☑︎#VoteDemocrat

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For me, the problem isn't supporting Sanders. He's a fantastic candidate with a lot of strong points that I wish his supporters would spend more time highlighting instead of calling Warren a compromised stooge. No one is pushing back on Sanders supporters for supporting Sanders, it's the ridiculous and disingenuous shytting on Liz that people are pushing back on. It's pretty obvious what's happening. Liz is picking up steam and on the march to nomination, and some Bernie supporters are cracking under the pressure.
Well, they're right to some extent.

But with Sanders you don't know WHAT you're getting except he's an antagonist of everything...and I understand that sentiment.

And I think people are tired of just being bullshytted. And Bernie is prone to that as a function of his lack of attention to details.

Like the Majority Report clip from today with the guest: Bernie sees revolution from 30,000 feet...Warren is a footsoldier liberating towns :wow:
 

StatUS

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So are Bernie and Liz also lying? If a public option is impossible to conceive of because the GOP and center-right Dems won't support it, how in the hell is M4A even an option? What's Bernie's gameplan for getting M4A passed? "taking down the current system from the bottom up" is an unacceptably vague answer on such a serious issue.


Yes, this is why it's important that the Democratic candidate support M4A. Not because they will make it magically materialize by their sheer will, but because it establishes the terms of the debate.
I'm trying to figure out how else you think a sweeping change like single payer is gonna happen without large citizen involvement and demand? There's gotta be protest, down ballot voting of more progressive candidates, and sheer force of the people that demand their politicians step up or step out. Warren is not gonna pass anything because she has a plan and Bernie's not gonna do shyt because it's his main focus. M4A is the rallying point of a country saying they no longer will accept this current system. The public option is something Biden will throw up to get shot down and say that he did his best.

The issue with our political system is that we accept compromise from the jump and let the media tell us that it's the only way. Also we're lazy and just want to vote and let paid shills make laws for us. I mean imagine if people just sat on their hands during the civil rights or union movements? The reason I say what I say is because you can't change the status quo without getting off your ass. Even Bernie himself said shyt is only gonna get done with a movement. And Warren needs to put that on her supporters also, because just putting her in office and laying back is gonna lead us to nothing on that front.
 

afterlife2009

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M4A will be one of the hardest struggles in legislative history. It's not a thing that can be passed by getting everybody at the table and finding the quickest most efficient plan. This is why someone like Biden or Mayor Pete is so dangerous cause they'll bring out the public option then when it gets shot down they'll just say, "We tried our hardest but it's simply not feasible at the moment."

You're going to have to rally massive amounts of people, defend it and carry water for it in public speeches in office

At least the leading candidate and Democrat think tanks are working extra hard this time around to smear one of the most popular policy proposals. Love living in hell!
 

Th3G3ntleman

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I'm trying to figure out how else you think a sweeping change like single payer is gonna happen without large citizen involvement and demand? There's gotta be protest, down ballot voting of more progressive candidates, and sheer force of the people that demand their politicians step up or step out. Warren is not gonna pass anything because she has a plan and Bernie's not gonna do shyt because it's his main focus. M4A is the rallying point of a country saying they no longer will accept this current system. The public option is something Biden will throw up to get shot down and say that he did his best.

The issue with our political system is that we accept compromise from the jump and let the media tell us that it's the only way. Also we're lazy and just want to vote and let paid shills make laws for us. I mean imagine if people just sat on their hands during the civil rights or union movements? The reason I say what I say is because you can't change the status quo without getting off your ass. Even Bernie himself said shyt is only gonna get done with a movement. And Warren needs to put that on her supporters also, because just putting her in office and laying back is gonna lead us to nothing on that front.

How exactly is all that shyt suppose to get done in a 4 year timeframe without control of the senate? :mjtf:

This it's going to require a movement shyt is some make a wish upon a star level of bullshyt.:unimpressed:


If you start being pragmatic you can see ain't no way in hell that shyt gonna pass.:unimpressed:

Nothing is passing after 2020 unless its an EO. :unimpressed:


I fukk with the idea of single payer and the elimination of private insurance but it's a fukking ideal man. It's a killer but one that I respect these folks for running on unlike that whole immigration shyt. That shyt is a killer that these folks need to drop asap.
 

StatUS

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How exactly is all that shyt suppose to get done in a 4 year timeframe without control of the senate? :mjtf:

This it's going to require a movement shyt is some make a wish upon a star level of bullshyt.:unimpressed:


If you start being pragmatic you can see ain't no way in hell that shyt gonna pass.:unimpressed:

Nothing is passing after 2020 unless its an EO. :unimpressed:


I fukk with the idea of single payer and the elimination of private insurance but it's a fukking ideal man. It's a killer but one that I respect these folks for running on unlike that whole immigration shyt. That shyt is a killer that these folks need to drop asap.
Then vote for Biden if you just don't see a path forward, nothing against that. The Senate gets voted on every two years. If people are more engaged in the process (voting Warren or Bernie assumes this) then it can affect down ballot races for these proposals to move forward in an easier fashion. Plus having the leader of the country support something like M4A from the pulpit without being bought out to be against it is a huge advantage. Look at what Trump can do even though he's an idiot by just speaking on things? At the end of the day though it does require a large uprising of the population to demand that health care changes. But it's not pie in the sky we just let the narrative be put out there like that.
 

the next guy

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I love all these Warren is going to get slaughtered in the midwest and the south comments. Do you all realize that Warren is from OKC? She is not a "coastal elite" - she isn't getting slaughtered anywhere nomination or not.
Bruh, she is a professor from Masssachusetts. That will matter to Joe and Jane Iowa City.


WARREN IS UP IN CALIFORNIA!!!




So when is Kamala dropping out?
 
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Bruh, she is a professor from Masssachusetts. That will matter to Joe and Jane Iowa City.



So when is Kamala dropping out?
I live in a MAGAt county in the south and I canvassed so what I'm about to say isn't an off the top of my head opinion. Simple people do not give a fukk about that, they care about what you're going to do for them. I had a Trump voter tell me "Trump can grab whoever he wants by the p*ssy if the economy is fine." Another said that they're willing to pay more in taxes if it means actually getting their roads fixed. Multiple voters said they voted Gillum/Scott (like idiots). Its easy to see conservatives as mouthbreathing morons, but its not quite that simple. Their loyalty is to their own self interest as opposed to liberals who focus more on "moral justice."

There's a lot of talk in this thread about who will get washed in the midwest and the south, but unless yall are out in these areas talking to people or have solid data to support your points, its conjecture. All a candidate like Warren has to do is explain her plans in the simplest of terms and tell how it'll benefit the average person. The south and midwest are not a monolith
 
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