Would Ralph Cifaretto have changed?

Mr. Pink

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If The Sopranos has a main theme it's that people never change. They technically could, but hardly anyone ever does because change is very hard.

Ralph was a disturbed individual even for the mob, and killing that girl and her unborn child is probably the worst atrocity we see on the show. He is the last person you would think has a shot at changing.

But many people say suffering is perhaps the only thing that can change a person for the better, and Ralph had plenty of that in his last days.

It seemed like the shock of his son's accident really made Ralph take a good look at himself, possibly for the first time in his life. He realized how badly he treated Rosalie and how he never empathized with her over her son's death. He realized the heinous things he did in his mob life. He realized what a bad father he'd been and agonized over his son's 7th birthday, when he forgot to call him because he was high on coke. He donated that $20k scholarship. He even humbled himself enough to go and talk to the priest.

So, do you think if Justin pulled through Ralphie would have eventually become a better man? What about if Justin took a turn for the worse?

Or do you think that, just like Tony's resolution after his shooting, eventually the high would have worn off and regular mob life would have made him become worse than ever?

What is everyone's opinion?

Bonus question: did Ralph set the fire?
 

Cave Savage

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Yes he was becoming a better person.

And no I don't think he set the fire, but he considered it to not be a big enough deal for Tony to freak out over it.
 

Luke Cage

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If The Sopranos has a main theme it's that people never change. They technically could, but hardly anyone ever does because change is very hard.

Ralph was a disturbed individual even for the mob, and killing that girl and her unborn child is probably the worst atrocity we see on the show. He is the last person you would think has a shot at changing.

But many people say suffering is perhaps the only thing that can change a person for the better, and Ralph had plenty of that in his last days.

It seemed like the shock of his son's accident really made Ralph take a good look at himself, possibly for the first time in his life. He realized how badly he treated Rosalie and how he never empathized with her over her son's death. He realized the heinous things he did in his mob life. He realized what a bad father he'd been and agonized over his son's 7th birthday, when he forgot to call him because he was high on coke. He donated that $20k scholarship. He even humbled himself enough to go and talk to the priest.

So, do you think if Justin pulled through Ralphie would have eventually become a better man? What about if Justin took a turn for the worse?

Or do you think that, just like Tony's resolution after his shooting, eventually the high would have worn off and regular mob life would have made him become worse than ever?

What is everyone's opinion?

Bonus question: did Ralph set the fire?
A friend of mine has a theory that it was Paulie, because he hated Ralphie and didn't realize the horse belonged to Tony now.
 

AnonymityX1000

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He definitely set the fire. He admitted it didn't he?
I was feeling for Ralph in his last days but he was in the mob and it wasn't like he was thinking of leaving. So his job duties would prevent him from being a better person. I think he would probably be a better Dad going forward due to guilt but in every other area of his life I think you are right, 'the high would have worn off'.
 

Macallik86

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I also think he set the fire. Also, he had crossed the lines too many times. He wasn't good at his job, he got the promotion solely because of circumstance and Tony said as much.

The situation with his son wouldn't have changed anything. Things were too deep-rooted, hence when he had all of the masochistic fetishes in the bedroom
 

Cave Savage

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I also think that he was killed off early because his character wasn't popular with women.

I think the show was trying to appeal more to women in season 4. There was less violence, more family drama, and Carmela had a more active role.
 

Dave24

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I think Ralph had a few motives to do it.

His son was in the hospital, we know that's expensive, especially ICU.

Tony wasn't paying for Pie oh My or any of his health costs(except the ER vet)

Tony was taking winnings from Ralph on a horse he didn't own.

Tony took Valentina from Ralph.

Tony tells Ralph about Valentina the day his son was shot or soon after.
 

AnonymityX1000

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I also think that he was killed off early because his character wasn't popular with women.

I think the show was trying to appeal more to women in season 4. There was less violence, more family drama, and Carmela had a more active role.

Hmm . . . that's interesting. I do think the series was intended to be one way but changed in places because it was so popular and they wanted it to stay that way.
Never thought of this tho, Carmela loves Furio, Adriana becoming an informant, Janice trying to land Bobby. there were a lot of plots where women were central.
 

AnonymityX1000

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I think Ralph had a few motives to do it.

His son was in the hospital, we know that's expensive, especially ICU.

Tony wasn't paying for Pie oh My or any of his health costs(except the ER vet)

Tony was taking winnings from Ralph on a horse he didn't own.

Tony took Valentina from Ralph.

Tony tells Ralph about Valentina the day his son was shot or soon after.
The night of the fire was the day Tony told him. I totally think he was on some fukk Tony shyt with the fire and it was financially beneficial.
 

Cave Savage

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Hmm . . . that's interesting. I do think the series was intended to be one way but changed in places because it was so popular and they wanted it to stay that way.
Never thought of this tho, Carmela loves Furio, Adriana becoming an informant, Janice trying to land Bobby. there were a lot of plots where women were central.

Right. I binged watched the whole series so it was pretty noticible to me. I thought Season 4 had a different vibe from Season 3. In addition to what you mentioned, I think Tony's comares also began to have a more central role. In the earlier episodes, it was that Russian chick who was kind of 1 dimensional.

It is pretty remarkable how popular the show was, it was on a premium service (at a time when many people still only had antenna) and was one of the most popular shows on TV for its whole run. And also elevated TV shows to the prestige of movies.
 

AnonymityX1000

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Right. I binged watched the whole series so it was pretty noticible to me. I thought Season 4 had a different vibe from Season 3. In addition to what you mentioned, I think Tony's comares also began to have a more central role. In the earlier episodes, it was that Russian chick who was kind of 1 dimensional.

It is pretty remarkable how popular the show was, it was on a premium service (at a time when many people still only had antenna) and was one of the most popular shows on TV for its whole run. And also elevated TV shows to the prestige of movies.
Comares? You mean Gouma? Gloria Trillo got a lot of burn but that was season three. But actually, they announced her death in season 4 and Tony was all sad about it, Valentina got some decent screen time and so did one legged Svetlana.
 

Cave Savage

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Comares? You mean Gouma? Gloria Trillo got a lot of burn but that was season three. But actually, they announced her death in season 4 and Tony was all sad about it, Valentina got some decent screen time and so did one legged Svetlana.

"Goomar" is the Italian-American pronunciation of the Italian world "comare" which means mistress

And yeah Gloria was season 3. But by 3 and definitely 4, it had a noticibly different vibe from Season 1 which was very violent and more male oriented.
 

Mr. Pink

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A friend of mine has a theory that it was Paulie, because he hated Ralphie and didn't realize the horse belonged to Tony now.
It never occurred to me but that makes perfect sense. I also don't think Ralph started the fire, it was a case of the boy who cried wolf. Tony knew he was a piece of shyt so he automatically suspected him, but ironically Ralph was innocent that time.

Ralph didn't put too much of a defense but that was because he was just too tired and exasperated to kiss Tony's ass anymore.
 
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