a political movement will be fully legitimized.

Moscow and Beijing are meticulously stage-managing the Taliban reinsertion in regional and global geopolitics. This means that ultimately the SCO is stage-managing the whole process, applying a consensus reached after a series of ministerial and leaders meetings, leading to a very important summit next month in Dushanbe.

The key player the Taliban are talking to is Zamir Kabulov, Russia’s special presidential envoy for Afghanistan. In yet another debunking of NATOstan narrative, Kabulov confirmed, for instance, “we see no direct threat to our allies in Central Asia. There are no facts proving otherwise.”

The Beltway will be stunned to learn that Zabulov has also revealed, “we have long been in talks with the Taliban on the prospects for development after their capture of power and they have repeatedly confirmed that they have no extraterritorial ambition, they learned the lessons of 2000.” These contacts were established “over the past 7 years.”

Zabulov reveals plenty of nuggets when it comes to Taliban diplomacy: “If we compare the negotiability of colleagues and partners, the Taliban have long seemed to me much more negotiable than the puppet Kabul government. We proceed from the premise that the agreements must be implemented. So far, with regard to the security of the embassy and the security of our allies in Central Asia, the Taliban have respected the agreements.”

Faithful to its adherence to international law, and not the “rules-based international order”, Moscow is always keen to emphasize the responsibility of the UN Security Council: “We must make sure that the new government is ready to behave conditionally, as we say, in a civilized manner. That’s when this point of view becomes common to all, then the procedure [of removing the qualification of the Taliban as a terrorist organization] will begin.”

So while the US/EU/NATO flee Kabul in spasms of self-inflicted panic, Moscow practices – what else – diplomacy. Zabulov: “That we have prepared the ground for a conversation with the new government in Afghanistan in advance is an asset of Russian foreign policy.”

Dmitry Zhirnov, Russia’s ambassador to Afghanistan, is working overtime with the Taliban. He met a senior Taliban security official yesterday. The meeting was “positive, constructive…The Taliban movement has the most friendly; the best policy towards Russia… He arrived alone in one vehicle, with no guards.”

Both Moscow and Beijing have no illusions that the West is already deploying Hybrid War tactics to discredit and destabilize a government that isn’t even formed and hasn’t even started working. No wonder Chinese media is describing Washington as a “strategic rogue.”

What matters is that Russia-China are way ahead of the curve, cultivating parallel inside tracks of diplomatic dialogue with the Taliban. It’s always crucial to remember that Russia harbors 20 million Muslims, and China at least 35 million. These will be called to support the immense project of Afghan reconstruction – and full Eurasia reintegration.

The Chinese saw it coming

Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi saw it coming weeks ago. And that explains the meeting in Tianjin in late July, when he hosted a high-level Taliban delegation, led by Mullah Baradar, de facto conferring them total political legitimacy. Beijing already knew the Saigon moment was inevitable. Thus the statement stressing China expected to “play an important role in the process of peaceful reconciliation and reconstruction in Afghanistan”.

What this means in practice is China will be a partner of Afghanistan on infrastructure investment, via Pakistan, incorporating it into an expanded China-Pakistan Economic Corridor (CPEC) bound to diversify connectivity channels with Central Asia. The New Silk Road corridor from Xinjiang to the port of Gwadar in the Arabian Sea will branch out: the first graphic illustration is Chinese construction of the ultra-strategic Peshawar-Kabul highway.

The Chinese are also building a major road across the geologically spectacular, deserted Wakhan corridor from western Xinjiang all the way to Badakhshan province, which incidentally, is now under total Taliban control.

The trade off is quite straightforward: the Taliban should allow no safe haven for the East Turkestan Islamic Movement (ETIM), and no interference in Xinjiang.

The overall trade/security combo looks like a certified win-win. And we’re not even talking about future deals allowing China to exploit Afghanistan’s immense mineral wealth.

Once again, the Big Picture reads like the Russia-China double helix, connected to all the “stans” as well as Pakistan, drawing a comprehensive game plan/road map for Afghanistan. In their multiple contacts with both Russians and Chinese, the Taliban seem to have totally understood how to profit from their role in the New Great Game.

