You know it's inevitable... The Batman V Superman SPOILER Discussion Thread

-DMP-

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I thought lex figured out supes from the ship :yeshrug:

I didn't even realize he knew Batman's identity tho, when did he say his name?

Maybe its possible he figured it out from the ship also, I mean it did know a shyt load about the universe :wow:
 

Soymuscle Mike

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I thought lex figured out supes from the ship :yeshrug:

I didn't even realize he knew Batman's identity tho, when did he say his name?

Maybe its possible he figured it out from the ship also, I mean it did know a shyt load about the universe :wow:

He was the one sending Batman those bills from the crippled guy, he tells Superman he spent 2 years pushing Bruce to hate him.
 

chico25

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I thought lex figured out supes from the ship :yeshrug:

I didn't even realize he knew Batman's identity tho, when did he say his name?

Maybe its possible he figured it out from the ship also, I mean it did know a shyt load about the universe :wow:
Lex was the one who sent Bruce the notes about letting his family die to push him over the edge into killing Superman. The ship wouldn't know any current events info. It had been dormant and stopped gathering data centuries ago and any network it was connected to to upload new data from Krypton would have been gone. Another thing, the guy that gave Lex Zod's body and access to the ship got nothing in return. This high ranking government official just gives full access to this weirdo that has radioactive material the government can either block from entering the country or confiscate as a matter of national security. Instead he gives Lex everything and doesn't even get the rock?:what:
 

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He was the one sending Batman those bills from the crippled guy, he tells Superman he spent 2 years pushing Bruce to hate him.

I thought he(Lex) was sending those checks back on behalf of Wally, so bruce took it as wally sending them back, not lex. Either way, why the hell would that make him hate supes?
 

jwinfield

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Knowing it was needed to kill doomsday wasnt explained
All she knew was that the shyt was strong enough to have Superman with the:sadbron: and seconds away from getting stabbed in the heart by Batman.

If it's strong enough to do that, it might do some damage against this monster destroying the city
 

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Lex was the one who sent Bruce the notes about letting his family die to push him over the edge into killing Superman. The ship wouldn't know any current events info. It had been dormant and stopped gathering data centuries ago and any network it was connected to to upload new data from Krypton would have been gone. Another thing, the guy that gave Lex Zod's body and access to the ship got nothing in return. This high ranking government official just gives full access to this weirdo that has radioactive material the government can either block from entering the country or confiscate as a matter of national security. Instead he gives Lex everything and doesn't even get the rock?:what:

The ship, at very least, would know about clark and lois lane tho, since that happened in MoS and that's when he met his dad for the first time. Seemed to be active then, cuz his dad referred to him in real time (look how you've grown, etc).

I think the deal kinda fell apart when lex kills the entire superman defense counsel with the bomb :skip: Wasn't the deal to provide a deterrent for supes (under the table) but lex needed clearance to get the kryptonite in, general zod's body, and access to the ship. No deal if everyone involved is dead :russ:
 

chico25

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I thought he(Lex) was sending those checks back on behalf of Wally, so bruce took it as wally sending them back, not lex. Either way, why the hell would that make him hate supes?
Because he blamed Superman for crippling that guy and for his friends that died in the fight with Zod already. Having a reminder from someone else holding that same grudge was just an extra push.
 

chico25

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The ship, at very least, would know about clark and lois lane tho, since that happened in MoS and that's when he met his dad for the first time. Seemed to be active then, cuz his dad referred to him in real time (look how you've grown, etc).

I think the deal kinda fell apart when lex kills the entire superman defense counsel with the bomb :skip: Wasn't the deal to provide a deterrent for supes (under the table) but lex needed clearance to get the kryptonite in, general zod's body, and access to the ship. No deal if everyone involved is dead :russ:
Yeah but the Senator was blocking that clearance, you would think someone that high in government would negotiate well enough to be sure he could get what he wanted before turning over access to anything that sensitive and dangerous.
 

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Question: ive seen theories posted about other dream sequences, but can anyone find something of significance about the Bruce Wayne/Demon/morgue scene?

I thought it was random as hell.
 

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Just saw it this weekend. I'm not a comic head. Here's my review.

THE GOOD:

Affleck/Batman/Bruce Wayne/ (and Alfred)

Yeah this is one thing the movie got perfect. I am more interested in another Batman movie than anything else.

God vs Man/ Public Perception discussion

I liked this approach ever since I saw the trailers. I feel like they could have taken it to a higher level, but unfortunately..........

THE BAD:

Doomsday:

Unfortunately, a good movie that could have had a good to great ending was interrupted by the monster of the week starring Doomsday. I know that Doomsday is an important character in the comics, but all I saw was a random monster thrown in at the end of the movie to get the heroes to join forces and showcase all of their powers.


:russell:



Superman and Batman are the two biggest comic icons of all time and this was the best writing they can come up with? Remember how dope the ending was to TDK? Yeah, well that damn sure wasn't the case here. Incredibly lame.

