2/22 FOX/ESPN PPV | Wilder vs Fury II

Who Loses The 0?


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reservoirdogs

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Humilated them...you think these duckers are Fury and you claiming someone needs to wake up..comical.
No they are not Fury but Joshua would stop Wilder, Wilder can't do shyt about being pressured and Joshua would give him no ground, wouldn't fight him like he did Ruiz on the rematch, he was saying this too. Joshua is the more versatile fighter with the better punch repertoire and better skills, unlike against Ruiz he'd have his way against Wilder on the inside, pocket. It wouldn't last longer than the Fury fight imo.
Idk about Whyte, probably I'd still pick Wilder there providing he hasn't damaged goods especially if Whyte turns up like last time. But if it's the best version of Wilder vs the best version of Whyte it's an exciting fight where both can knock each other out cold, Whyte with his left hook and Wilder with his straight right. I'd lean toward Wilder right now but wouldn't be shocked at all had he lost, it's easily in the conversation.
 

FreedMind

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No they are not Fury but Joshua would stop Wilder, Wilder can't do shyt about being pressured and Joshua would give him no ground, wouldn't fight him like he did Ruiz on the rematch, he was saying this too. Joshua is the more versatile fighter with the better punch repertoire and better skills, unlike against Ruiz he'd have his way against Wilder on the inside, pocket. It wouldn't last longer than the Fury fight imo.
Idk about Whyte, probably I'd still pick Wilder there providing he hasn't damaged goods especially if Whyte turns up like last time. But if it's the best version of Wilder vs the best version of Whyte it's an exciting fight where both can knock each other out cold, Whyte with his left hook and Wilder with his straight right. I'd lean toward Wilder right now but wouldn't be shocked at all had he lost, it's easily in the conversation.

I think this is a lil lazy. Joshua doesn't have the height, reach or weight of Fury; I really don't think you can plug Joshua in and think he'd be able to do what Fury did successfully.

I always thought Joshua had a shot to beat Wilder cause, like you said, he's versatile and has a sneaky inside game, but I don't see him roughing Wilder up as easy.
 
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Black Miller

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i need to rewatch the fight but congrats to fury. i thought the initial punch knockdown was behind the head. but the main thing was from round 3 on forward, wilder just had no answers or adjustments for fury coming at him. wilder's always been a range fighter so when fury actually closed the distance that didn't allow wilder to be able to get his work off like he wants. wilder really underestimated fury in that regard, fury said what he was gonna do. it looked like wilder had not prepared for that at all.

i been noticed wilder is not really good inside fighting and can't fight on the backfoot. needs space and range to deliver his shots. also he can be too patient waiting for that punch giving up too many rounds early. he gave up a lot of rounds vs ortiz in fight 2. only thing i do think wilder was doing good was jabbing to the body some earlier in the fight. but he needs throw more punches in bunches. fury is a good defensive boxer to avoid a single punch but combos might leave something open to land.

i'm looking forward to the 3rd fight- i think wilder still has a shot in the 3rd fight, but he looked sluggish and unprepared. i think an offensive trainer like abel sanchez or freddie roach would kinda maximize wilder's offense. openings were there but wilder fell in love with his power. getting humbled might make him make adjustments. also think he was too heavy for his standards he probably needs to be lighter to help with his movement and speed to add on his punches.

fury is an excellent boxer and credit goes to him for not being comfortable with the first fight and seeking changes to help him improve. thats a great move
 

reservoirdogs

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I think this is a lil lazy. Joshua doesn't have the height, reach or weight of Fury; I really don't think you can plug Joshua in and think he'd be able to do what Fury did successfully.

I always thought Joshua had a shot to beat Wilder cause, like you said, he's versatile and has a sneaky inside game, but I don't see him roughing Wilder up as easy.


AJ is a big guy himself with his around 250 weight and he is dryer 250 than Fury a 270. Physically Joshua could be the strongest HW for all we know.

And I don't think that the reach of height would c*nt for anything, they almost have the identical reach and height but Joshua is sharper. I think he can replicate Fury's approach, he used an aggressive approach against his tall opponents so far, like Klitschko or Breazeale. Wilder doesn't seem to cope well with pressure at all, I've been saying this before Fury vs Wilder 2 too. He got the equalizer but there are a specific spot and time he likes to throw it, usually starts with him stepping forward with a jab and then put the right behind it, if he's being pressured he is going back in a straight line with a pedestrian looking high guard.

He got walked down by Szpilka for example and it took him 9 rounds to finally land a counter that ended the fight. He wouldn't have the same comfort vs AJ. Joshua has a good enough jab and long enough reach to threaten Wilder while going forward, putting him on the backfoot.
 

malbaker86

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Tbf AJ never tried hard or anyhow to appear intimidating. Wilder’s last few years were all about ego polishing and telling himself and us that he’s intimidating.

AJ was always going for a more laid back, graceful, media trained persona. Some boxing fans hated/hate him because he is too mellow and this appears fake to them. There might be some truth to that but it’s also the skewed logic of many boxing fans that they hate your guts as soon as they perceive your behavior normal. Many of them just hate “mainstream” fighters in general.

We can say though it’s a lot easier to come back from a loss when you didn’t build your whole persona on you being this super intimidator or what but you are just a laid back, media trained guy. Wilder made an awful lot of excuses after both Fury fights, AJ barely made any after losing to Ruiz.