The extended New Axis of Evil

Imperial Hybrid War tactics to counteract the scenario are inevitable. Take the first proclamation of a Northern Alliance “resistance”, in theory led by Ahmad Masoud, the son of the legendary Lion of the Panjshir killed by al-Qaeda two days before 9/11.

I met Masoud's father – an icon. Afghan insider info on Masoud's son is not exactly flattering. Yet he’s already a darling of woke Europeans, complete with a glamour pose for AFP, an impromptu visit in the Panjshir by professional philosopher swindler Bernard-Henri Levy, and the release of a manifesto of sorts published in several European newspapers, exhibiting all the catchphrases: “tyranny”, “slavery”, “vendetta”, “martyred nation”, “Kabul screams”, “nation in chains”, etc.

The whole set up smells like a “son of Shah” [of Iran] gambit. Masoud's son and his mini-militia are completely surrounded in the Panjshir mountains and can’t be de facto effective even when it comes to regimenting the under 25s, two-thirds of the Afghan population, whose main worry is to find real jobs in a nascent real economy.

Woke NATOstan “analyses” of Taliban Afghanistan don’t even qualify as irrelevant, insisting that Afghanistan is not strategic and even lost its tactical importance for NATO. It’s a sorry spectacle illustrating how Europe is hopelessly behind the curve, drenched in trademark neo-colonialism of the White Man’s Burden variety as it dismisses a land dominated by clans and tribes.

Expect China to be one of the first powers to formally recognize the Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan, alongside Turkey and, later on, Russia. I have already alluded to the coming of a New Axis of Evil: Pakistan-Taliban-China. The axis will inevitably be extended to Russia-Iran. So what? Ask Mullah Baradar: he couldn’t care less.
 

thatrapsfan

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It didn't fall faster because a lot of narratives are exaggerated bullshyt.

The #1 reason Afghanistan went down so fast is because too many people knew that resistance was a lost cause. What's the point of going out and shooting someone when literally nothing can be gained? All you gonna do it get yourself shot, make your wife a widow and your children orphans to be preyed upon by the Taliban as they step over your bled-out corpse. Best case scenario was perpetual war until....what exactly? And who is going to put their neck out there and start trying to achieve this perpectual, unwinnable war once it became clear that no one else was on board? What did ANYONE have to gain by resisting once it became clear that they weren't going to be able to hold off the Taliban via military means?

Afghans will continue to resist. In some regions warlords hold enough power and have strong enough defensible space that they technically could continue fighting if they desire. More importantly, in certain regions an effort will be made to resist by means outside of force - refusal to cooperate with Taliban demands or potentially being able to negotiate a middle ground.

Which regions, there’s only a single holdout region now (Panjshir) aside from that every other main actor surrendered. Unless West or other actors provide logistical support for them it’s unlikely there will be sustained armed resistance, at least in short term.

More likely the economic pressure from cut off to Afghan states reserves, and international foreign aid will hurt Taliban. That and political pressure of having to try to administer, rather than fight.
 

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Which regions, there’s only a single holdout region now (Panjshir) aside from that every other main actor surrendered. Unless West or other actors provide logistical support for them it’s unlikely there will be sustained armed resistance, at least in short term.

More likely the economic pressure from cut off to Afghan states reserves, and international foreign aid will hurt Taliban. That and political pressure of having to try to administer, rather than fight.

Yes, that appears to be where they'll center it.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2021/08/18/mujahideen-resistance-taliban-ahmad-massoud/

Afghan envoy says hold-out Panjshir province can resist Taliban rule
 

Json

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How Russia-China are stage-managing the Taliban
By Pepe Escobar


The first Taliban press conference after this weekend’s Saigon moment geopolitical earthquake, conducted by spokesman Zabihullah Mujahid, was in itself a game-changer.

The contrast could not be starker with those rambling pressers at the Taliban embassy in Islamabad after 9/11 and before the start of the American bombing – proving this is an entirely new political animal.