Lex Luthor:

I think we found our new Riddler yall :martin:. Again, I'm not a comic head. If that's how Lex Luthor was at one point in the comics, then I guess it makes sense to have him portrayed that way. But the Lex Luthor I know is a more cerebral version of Netflix's take on Kingpin in Daredevil. Intimidating and extremely smart.

Yet there I was watching a white Steve Urkel nearly take down Superman and Batman at the same damn time. I'm not feeling that. AT ALL.

Also, when Lex greeted Clark and Bruce, did Clark already know Lex? Did he assume that Lex may have known him by one of his articles? It just felt weird like how come Clark didn't look at him like "how TF you talking about me like we know each other". Was the writing that bad or did I miss something here?

And despite all that, I will let Luthor slide because he did a great job of manipulating both Bats and Supes. But I can't overlook his role in making Doomsday. What :dahell:was the point of making Doomsday again?


There was enough substance in the movie to take it to an interesting ending. Instead, here comes the big bad monster of the week.


DC needs to just focus on Batman, because that's the only franchise they seem to get right. This is the biggest comic book movie and its just so ........okayish.
 

Dr. Narcisse

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Question: ive seen theories posted about other dream sequences, but can anyone find something of significance about the Bruce Wayne/Demon/morgue scene?

I thought it was random as hell.
I think what they used was a nod to "Man-Bat"
latest


But that scene was also used to illustrate just how haunted he was about his parent's death.

The Bat busting the grave choking him is similar to the dream scene in Ang Lee's Hulk. Where the dual identity consumes him and he's cruel.

This is also alluded to by Alfred in the film.
tumblr_nrr0vfGzWW1tu1beso1_500.jpg


His Batman is truly on some other shyt now since Superman's arrival. It gives him that shook feeling he had as a child who saw his parents gunned down.
 
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I think you REALLY wasn't paying attention at all.

1. Yes, Superman killed that one African terrorist leader. It was a HUGE deal that set-up the entire plot. Not only was it acknowledge, the ENTIRE SENATE hearing was about that.

2. The movie has one of the simplest plots, but a lot of depth. The plot is simple: Does Earth need someone who is a God in man's image. Lex Luthor views Superman as the ultimate threat to mankind's existence and want Superman out of existence by way of using Batman. That is it. Everything else is subplots that links Luthor being behind everything just to set up the demise of Superman.

3. Wonder Woman's purpose was a subplot to introduce the Justice League. Lex was searching for other metahumans and discovered files on her. She learned about this and wants to get them back because she didn't want to be exposed.

4. Lex Luthor had one motivation. To kill Superman, not just physically, but also what he represented symbolically to people. That's the reason behind the staged African massacre, the suicide bombing at the Senate, and getting the military and government approved exclusive access to Supergirl's ship and Zod's body. As well as manipulating both Batman and Superman to have an automatic dislike, especially with Batman who was determined to end Superman for those same reasons that Luthor believed, but the only difference is Batman wants to kill Superman to save humanity, whereas Luthor wants it for his own selfish desire. Luthor is a narcissist with a superiority complex and even the idea of a God that can rule over man rubs him the wrong way. He takes self-gratification in a man being able to kill or control God. He explains his rationale plenty of times, not just to Superman, but as well as to Senator Finch.

5. The movie IS supposed to be about him, but it is mostly through the perspectives of everyone else. So, of course he wouldn't have many dialogue. This film is an theologian analogy to the Passion of Christ in which Jesus comes in and claims to be a savior of mankind, the people have mixed feelings about him, he's been judged, he is crucified, and in the end it is hinted to his resurrection. The parallels to this and Jesus are quite blatant. So, of course it doesn't have heavy dialogue from Superman himself, it doesn't it... it mostly from everyone else's POV.

6. Batman had every reason to see Superman as a threat. a.) he was there at ground zero and witnessed his own financial building destroyed and his employees killed or paralyzed. b.) he gets a vision and a warning about Superman and how a world under his totalitarian rule would look like (implying the whole INJUSTICE narrative). c.) he discovered the return checks by his former employee with Lex making it look like his former employee didn't have his back then seeing the Capitol building explode with Superman in it. He had motives. And, as suggested by Alfred, since the learning of Superman's existence and how it affected innocent lives that Bruce personally saw get killed, Batman's brutality increase to having zero-fukks. There's no evidence of him bring a killing machine prior to Superman. And even when the sex slave trader was caught... he didn't kill him, just branded him and that was the 1st time Clark heard of Batman's actions and ethics. And not only that, the dream/vision sequence was from an alternate timeline. Lastly, he never went out to try to kill people with the purpose to kill people with the exception of Superman because he firmly believe he needed to be dead. The car chase scene was mostly either incidental or by trafficker's own fault. The warehouse scene... he didn't really kill ANYONE intentionally. He didn't go in there guns blazing on some Punisher shyt. The people who were killed was when dude fell on his own grenade, those who self-inflicted their own deaths, and the head Russian holding Martha Kent which, BTW is literally straight from Frank Miller's TDKR graphic novel and even with that Batman didn't shot him point blank. He shot at the flame torch and that exploded into flames....without truly confirmation of if dude was dead or have extreme degree burns. He's brutal, he's doesn't give a fucck anymore but it's not out seeking to kill with that being the 1st thought.

