What is the Chinese Game Plan for Africa?

[Captain Crunch]

...you can get rich selling shoes...warren buffet is super rich and he dont make shyt...it should be obvious that making or building things [gadgets] aint the only way to acquire wealth and power...

True
But the point is that Africa needs to have it's own manufacturers(planes; cars, electronics). If you get that or infrastructure(developed and built by Africans), you will start to see a budding economy.

 

[Kuro]

..i posted in another thread the possibility of ghost cities built by the chinese in africa thinking it hadnt happened but it has...i need to keep up--...

 

[Chris.B]

The problem is the leaders....they will take money and let anyone exploit their people...its a hopeless situation

 

[Broke Wave]

I can't speak on this really, since I never been over there. I'm weary of this, since I doubt anyone but Africans have Africa's best interest. I can't wait to hit up Lagos or Nairobi next year to somewhat see this firsthand.

With that said, African born posters, what's your stance on this?
@2Quik4UHoes @Don Drogo @Broke Wave @Chris.B

Also, we can't shyt on Africa for being broke, when they just got out on colialism. Not too mention all the industries/resource refineries/etc are still owned by the former people in charge, so they're basically taking loans since they're don't have the funds to mine/refine resources.

I wasn't born in Africa.

Either way, nobody has anyones best interests in mind when it comes to money. It is a zero-sum game. You think the Chinese want to develop the oil regions of West Africa because of some humanitarian goal? Of course not. The smartest thing for Nigerians to do is try and make them compete against one another with regards to who can develop and uplift the population more, instead of allowing their overlords to make side deals and sell out the country. Africa should burn once more before anything is allowed to grow.

 

[theworldismine13]

...you can get rich selling shoes...warren buffet is super rich and he dont make shyt...it should be obvious that making or building things [gadgets] aint the only way to acquire wealth and power...

shoes require manufacturing facilities, which is my whole point, i was just using electronics as an example, but shoes is the same point

you can make a little money selling leather but the shoe maker is the real moneymaker

if you buy leather for a 2$ and sell the shoes for 15$ (or 100$) who is getting richer in the end? the person who sells the leather or the person who makes the shoes?

im not sure what warren buffet has to do with anything, i think we are talking about how to develop countries, i think africa already has warren buffets, i dont think africa has significant shoe manufacturing capabilities tho

in fact what made me go is when i realized that 500 years after europeans came with ocean going ships and guns to africa, africans still dont know how to make guns and ocean going vessels, hence the black star line failing

 

[blackzeus]

agreed, except for the part about africa should be the richest, africa can make some money from minerals but the real money will always go to whoever puts the electronics together, africa will never get really rich from selling minerals, which at the end of the day, no matter how rare, are just commodities

now the day when africans (inlcuding us in the states) figure out how to make cellphones, cars and radios etc, that is the day africa will get rich

Most of the oil sheikhs don't even have their own refineries. shyt like tantalum going for $250/kg, there's 3,000 + tons estimated in Central Africa, there's 2,204 lbs in a metric ton, you do the math and tell me you still think African's can't get rich And that's just one type of rare earth. Africa damn near got the whole period table on deck

 

[theworldismine13]

Most of the oil sheikhs don't even have their own refineries. shyt like tantalum going for $250/kg, there's 3,000 + tons estimated in Central Africa, there's 2,204 lbs in a metric ton, you do the math and tell me you still think African's can't get rich And that's just one type of rare earth. Africa damn near got the whole period table on deck

the math is pretty simple, population of of Saudi arabia is 28 million, population of nigeria is 300 million

http://www.eia.gov/countries/regions-topics.cfm?fips=OPEC
revenue from oil from saudi arabia 300 billion, divide that by 28 million
revenue from oil in nigeria 90 billion, divided by by 300 million and subtract corruption

in other words there is no way africa will get as rich as desert countries with tiny populations using oil

amount of tantulum in a 100 phone? a few pennies worth, so you can buy 1 kg of for $250 and make 10,000 phones and sell them for $250 each, and you got $2,500,000

who has more money? the person that sold a kg of tantulum for $250, or the person that used that kg of tantulum to make 10,000 phones at $250 a pop

lets look at japan, amount of natural resources = ZERO, economy is second or third largest

the math is crystal clear, resources are not the key to wealth, the key is manufacturing and education of the population, you can make some change from natural resources but that is about it

 

[blackzeus]

the math is pretty simple, population of of Saudi arabia is 28 million, population of nigeria is 300 million

U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA)
revenue from oil from saudi arabia 300 billion, divide that by 28 million
revenue from oil in nigeria 90 billion, divided by by 300 million and subtract corruption

in other words there is no way africa will get as rich as desert countries with tiny populations using oil

amount of tantulum in a 100 phone? a few pennies worth, so you can buy 1 kg of for $250 and make 10,000 phones and sell them for $250 each, and you got $2,500,000

who has more money? the person that sold a kg of tantulum for $250, or the person that used that kg of tantulum to make 10,000 phones at $250 a pop

lets look at japan, amount of natural resources = ZERO, economy is second or third largest

the math is crystal clear, resources are not the key to wealth, the key is manufacturing and education of the population, you can make some change from natural resources but that is about it

there's no rare earth African cartel, that's the difference. If the African nations got together, they could set fixed prices on everything and at the rest of the globe. Then demand for manufacturing to be done in Africa But politicians would rather get rich

 

[Malik]

there's no rare earth African cartel, that's the difference. If the African nations got together, they could set fixed prices on everything and at the rest of the globe. Then demand for manufacturing to be done in Africa But politicians would rather get rich

Gaddafi was thinking about doing something like that

 

[blackzeus]

Gaddafi was thinking about doing something like that

Yeah, they turned his own people against him. You really think CACs could win a hand to hand combat against a billion united Africans? And they can't nuke it, otherwise they would destroy the world supply.