Yet some things never change. English translations remain atrocious.

Here is a good summary of the key Taliban statements, and

Here (in Russian) is a very detailed roundup.

These are the key takeaways.

– No problem for women to get education all the way to college, and to continue to work. They just need to wear the hijab (like in Qatar or Iran). No need to wear a burqa. The Taliban insists, “all women’s rights will be guaranteed within the limits of Islamic law.”

– The Islamic Emirate “does not threaten anyone” and will not treat anyone as enemies. Crucially, revenge – an essential plank of the Pashtunwali code – will be abandoned, and that’s unprecedented. There will be a general amnesty – including people who worked for the former NATO-aligned system. Translators, for instance, won’t be harassed, and don’t need to leave the country.

– Security of foreign embassies and international organizations “is a priority.” Taliban special security forces will protect both those leaving Afghanistan and those who remain.

– A strong inclusive Islamic government will be formed. “Inclusive” is code for the participation of women and Shi’ites.

– Foreign media will continue to work undisturbed. The Taliban government will allow public criticism and debate. But “freedom of speech in Afghanistan must be in line with Islamic values.”

– The Islamic Emirate of Taliban wants recognition from the “international community” – code for NATO. The overwhelming majority of Eurasia and the Global South will recognize it anyway. It’s essential to note, for example, the closer integration of the expanding SCO – Iran is about to become a full member, Afghanistan is an observer – with ASEAN: the absolute majority of Asia will not shun the Taliban.

For the record, they also stated that the Taliban took all of Afghanistan in only 11 days: that’s pretty accurate. They stressed “very good relations with Pakistan, Russia and China.” Yet the Taliban don’t have formal allies and are not part of any military-political bloc. They definitely “won’t allow Afghanistan to become a safe haven for international terrorists”. That’s code for ISIS/Daesh.

On the key issue of opium/heroin: the Taliban will ban their production. So, for all practical purposes, the CIA heroin rat line is dead.

As eyebrow raising as these statements may be, the Taliban did not even get into detail on economic/infrastructure development deals – as they will need a lot of new industries, new jobs and improved Eurasian-wide trade relations. That will be announced later.

The go-to Russian guy

Sharp US observers are remarking, half in jest, that the Taliban in only one sitting answered more real questions from US media than POTUS since January.

What this first press conference reveals is how the Taliban are fast absorbing essential P.R. and media lessons from Moscow and Beijing, emphasizing ethnic harmony, the role of women, the role of diplomacy, and deftly defusing in a single move all the hysteria raging across NATOstan.

The next bombshell step in the P.R. wars will be to cut off the lethal, evidence-free Taliban-9/11 connection; afterwards the “terrorist organization” label will disappear, and the Taliban as a political movement will be fully legitimized.

Moscow and Beijing are meticulously stage-managing the Taliban reinsertion in regional and global geopolitics. This means that ultimately the SCO is stage-managing the whole process, applying a consensus reached after a series of ministerial and leaders meetings, leading to a very important summit next month in Dushanbe.

The key player the Taliban are talking to is Zamir Kabulov, Russia’s special presidential envoy for Afghanistan. In yet another debunking of NATOstan narrative, Kabulov confirmed, for instance, “we see no direct threat to our allies in Central Asia. There are no facts proving otherwise.”

The Beltway will be stunned to learn that Zabulov has also revealed, “we have long been in talks with the Taliban on the prospects for development after their capture of power and they have repeatedly confirmed that they have no extraterritorial ambition, they learned the lessons of 2000.” These contacts were established “over the past 7 years.”

Zabulov reveals plenty of nuggets when it comes to Taliban diplomacy: “If we compare the negotiability of colleagues and partners, the Taliban have long seemed to me much more negotiable than the puppet Kabul government. We proceed from the premise that the agreements must be implemented. So far, with regard to the security of the embassy and the security of our allies in Central Asia, the Taliban have respected the agreements.”

