Why do these leagues continue to give a pass for officials making horrendous calls?

[23Barrettcity]

By rule my ass. Now you sound like joe torre. That ball was in the outfield, clearly. It was what is called a blooper of which there have been tons. Never has one that far in the outfield been a judgement call. Infield flies are called immediately.

That call Made sense it's a blooper to me too .i didn't watch any post game stuff to see what the reasoning was

 

[tremonthustler1]

It was also supposed to be signaled immediately, not after he saw the confusion between the players and the ball was about to drop. That's unacceptable.

And that's a problem.

By rule my ass. Now you sound like joe torre. That ball was in the outfield, clearly. It was what is called a blooper of which there have been tons. Never has one that far in the outfield been a judgement call. Infield flies are called immediately.

The ball can technically be in the OF and still be called an infield fly rule. The error was on the ump not calling it immediately. Whether he felt it justified an infield fly call was up to him. Him calling it late doesn't mean it shouldn't have been called at all. The rule actually covers all of this.

 

[Kobes Two Jerseys]

And that's a problem.



The ball can technically be in the OF and still be called an infield fly rule. The error was on the ump not calling it immediately. Whether he felt it justified an infield fly call was up to him. Him calling it late doesn't mean it shouldn't have been called at all. The rule actually covers all of this.

Yea a few feet in the outfield. Not 50 plus feet beyond it. It was a blooper and nothing else. The error was calling it an infield fly because if it wasn't the wrong call, umps have messed up the rule thousands of times over a hundred years.

 

[tremonthustler1]

Yea a few feet in the outfield. Not 50 plus feet beyond it. It was a blooper and nothing else. The error was calling it an infield fly because if it wasn't the wrong call, umps have messed up the rule thousands of times over a hundred years.

And as egregious as that error was, it was a judgment call. Bad call, but not one that someone else can overrule because it's pure judgment. He should have never raised his hand and if he was, do it immediately. Had the ump raised his hand ASAP, he wouldn't have caught as much heat.

 

[Kobes Two Jerseys]

And as egregious as that error was, it was a judgment call. Bad call, but not one that someone else can overrule because it's pure judgment. He should have never raised his hand and if he was, do it immediately. Had the ump raised his hand ASAP, he wouldn't have caught as much heat.

It was the wrong call period. Fifty feet in the outfield is the outfield. Why must you keep ignoring this basic fact? The ball was far enough that the left fielder had a chance to catch it. Now name me the last time an outfielder caught an infield fly. And yes he would have caught heat. The ball was in the area designated as " the outfield".

 

[tremonthustler1]

It was the wrong call period. Fifty feet in the outfield is the outfield. Why must you keep ignoring this basic fact? The ball was far enough that the left fielder had a chance to catch it. Now name me the last time an outfielder caught an infield fly. And yes he would have caught heat. The ball was in the area designated as " the outfield".

Plenty of times, especially if the OF comes into where the IF was, which is where the miscommunication happened.

An INFIELD FLY is a fair fly ball (not including a line drive nor an attempted bunt) which can be caught by an infielder with ordinary effort, when first and second, or first, second and third bases are occupied, before two are out. The pitcher, catcher and any outfielder who stations himself in the infield on the play shall be considered infielders for the purpose of this rule.

When it seems apparent that a batted ball will be an Infield Fly, the umpire shall immediately declare "Infield Fly" for the benefit of the runners. If the ball is near the baselines, the umpire shall declare "Infield Fly, if Fair." The ball is alive and runners may advance at the risk of the ball being caught, or retouch and advance after the ball is touched, the same as on any fly ball. If the hit becomes a foul ball, it is treated the same as any foul. If a declared Infield Fly is allowed to fall untouched to the ground, and bounces foul before passing first or third base, it is a foul ball. If a declared Infield Fly falls untouched to the ground outside the baseline, and bounces fair before passing first or third base, it is an Infield Fly.

Rule 2.00 (Infield Fly) Comment: On the infield fly rule the umpire is to rule whether the ball could ordinarily have been handled by an infielder-not by some arbitrary limitation such as the grass, or the base lines. The umpire must rule also that a ball is an infield fly, even if handled by an outfielder, if, in the umpire's judgment, the ball could have been as easily handled by an infielder. The infield fly is in no sense to be considered an appeal play. The umpire's judgment must govern, and the decision should be made immediately.