7. You saying Superman Returns... a movie with zero action. The worst story plot ever in comic book history. And a force-fed love note to Richard Donner. You lose points for that alone.

8. The warehouse scene wasn't shown just a little bit in the trailer, not the full entire thing.

9. Lets start with the fact that Superman was holding back in the fight against Batman. But Superman used his hearing A LOT... he used his speed to get from point A to point B a lot. He definitely used his laser vision which is his deadliest weapon a lot. So what are you talking about? Who CARES if he didn't use his cooling breathe? What purpose would it serve? Lastly, it is very much implied that he used his X-ray vision a number of times. Afterall, it is how he knew who Batman was.

10. Superman used his speed to get anywhere at a blink of an eye. He is capable of all the things you said, except he CANNOT see or hear through LEAD not that means anything. What he also cannot do is read minds. How the hell could he know where his mom IS? Saying to use so-called super hearing. It DOESN'T WORK LIKE THAT. It's not like he can hear everything everywhere. Even that has limits. That's like Quinn telling Han "We could use the FORCE"... dummy... it doesn't work like that.

11. Again, if he was to find where his mother was within time... she would of been killed. PERIOD. It was that simple. Plus, you dismiss the fact that Lex had a contingency plan and was creating doomsday already and he was using Superman to buy that extra time if Batman wasn't able to do the job.

12. Again, Superman didn't want to fight Batman to begin with. 2nd of all, Batman was in his protective suit that prevents him getting knocked out, and lastly he had extra rounds of Kryptonite gas grenades to ensure Superman can be out of commission. Other words, Batman had PREP-TIME.

13. The Knightmare scene is arguably one of the most important foreshadowing scenes implying INJUSTICE being part of the upcoming Justice League movie.

14. So, the African massacre, the Senate bombing, the Flash visions, the metahuman files, oh and the DEATH OF SUPERMAN is all from the trailers. Okay.

15. Again, not even paying attention Bruce stated the Superman coffin is empty. And the conversation is straight corn? How? Because Bruce told Diana that they need to recruit for form a Justice League due to his own foreshadowed predictions to what's to come?

16. And there it is.... Marvel stan boyisms. But you WB still got your money! :umad:

Good explanations overall. Though I still didn't vibe with how a lot of this was delivered. Like Batmans' dream sequence being that spot on of the Injustice story (which I totally got in the theater) it seemed a bit much tho, like, why would Bats have that level of vision to that level of things. I know it's a nod and foreshadowing on potential movie to come, but just seemed a bit too convenient and unexplained. It's not like Bats is some sort of clairvoyant or anything. It just didn't seem to fit in context of what was going on in the movie and just was a lil too left field, albiet a decent scene otherwise. I'll make this small comparison to the scene in Age of Utron (not for the sake of movie quality comparison or fanboyism, just similarity of dream sequences in the same usage manner) in that in AoU, Stark had the same sort of foreshadowed dream sequence, but it was due to being hexed by Scarlett Witch. IIRC, Bruce had that dream before knowing/watching the meta human files (if I'm wrong, I'm wrong tho, please let me know), so Flash knowledge didn't make sense for him to know how he looked or things about him. I saw it yesterday, movie is 6/10, but I'm willing to watch it again someday.
 

chico25

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Good explanations overall. Though I still didn't vibe with how a lot of this was delivered. Like Batmans' dream sequence being that spot on of the Injustice story (which I totally got in the theater) it seemed a bit much tho, like, why would Bats have that level of vision to that level of things. I know it's a nod and foreshadowing on potential movie to come, but just seemed a bit too convenient and unexplained. It's not like Bats is some sort of clairvoyant or anything. It just didn't seem to fit in context of what was going on in the movie and just was a lil too left field, albiet a decent scene otherwise. I'll make this small comparison to the scene in Age of Utron (not for the sake of movie quality comparison or fanboyism, just similarity of dream sequences in the same usage manner) in that in AoU, Stark had the same sort of foreshadowed dream sequence, but it was due to being hexed by Scarlett Witch. IIRC, Bruce had that dream before knowing/watching the meta human files (if I'm wrong, I'm wrong tho, please let me know), so Flash knowledge didn't make sense for him to know how he looked or things about him. I saw it yesterday, movie is 6/10, but I'm willing to watch it again someday.
The only plausible explanation I can come up with is Lex planting a post hypnotic message in the encryption so that as it's decrypted whoever was breaking in would see that vision. That explanation just adds the question of how long Lex knew about Darkseid and was he working for him the whole time and if he was what does he gain from that?
 
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