Faithful to its adherence to international law, and not the “rules-based international order”, Moscow is always keen to emphasize the responsibility of the UN Security Council: “We must make sure that the new government is ready to behave conditionally, as we say, in a civilized manner. That’s when this point of view becomes common to all, then the procedure [of removing the qualification of the Taliban as a terrorist organization] will begin.”

So while the US/EU/NATO flee Kabul in spasms of self-inflicted panic, Moscow practices – what else – diplomacy. Zabulov: “That we have prepared the ground for a conversation with the new government in Afghanistan in advance is an asset of Russian foreign policy.”

Dmitry Zhirnov, Russia’s ambassador to Afghanistan, is working overtime with the Taliban. He met a senior Taliban security official yesterday. The meeting was “positive, constructive…The Taliban movement has the most friendly; the best policy towards Russia… He arrived alone in one vehicle, with no guards.”

Both Moscow and Beijing have no illusions that the West is already deploying Hybrid War tactics to discredit and destabilize a government that isn’t even formed and hasn’t even started working. No wonder Chinese media is describing Washington as a “strategic rogue.”

What matters is that Russia-China are way ahead of the curve, cultivating parallel inside tracks of diplomatic dialogue with the Taliban. It’s always crucial to remember that Russia harbors 20 million Muslims, and China at least 35 million. These will be called to support the immense project of Afghan reconstruction – and full Eurasia reintegration.

The Chinese saw it coming

Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi saw it coming weeks ago. And that explains the meeting in Tianjin in late July, when he hosted a high-level Taliban delegation, led by Mullah Baradar, de facto conferring them total political legitimacy. Beijing already knew the Saigon moment was inevitable. Thus the statement stressing China expected to “play an important role in the process of peaceful reconciliation and reconstruction in Afghanistan”.

What this means in practice is China will be a partner of Afghanistan on infrastructure investment, via Pakistan, incorporating it into an expanded China-Pakistan Economic Corridor (CPEC) bound to diversify connectivity channels with Central Asia. The New Silk Road corridor from Xinjiang to the port of Gwadar in the Arabian Sea will branch out: the first graphic illustration is Chinese construction of the ultra-strategic Peshawar-Kabul highway.

The Chinese are also building a major road across the geologically spectacular, deserted Wakhan corridor from western Xinjiang all the way to Badakhshan province, which incidentally, is now under total Taliban control.

The trade off is quite straightforward: the Taliban should allow no safe haven for the East Turkestan Islamic Movement (ETIM), and no interference in Xinjiang.

The overall trade/security combo looks like a certified win-win. And we’re not even talking about future deals allowing China to exploit Afghanistan’s immense mineral wealth.

Once again, the Big Picture reads like the Russia-China double helix, connected to all the “stans” as well as Pakistan, drawing a comprehensive game plan/road map for Afghanistan. In their multiple contacts with both Russians and Chinese, the Taliban seem to have totally understood how to profit from their role in the New Great Game.

The extended New Axis of Evil

Imperial Hybrid War tactics to counteract the scenario are inevitable. Take the first proclamation of a Northern Alliance “resistance”, in theory led by Ahmad Masoud, the son of the legendary Lion of the Panjshir killed by al-Qaeda two days before 9/11.

I met Masoud's father – an icon. Afghan insider info on Masoud's son is not exactly flattering. Yet he’s already a darling of woke Europeans, complete with a glamour pose for AFP, an impromptu visit in the Panjshir by professional philosopher swindler Bernard-Henri Levy, and the release of a manifesto of sorts published in several European newspapers, exhibiting all the catchphrases: “tyranny”, “slavery”, “vendetta”, “martyred nation”, “Kabul screams”, “nation in chains”, etc.

The whole set up smells like a “son of Shah” [of Iran] gambit. Masoud's son and his mini-militia are completely surrounded in the Panjshir mountains and can’t be de facto effective even when it comes to regimenting the under 25s, two-thirds of the Afghan population, whose main worry is to find real jobs in a nascent real economy.

