A Song of Ice & Fire by George R.R. Martin: Book Discussion Thread

Black Magisterialness

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Ilyrio has orchestrated a fair share of things in the his part of the world

yeah but we pretty much KNOW what Ilyrio wants....what makes Littlefinger so dangerous is NO ONE knows what he wants...its not just money...he hast that now, not just prestige or titles he has that now. Its not a holding and a his own great house...he has that now. Its not even bytches cuz i mean....he is a pimp in a literal sense....

WHAT THE fukk COULD HE EVEN WANT....
 

Bud Bundy

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:whoo:

Maybe Bronn. While he's nowhere near as much of a schemer as Littlefinger, Bronn has pretty much gain status in each books conclusion so far. He's a rags to riches type just like Petyr and gets a mean ass come up but I think most of it is luck on his part lol while Littlefinger has done everything like he's playing chess :leon:


while reading a AFFC dude now has a castle. making cersi all mad. Good read. And Cersi is paranoid like a motherfukker and not in a good way like tryrion. Like i got to kill everyone like joffery.
 

Piff Perkins

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Finished A Feast For Crows. I got a bit confused in Jaime's latest chapter though. Catelyn Stark said Jeyne Westerling had wide hips, hips she thought were great for childbearing but when Jaime sees her for the first time he sees that she has narrow hips.

:wtf:

Might be far fetched but I'm thinking the one Jaime saw was a fake, like how a fake Arya was sent to the Boltons...

Funny both their names Jeyne.

Lots of people believe a theory that the Jeyne presented to Jaime is actually her sister, and that a (possibly pregnant) Jeyne escaped.
Queen Jeyne Westerling/Theories - The Winds of Winter - A Forum of Ice and Fire

I don't believe it though. It's possible Jeyne simply lost some weight due to grief, plus Jaime was looking at her purely in sexual tones whereas Catelyn was looking from a mother perspective. And of course, wouldn't Jeyne's mom recognize her own daughter? I doubt she'd try to double cross the Lannisters

Also the girl rips her own dress in grief. She seemed quite believable as being the real Jeyne
 

NaiSim

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It seems to me like the North is the most 'conservative' region while Dorne is the most 'progressive' region(being a b*stard or a homosexual is not a big deal, equal primogeniture etc.) due to the Rhoynish (eastern) influence...

Nah I think the South and Iron Islands are both more conservative when it comes to women's rights.

Iron Islanders will not accept a female heir as ruler , Northerners will.

Also Southern ladies are very restricted in the roles they play, which is one of the reasons Brienne is such an outcast. In the North female warriors are more easily accepted.
 

Bud Bundy

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Finished AFFC and damn i can cant wait to read DWD. House Stark is gone but could make a come back once sweetrobin is gone. And Sam got some ass. I cant believe that. And why is Jaquan Hagar hanging out in Hightower?
 

NUPE 1911

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Klarifeye The Great said:
Name ANYONE not named Tyrion that has done half as much and hasn't been killed, maimed or imprisoned in anyway....

I am pretty sure Tyron has been maimed and imprisoned (more than once).....
 

MidniteJay

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How great of a warrior/fighter would Robert have been if he never became King?

He was good enough to crush swordsmen Rhaegar who was lauded by Arthur Dayne for being one of the finest knights he's ever known. I'd put him in OG Kingsguard status in fighting.

But it's hard to gauge these nikkas when you have anomalies like Gregor Clegane.
 

Mr. Pink

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Hard to say... The problem in gauging Robert's ability is his unusual choice of weapon. The warhammer is slow, clumsy and hard to defend with. It's also incredibly effective against plate armor, even more so because of Robert's awesome physical strength. That being said Robert had the advantage at the Trident against Rhaegar because they were fighting on horse, and in a river. Mounted combat is fought in passes. They don't just park their horse next to each other and hack away. The run torwards each other, exchange a blow or two, spin around and do it again. The warhammer is perfect for that because it doesn't need precision, and even glancing blows can do damage. On the other hand the sword is robbed of its advantages. It's speed and precision don't mean much because you're not long enough in contact with the enemy to work the vulnerable parts of plate armor, and glancing blows are useless. That's why knights use lances instead of swords when mounted. I believe that fight would have gone differently on foot...

