2020 Democratic Primary Thread: Focus on House & Senate races

[AnonymityX1000]

Bernie bros would save themselves a lot of key strokes by just saying yet again just like 2016 if the candidate is not their lord and savior the infallible mr sanders, the candidate is a threat to democracy, a fraud and a neoliberal shill.

No one is saying that tho. I still like Elizabeth Warren but I can also acknowledge when she is messing up in her campaign. How about you?

 

[King Kreole]

Or she could have endorsed Bernie instead of Hillary in 2016. lol That was actually completely in her control. Now after that you act like Progressives have no reason to not trust her? That disingenuous, sorry.
Now Elizabeth wants to be on the Progressive team in 2020 and act like you and Bernie are on the same page? We need proof since you betrayed Bernie in 2016. And backing off M4A and acting like your Amy Klobuchar now isn't it Elizabeth.

1) She didn't endorse Hillary over Bernie in 2016. She withheld her endorsement until a winner was clear. Very different things.

2) This gets to the point of what I'm saying. Elizabeth Warren's entire history of jumping into the trenches and doggedly fighting the progressive fight against both Republicans and her own incredibly popular President and party is ignored, and her progressive bonafides are wiped away because she refused to nuke her political capital/career by endorsing what was admittedly a protest candidacy by a relatively obscure Senator from Vermont. Setting up the CFPB and single-handedly stopping Summers and Geithner from consolidating more political power amongst the financial elite apparently pale in comparison to a single ungiven primary endorsement. This is how mass movements become cults of personality. The progressive movement is larger than Bernie. It doesn't live and die by his dictates and whims. Centering him to this degree is unhealthy.

 

[storyteller]

Maybe I'm having a brain fart but where does he say Jacobin left?

But yes, the American left is simply the mainstream, MSNBC, New York Times, Democratic voter. It's not based on any level of class, gender, race, international solidarity. It's not a theory of politics. It's just a party identifier.

This is the Rising interview I was referencing. Right about Five minutes in Krystal says that the Jacobin Left is pretty critical of Obama and Stoller says "no they're not" then flips it to not taking responsibility for voting in Obama.


Here's a 2011 piece where they literally point out that Progressives projected on Obama but were wrong.
Dancing on Liberalism’s Grave

Then Stoller moves on to asking when Bernie has ever criticized Obama. Ball says "this past weekend" and provides an example. At which point Stoller wants Bernie to flat out say "Obama was a bad president" which is a pretty blatant goal post move. He gets caught out AGAIN trying to say you "just don't listen to centrists, they're saying the same thing (I'm paraphrasing)" and then Ball mentions that they've interviewed No Labels and Third Way Reps with nothing close to the same critiques. Stoller whiffed there.

 

[Warren Moon]

Biden has some real fukking stinkers on his record (crime bill, protecting corporations over voters re: bankruptcy, oh uhh the fukkING WAR IN IRAQ, etc). His batting average is way worse than hers.

you love to post his losses but not his wins? Which are 3-4x more than his bad votes?

besides the Iraq war, which no one cares about now bush is gone.

he and Bernie have the best ideas to fix the crime bills wrongs. Why is warren avoiding the crack/coke discrepancy while being a progressive?

 

[Warren Moon]

Bernie bros would save themselves a lot of key strokes by just saying yet again just like 2016 if the candidate is not their lord and savior the infallible mr sanders, the candidate is a threat to democracy, a fraud and a neoliberal shill.

that’s bc the first supporters and leaders of the movement hated the dnc to begin with. They want it all to burn. They’ll never commit to an institution they hate.

the rest of the Bernie bro’s just follow em

 

[King Kreole]

besides the Iraq war, which no one cares about now bush is gone.

 

[Warren Moon]

when’s the last time you heard anybody talk about the Iraq war?

why won’t liz scrap the coke/crack discrepancy?

 

[AnonymityX1000]

1) She didn't endorse Hillary over Bernie in 2016. She withheld her endorsement until a winner was clear. Very different things.

2) This gets to the point of what I'm saying. Elizabeth Warren's entire history of jumping into the trenches and doggedly fighting the progressive fight against both Republicans and her own incredibly popular President and party is ignored, and her progressive bonafides are wiped away because she refused to nuke her political capital/career by endorsing what was admittedly a protest candidacy by a relatively obscure Senator from Vermont. Setting up the CFPB and single-handedly stopping Summers and Geithner from consolidating more political power amongst the financial elite apparently pale in comparison to a single ungiven primary endorsement. This is how mass movements become cults of personality. The progressive movement is larger than Bernie. It doesn't live and die by his dictates and whims. Centering him to this degree is unhealthy.

Uh, did you see my post after the one you quoted? I said I still liked her, I'm just saying she is making mistakes on this M4A issue while running for president.

 

[King Kreole]

Uh, did you see my post after the one you quoted? I said I still liked her, I'm just saying she is making mistakes on this M4A issue while running for president.

The "mistake" she made was daring to stand in the way of Bernie. That was the real unforgivable act. But because people want to commit to the veneer of impartiality and hold on to the idea that they're not caught up in a cult of personality (much like how Obama's defenders are) they have to constantly shift the goalposts about how whatever new thing Warren does is disastrous.

 

[AnonymityX1000]

The "mistake" she made was daring to stand in the way of Bernie. That was the real unforgivable act.

No it was being wishy washy on M4A. But believe what you want.

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

Or she could have endorsed Bernie instead of Hillary in 2016. lol That was actually completely in her control. Now after that you act like Progressives have no reason to not trust her? That disingenuous, sorry.
Now Elizabeth wants to be on the Progressive team in 2020 and act like you and Bernie are on the same page? We need proof since you betrayed Bernie in 2016. And backing off M4A and acting like your Amy Klobuchar now isn't it Elizabeth.

Warren endorsed Clinton after sanders was mathematically eliminated. MONTHS before the DNC convention why would she waste her endorsement?

 

[storyteller]

No it was being wishy washy on M4A. But believe what you want.

And the goal post moving has been to fold in the Warren red flags as perfectly fine and completely above any critique rather than either debating them or just agreeing to disagree on what the best strategy is.

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

i just saw Biden's full comments on marijuana...they weren't THAT bad.

 

[King Kreole]

No it was being wishy washy on M4A. But believe what you want.

She was getting heaps of shyt when her position was literally just "I'm with Bernie", so I'm not sure how that tracks. Back then the goalposts were that she refused to say she would raise taxes and was somehow sabotaging the movement by doing so. Then she doubles down on full M4A, and does it without raising taxes on the working class, and the goalposts shifted to a head tax being disastrous and she's sabotaging the movement. Now she releases a transition plan that gets to M4A in 3 years and the goalposts shifted to a 2-step transition is disastrous because it's inevitable that Republicans will win the 2022 midterms and full M4A can somehow be passed in the current political climate within 2 years.

 

[AnonymityX1000]

Warren endorsed Clinton after sanders was mathematically eliminated. MONTHS before the DNC convention why would she waste her endorsement?

To show some conviction. People like that, not hedging and then endorsing the obvious winner.