Woke NATOstan “analyses” of Taliban Afghanistan don’t even qualify as irrelevant, insisting that Afghanistan is not strategic and even lost its tactical importance for NATO. It’s a sorry spectacle illustrating how Europe is hopelessly behind the curve, drenched in trademark neo-colonialism of the White Man’s Burden variety as it dismisses a land dominated by clans and tribes.

Expect China to be one of the first powers to formally recognize the Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan, alongside Turkey and, later on, Russia. I have already alluded to the coming of a New Axis of Evil: Pakistan-Taliban-China. The axis will inevitably be extended to Russia-Iran. So what? Ask Mullah Baradar: he couldn’t care less.
China is in for a rude awakening messing with these gulf states without stable governments.

Pakistan is corrupt beyond belief and Iran’s government is too enthralled with out smarting the West to create a stable economy.
 
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smh. Jokers still trying to minimize a blatant L for their fav administration
:camby:

Reality now is that both Trump, Biden and the "leave Afghan" supporters, including myself, was wrong
The symbolic political boasting gained from leaving is minuscule to the lost of intel/influence/strategy/advantage

Also it should be more clear than ever that moving forward, permanent US military presence in any country after mandatory military action is a must and no-brainer to uphold American interest/safety

We are now more vulnerable because woke culture has seeped into military/national security policies

bubu American "imperialism/bullying" wasn't worth it to minimize Russia/China influence in the region OR deter the creation of a terrorist resort:rudy:
 

Shogun

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Regarding all the military equipment the Taliban captured from America....

There's about zero chance that they have the ability to operate and maintain that equipment over time. It's not like you just hop into a Blackhawk and go for a spin....and that shyt takes constant, meticulous maintenance, very specific parts and consumables, and highly trained pilots.

The humvee hasn't even been authorized for use in Afghanistan by traditional US forces since 2009, I believe.

And the weapons require similar attention, maintenance, and pretty unique ammunition for that part of the world. One of the reasons the AK series are so popular is their durability. They dont require the maintenance that US weapons do.


The ANA would have had us, and our "advisors" keeping them running. The Taliban....eh....
Its looks bad, yeah, but I'm thinking the majority of that stuff falls into disrepair within the year.
 
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Ducktales

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Regarding all the military equipment the Taliban captured from America....

There's about zero chance that they have the ability to operate and maintain that equipment over time. It's not like you just hop into a Blackhawk and go for a spin....and that shyt takes constant, meticulous maintenance, very specific parts and consumables, and highly trained pilots.

The humvee hasn't even been authorized for use in Afghanistan by traditional US forces since 2009, I believe.

And the weapons require similar attention, maintenance, and pretty unique ammunition for that part of the world. One of the reasons the AK series are so popular is their durability. They dont require the maintenance that US weapons do.


The ANA would have had us, and our "advisors" keeping them running. The Taliban....eh....
Its looks bad, yeah, but I'm thinking the majority of that stuff falls into disrepair within the year.
I feel you bro. But I think you are kind of underestimating their intelligence and the resources they have at their disposal. A lot of countries are repairing their relationship with Afghanistan and making relationships with the Taliban in general. They do have highly trained pilots. Some that were trained on US soil. They have individuals with plenty of experience using US equipment that has been captured over time and while they have mostly AK-47s, they have had American weapons for a long time. American soldiers have died at the hands of M-16s as well. I used to think otherwise until I went over there and saw for myself they have more than just foot soldiers in they ranks. They simply were outgunned at one point. But they have always had ability to operate American technology. Many of them have been on US soil. Not just people who grew up there and joined the Taliban.