It was also easier to come back for AJ because he started off well against Ruiz and he could legitimately said that he got overeager and one punch changed the trajectory of the whole fight. He kinda proved this being true on the rematch. As opposed to thar I don’t know what Wilder could do different. He’s not as versatile as AJ and Fury is better than Ruiz for starters. Also it wasn’t one punch this time, Fury’s been on his ass from round one, Wilder barely had a good moment, if you are generous with him he might have won the 2nd round and that’s it. He didn’t het overeager, it was not one mistake, he just got beaten down by a better fighter. Idk how he comes back from that. He probably doesn’t. His ego will not let him take a step aside and start to rebuild against someone not Fury though.

This is true, AJ just came across as a nice guy, he was just being himself, his whole persona wasn't about saying it was impossible anybody could beat him or scaring anybody. His aura and vibe was of a sportsman, a dedicated sportsman who worked hard to excel athletically.

Wilder created a narrative that people were scared of him, he was invincible and would knockout everybody currently and throughout history. He had to create this false image of himself to build himself up, AJ was very realistic, he'd lost before and came back in amateur competition (so had Wilder but hardly ever spoke about losses, infact he said it was a lie 1 time when it's on record and on video). AJ had spoken about how he might lose in fights, just because he's realistic and knows at a high level it could happen. Some may say it's a weakness but I completely disagree, I think delusion is a weakness, you can be confident while also accepting reality and being realistic that it's possible to lose.

Also because AJ didn't make excuses it's easier for him to come back, he improved and varied his fight game and came back stronger and put on 1 of his best career performances vs Ruiz in the rematch. Wilder's own delusion hurts him, I'm not sure if he realizes that though, he seems highly insecure. For Wilder to be dominated and destructed in the way he was is deeply damaging. Can he come back? Sure, but the persona and self delusion has taken a hit, it's harder for him to spin his false narratives after getting destroyed like that and blaming his ring walk costume.

Lol yall definitely taking what i said about "aura" and just running with it.

Example....GGG had an aura around him but once Brook, a fighter who was perceived as on a lower level than him, showed some cracks in GGG, then you noticed fighters were then more willing to speak up and wanna face em. Same with what i felt was gonna start, and probably will pre accident, with Spence after the Porter fight. Once he went life and death with Porter...notice how the vibe changed. That's ALLL I'm saying and that's not a bad thing.
 

The Ruler 09

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Lol yall definitely taking what i said about "aura" and just running with it.

Example....GGG had an aura around him but once Brook, a fighter who was perceived as on a lower level than him, showed some cracks in GGG, then you noticed fighters were then more willing to speak up and wanna face em. Same with what i felt was gonna start, and probably will pre accident, with Spence after the Porter fight. Once he went life and death with Porter...notice how the vibe changed. That's ALLL I'm saying and that's not a bad thing.

Losing an aura is nothing new. It happens to a lot of fighters, especially ones that were previously unbeaten or knockout artists.

What may hurt Wilder is his own self perception may be hurt so it will hurt his confidence a lot. He wasn't the man he built himself up to be in his head, that's why he's sounding mad emotional on Instagram videos and trying to keep up the facade.

In terms of willingness of opponents to face Wilder or AJ, I agree, after a loss or knockout the opponents see it's possible and more flaws so it gives them more of a willingness to get in the ring sometimes. AJ may be able to deal with the loss better because his whole philosophy is self improvement, he knew he wasn't the finished article and had work to do to get better. Wilder thought he was invincible, now that invincibility is gone it may crush him. It shouldn't because he still has the power, but he's a very emotional individual, AJ is a lot more intelligent and logical, he looks at thinks from a philosophical place of, how can I get better? What adjustments do I have to make? Wilder started with the ridiculous excuses. Unless he can improve he's heading for more of those nights if he fights top level competition regularly, I don't think his delusion helps him because it distracts from the real thing that would help him, self improvement.

If I was Wilder, I'd use it as a wake up call, find a new team and a coach that will focus on his strengths which are the power and speed but make some strong adjustments to help his overall game to enable him to land more and not be too reliant mentally or technically on the big shots. The whole mentality has to change in my opinion, utilize the power as a strong asset, don't completely rely on it to bail you out because at top level it just won't always land. He's got away with it because he's fought low level opposition, if he was fighting Wlad, Vitali and others they would have exposed those flaws long ago. Even Haye would have given him problems, when they sparred Wilder was doing well the first few times, but Haye kind of worked his style out and started to avoid punches and start landing his own. The best thing Wilder could have done is instead of fighting such low level for so long to gradually have stepped up and up to higher levels, he would have been way more prepared. But he took too big of a leap up so got exposed.

After around 20 fights he should have been really learning and challenging himself in every fight, but he was fighting people like Oltmanns, Beck, Manswell, Greer and people like that. That's what has held him back, in his 34th fight he fought Molina, that's a a dude AJ knocked out in his 18th fight and Hrgovic just knocked out in his 10th. This is a large part of the problem, if he'd fought competition like Whyte, Wlad, Parker, Ruiz, Povetkin (rearranged it) etc, he could have really learnt something. It would have been to his benefit, but he went from Z level then eventually D/C, 1 B level and then straight to A. He was unprepared, they've managed him to create false hype rather than improve his craft and become the best fighter he could be, with his amazing power he could have been incredible if he was taught better and was challenged, you learn through experience and overcoming challenges. He got gassed off fighting fighters levels below him and then he stepped up vs a fit Fury he got exposed and destroyed. Maybe this will be a wake up call for him to finally change, we'll see.
 
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