When an infield fly rule is called, runners may advance at their own risk. If on an infield fly rule, the infielder intentionally drops a fair ball, the ball remains in play despite the provisions of Rule 6.05(l). The infield fly rule takes precedence.

By law, the ump pretty much did what he was allowed to do except call it immediately. He called it an infield fly as the ball was coming down. The SS had a great shot at that ball, and that's why he even had the option of calling it an infield fly rule. It's not as if he could have called it that if the IF had no reasonable chance at it. It's less about where the ball is and more about where the players are positioned.

The ball doesn't have to be in the infield for it to be an infield fly rule. It's not a prerequisite.

 

[HHR]

The rule doesn't say it needs to be called immediately. What it says is that WHEN IT SEEMS APPARENT, it should be called immediately. That's very different than called immediately when the ball is put in play. And though late, when Kozma was calling off Holiday and settling under the ball, it was the right call.

The two judgement part of the calls are whether Kozma was using merely "ordinary effort" and whether or not they could have turned a double play from that distance. Both are obviously borderline, but are probably irrelevant in hindsight because the rule is intended to protect the offense so erring on that side is probably fair.

And the fact that he called it late is entirely irrelevant. Whether he called the infield fly 2 second earlier or not, the play wasn't going to change.....if anything, calling it earlier would have cause the runners to return to their bags and they wouldn't have advanced at all.

I feel bad for the umps (I know, I know....) because if Kozma doesn't fukk up then this isn't even a discussion

 

[HHR]

One thing I'll add is that they should probably change the name of the rule to avoid future issues

 

[HHR]

It was the wrong call period. Fifty feet in the outfield is the outfield. Why must you keep ignoring this basic fact? The ball was far enough that the left fielder had a chance to catch it. Now name me the last time an outfielder caught an infield fly. And yes he would have caught heat. The ball was in the area designated as " the outfield".

Rule 2.00 (Infield Fly) Comment: On the infield fly rule the umpire is to rule whether the ball could ordinarily have been handled by an infielder, —not by some arbitrary limitation such as the grass, or the base lines. The umpire must rule also that a ball is an infield fly, even if handled by an outfielder, if, in the umpire’s judgment, the ball could have been as easily handled by an infielder. The infield fly is in no sense to be considered an appeal play. The umpire’s judgment must govern, and the decision should be made immediately.

 

[The War Report]

In an infield fly that goes untouched do the runners have to tag up to advance?

 

[HHR]

In an infield fly that goes untouched do the runners have to tag up to advance?

No, it only takes the force off.

 

[Regular_P]

There's no defending that call. There was CLEAR confusion between the fielders and it was deep enough that even if they dropped it "purposely," there was ZERO chance for a double play and that's what the rule was intended to prohibit.

Indefensible all the way around.

 

[HHR]

There was definitely not clear confusion, lol. Kozma had his hand out, was locked on the ball and was underneath it...at the last moment he thought he heard Holiday so he moved. All of the confusion came AFTER it was called an infield fly...up until that point everything was pretty standard.

 

[jfkennedy]

I'm watching MLB Network, and after they show the replay, I don't even think the umpire was that wrong. It's clear that as soon as Kozma settles under the ball, the ump calls the infield fly. It isn't even an issue of it being too late, he just does it when Kozma settles under the ball ... and then RIGHT afterward Kozma moves.

It was actually the right call. Yet, that's if you think the Cards could've doubled up the runners, and I think it was about 5, 10 feet too deep for that.

 

[HHR]

I'm watching MLB Network, and after they show the replay, I don't even think the umpire was that wrong. It's clear that as soon as Kozma settles under the ball, the ump calls the fair catch. It isn't even an issue of it being too late, he just does it when Kozma settles under the ball ... and then RIGHT afterward Kozma moves.

It was actually the right call. Yet, that's if you think the Cards could've doubled up the runners, and I think it was about 5, 10 feet too deep for that.

EDIT: Gotcha