I'd say Robert was a very competent warrior, way above average, but not quite top tier. Rhaegar was also a very acomplished tourney knight(jouster), and while I'm sure he was a very capable swordsman, he wasn't top tier either. We don't really hear of any of his exploits or prowess with a sword, just his jousting ability. Also the Trident was his first taste of battle, unlike Robert who had been fighting the whole war. All of these factors created a perfect storm scenario for Robert that I don't think can be replicated against top tier warriors.

So I reiterate, Robert was very good, but not quite among the best. Give everyone their choice weapons and he can be defeated both on foot(by Jaime, Barristan, Sandor, Bronn, Oberyn etc.) and on horse(by people who are good with a lance like Loras Tyrell, the Clegane brothers, Jaime, Barristan etc.).
 

MidniteJay

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Hard to say... The problem in gauging Robert's ability is his unusual choice of weapon. The warhammer is slow, clumsy and hard to defend with. It's also incredibly effective against plate armor, even more so because of Robert's awesome physical strength. That being said Robert had the advantage at the Trident against Rhaegar because they were fighting on horse, and in a river. Mounted combat is fought in passes. They don't just park their horse next to each other and hack away. The run torwards each other, exchange a blow or two, spin around and do it again. The warhammer is perfect for that because it doesn't need precision, and even glancing blows can do damage. On the other hand the sword is robbed of its advantages. It's speed and precision don't mean much because you're not long enough in contact with the enemy to work the vulnerable parts of plate armor, and glancing blows are useless. That's why knights use lances instead of swords when mounted. I believe that fight would have gone differently on foot...

I'd say Robert was a very competent warrior, way above average, but not quite top tier. Rhaegar was also a very acomplished tourney knight(jouster), and while I'm sure he was a very capable swordsman, he wasn't top tier either. We don't really hear of any of his exploits or prowess with a sword, just his jousting ability. Also the Trident was his first taste of battle, unlike Robert who had been fighting the whole war. All of these factors created a perfect storm scenario for Robert that I don't think can be replicated against top tier warriors.

So I reiterate, Robert was very good, but not quite among the best. Give everyone their choice weapons and he can be defeated both on foot(by Jaime, Barristan, Sandor, Bronn, Oberyn etc.) and on horse(by people who are good with a lance like Loras Tyrell, the Clegane brothers, Jaime, Barristan etc.).

I thought Robert was really good at melees? I'm not sure which book I read it in but it mentioned Robert being good at melees (on foot) and not so good with whole lance jousting stuff.

Another thing that bothers me is that Rhaegar was supposed to be smart as fukk so I find it odd he decides to get the drop on Robert with a sword on horseback assuming Robert had more reach with his hammer...

:laff: @ Robert running over his dead body to get to his objective though.
 

Black Magisterialness

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I am pretty sure Tyron has been maimed and imprisoned (more than once).....

that was my point....Littlefinger has had absolutely NO repercussions for his actions. You can't even say he's on the Lannister's side he does so much to work on his own terms....the marriage to the Tyrells was his idea...and it was only to get a major holding, marry Lysa, kill her and gain control of the Eyrie and place Sansa back in Winterfell...


:mindblown:
 

MidniteJay

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that was my point....Littlefinger has had absolutely NO repercussions for his actions. You can't even say he's on the Lannister's side he does so much to work on his own terms....the marriage to the Tyrells was his idea...and it was only to get a major holding, marry Lysa, kill her and gain control of the Eyrie and place Sansa back in Winterfell...


:mindblown:

Yeah I don't get that nikka at all. He started the whole mess and now he's looking like he's fixing it?
 

MidniteJay

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How did Littlefinger start the whole mess?

He was responsible for the assassination of the King's Hand, Jon Arryn. He easily duped Eddard Stark into believing he was an ally and was ultimately responsible for his execution. He murdered the only woman who seems to have loved him, Lysa Arryn, after we learn the entire civil war was set in motion at Littlefinger's behest.
 
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