Side note: I had to train a lot of the Afghan military how to shoot and I swear out of let’s say 500 people, only maybe 50 became expert shooters. Guys didn’t even know how to reload weapons properly after being told a million times. These guys were merchants and shot like that. They didn’t have a fighting spirit in any way. Knew they wouldn’t stick it out
 

King Kreole

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smh. Jokers still trying to minimize a blatant L for their fav administration
:camby:

Reality now is that both Trump, Biden and the "leave Afghan" supporters, including myself, was wrong
The symbolic political boasting gained from leaving is minuscule to the lost of intel/influence/strategy/advantage

Also it should be more clear than ever that moving forward, permanent US military presence in any country after mandatory military action is a must and no-brainer to uphold American interest/safety

We are now more vulnerable because woke culture has seeped into military/national security policies

bubu American "imperialism/bullying" wasn't worth it to minimize Russia/China influence in the region OR deter the creation of a terrorist resort:rudy:
FLLuL.gif
 

King Kreole

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Regarding all the military equipment the Taliban captured from America....

There's about zero chance that they have the ability to operate and maintain that equipment over time. It's not like you just hop into a Blackhawk and go for a spin....and that shyt takes constant, meticulous maintenance, very specific parts and consumables, and highly trained pilots.

The humvee hasn't even been authorized for use in Afghanistan by traditional US forces since 2009, I believe.

And the weapons require similar attention, maintenance, and pretty unique ammunition for that part of the world. One of the reasons the AK series are so popular is their durability. They dont require the maintenance that US weapons do.


The ANA would have had us, and our "advisors" keeping them running. The Taliban....eh....
Its looks bad, yeah, but I'm thinking the majority of that stuff falls into disrepair within the year.
Yep. I think the actual idea is that they'll sell them, but :yeshrug: to the victor go the spoils.
 

Shogun

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I feel you bro. But I think you are kind of underestimating their intelligence and the resources they have at their disposal. A lot of countries are repairing their relationship with Afghanistan and making relationships with the Taliban in general. They do have highly trained pilots. Some that were trained on US soil. They have individuals with plenty of experience using US equipment that has been captured over time and while they have mostly AK-47s, they have had American weapons for a long time. American soldiers have died at the hands of M-16s as well. I used to think otherwise until I went over there and saw for myself they have more than just foot soldiers in they ranks. They simply were outgunned at one point. But they have always had ability to operate American technology. Many of them have been on US soil. Not just people who grew up there and joined the Taliban.

Side note: I had to train a lot of the Afghan military how to shoot and I swear out of let’s say 500 people, only maybe 50 became expert shooters. Guys didn’t even know how to reload weapons properly after being told a million times. These guys were merchants and shot like that. They didn’t have a fighting spirit in any way. Knew they wouldn’t stick it out
Good points.
I guess I’m unsure of how willing they are to embrace and work with the modern world. From what I understand, that goes directly against their ideology. Now, if they are willing to embrace modernity then I guess that might be a good sign - that they’re willing to compromise their beliefs and operate within the modern international community. I hope that’s true, but I don’t know that we have enough evidence to be certain about that.
 

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Good points.
I guess I’m unsure of how willing they are to embrace and work with the modern world. From what I understand, that goes directly against their ideology. Now, if they are willing to embrace modernity then I guess that might be a good sign - that they’re willing to compromise their beliefs and operate within the modern international community. I hope that’s true, but I don’t know that we have enough evidence to be certain about that.
O I def agree. I don’t know if they will actually change. But it seems China and Russia are very serious about establishing a good relationship with the new regime. China already met with them and they made promises to eachother to refrain from conflict and establish mew partnerships. The region still has a lot of resources that everybody needs. China and Russia definitely are viewing this as a legitimate takeover that has permanence. They might not change in how they treat they people, but I think they have realized they need to be more diplomatic for the sake of catching up to the rest of the world in regards to developing the land and technology. They don’t want to deal with our military anymore, regardless of the success they have recently experienced. Otherwise this evacuation situation would be drastically worse than some think it already is. They still have been cooperating to a degree. But yea I am very skeptical about how they will treat they people, but it seems it is already established that China and Russia in particular will turn a blind eye towards it. They didn’t give a fukk about how the world viewed them before. Now that the power is legitimate where they have control of the entire country, I see them trying to seriously build relationships with other countries.

Taliban celebrate their new US arsenal: Rifles, Humvees, ammo - CNNPolitics
 
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