 

[theworldismine13]

there's no rare earth African cartel, that's the difference. If the African nations got together, they could set fixed prices on everything and at the rest of the globe. Then demand for manufacturing to be done in Africa But politicians would rather get rich

there is no way that would work, i showed you the math, the reason why some arab countries are rich is because they have a tiny population compared to the oil revenue and the OPEC cartel had a spark a long time but its pretty much irrelevant on top of that africa is not the only source for those rare metals, actually china has a lot og those rare metals two

but again, you cant escape the math, the amount of material per phone is in the pennies, if african countries got 10 times more money, lets say $2500 per pound, apple would have to raise the price for the iphone by a few cents and they would still be able to sell their phone for $600, and if african countries want 100 times more money, then apple would raise the price to $700, they will still make their money

the math is crystal clear that the supplier of raw materials get some change and the real money goes to the manufacturer

you cant demand that companies manufacture anywhere, what we need to do is make the phones ourselves, that way we get the raw material for even cheaper and keep all the profit

if companies want to set up manufacturing in africa that is a good thing also but its not as profitable as africans setting up their own manufacturing


for africa to get rich it has nothing to do with raw materials, IMO it has everything to do with education, you can't develop a country when half the people cant even read, and a tiny population of college educated people

it doesnt matter how many raw materials you have, for africa to get wealthy it has to become educated, literate and it has to make things

 

[Marvel]

there's no rare earth African cartel, that's the difference. If the African nations got together, they could set fixed prices on everything and at the rest of the globe. Then demand for manufacturing to be done in Africa But politicians would rather get rich

African leaders are ok with being allowed to loot crumbs of the money that comes from their own backyard. The funny thing is that when they steal this money, they have to put it in the white man's bank and they will eventually seize the money for themselves when the time comes. When the new comes up...rinse and repeat.

That is why I believe that Africans need breakaway from their colonial created countries...there is no accountability or national pride because it is not an organic creation. People don't that Nigeria can easily formed into 3-6 countries. Imagine France, Spain, Uk, and Portugal being one nation. Would it work? Hell No. A lot of other countries had the same isses, like Sudan. When everybody can take care of their own people, then an African cartel can get together and tell the white man... enough is enough and set prices in natural resources. They can't nuke a continent that is full of valuable resources that the world needs.

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[TTT]

The Chinese "plans for Africa" to the extent they have one is based on the natural resources they require for their industries. This is basically part of the trade system that Africa is not going to exclude itself from. China had an inside track to many African countries because it has been there even when it was a poor developing country. They built the Tazara railway between Zambia and Tanzania back in the 70s when Western countries were refusing to put significant pressure on the Rhodesian and South African regimes that blockaded them. Politically speaking they have made the right investments, they are also the single largest lender to Latin American countries.

The loans or lines of credit they offer African countries are usually greeted with so much noise and speculation and sometimes downright patronizing remarks about Africans not knowing what they are doing. The fact that you have resources does not mean you have capital to extract those resources. Some of the countries that China has been lending money to are the type the Western lenders wouldn't touch with a barge pole because they are deemed not creditworthy. Of course not all countries fall into this categorization but that's the folly of treating Africa as this generic entity instead of countries that have different resources and challenges.

The bottom line is that most African countries are not in a position to be capital equipment manufacturers or huge source capital markets, Nigeria has only recently developed deep capital markets. Companies such as Transocean,Schlumberger,Rio Tinto and others have the capital and know how that many African governments did not develop. The only country with big mining houses is South Africa because of its long history of resource extraction going back to the discovery of diamonds at Kimberly and gold fields that gave the Oppenheimers,Cecil John Rhodes and even drew JP Morgan as a financier.

As it stands most countries did not develop those big companies (with the exception of state oil companies) and the capital, whether it is the financial, technology , and equipment is sourced from outside. China has such companies and filled the void because Western companies think of risk differently from the Chinese, for instance they left Zambian copper mines and the Chinese then moved in to revive those leaving them with a lot of investments in those countries. My own opinion on the Chinese is that they have been a positive for countries that needed capital and investments, the major negative being that they assume that their labor standards they are used to in their home country is applicable to other countries.

 

[Mr Uncle Leroy]

...you can get rich selling shoes...warren buffet is super rich and he dont make shyt...it should be obvious that making or building things [gadgets] aint the only way to acquire wealth and power...

those wealthy come from a myraid of backgrounds from telecommunication to banking to grocers to media to software to shipping to internet, etc

the truth is africa has so much potential, that anyone with profound success and potential can achieve wealthy success from africa

 

[Mr Uncle Leroy]

agreed, except for the part about africa should be the richest, africa can make some money from minerals but the real money will always go to whoever puts the electronics together, africa will never get really rich from selling minerals, which at the end of the day, no matter how rare, are just commodities

now the day when africans (inlcuding us in the states) figure out how to make cellphones, cars and radios etc, that is the day africa will get rich

Africa has a lot of potential. Commoditizing minerals in addition to various plans could bring in profit.