UFC Liteweight Flopping

TrueEpic08

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This, but the problem is, they dont have enough high level guys that can headline a card. Its okay to use the Jon Jones' and the GSPs of the world to headline PPVs but the problem when it comes to the Fox events is that they use some mid level guys such as Nate Diaz, who are great fighters but arent well known to the public. Which brings me to the point Malta made about building up their fighters, they need to find a way to expose some of these guys without oversaturating the brand. They expose these newer guys like on TUF..but thats it.

This is true, but you tell me how you build a mercurial nutjob like Nate Diaz (I love Nate, but this is true).

Of course, you could go safe and end up with a total pretender like Roger Huerta. :scusthov:

It's an easy thing to say, but in no way is it an easy fix, especially when so many of these guys are completely nondescript.
 

The G.O.D II

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nikka you know what I meant :wtb:

UFC and Dana White makes events that would normally be pay-per-view events free so they don't get killed by boxing numbers. Happy now?

Once again :dwillhuh: outside of the Valequez/Dos Santos bout what ppv caliber event has been on network tv. Certaintly not the past diaz/miller fight and most def not the unpcoming lombard/stann bout. Killed by boxing numbers? If Mayweather isn't fighting nobody really purchases boxing fights. Even this upcoming Pacquia bout wont be very huge
 

The G.O.D II

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Actually, I REMEMBER being on AOL Chat rooms and being laughed outta the room because I said "Jericho was the next HBK" when he was nearly a nobody in early in WCW.

I know my stuff, thanks.

My point is, you got ppl fighting who nobody really knows, unless you follow Sherdog or those other sites. I dnt watch the UFC show, the only ppl I ever know are the main event guys. :manny:

Basically what it boils down too. :ehh:
 

Grams

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Once again :dwillhuh: outside of the Valequez/Dos Santos bout what ppv caliber event has been on network tv. Certaintly not the past diaz/miller fight and most def not the unpcoming lombard/stann bout. Killed by boxing numbers? If Mayweather isn't fighting nobody really purchases boxing fights. Even this upcoming Pacquia bout wont be very huge

That's what I'm saying though. A big match like that and they put it on network TV when it's the same day as the Pacquiao fight, and then these guys say it was to get more fans right :stopitslime:

This MF Dana White made UFC 105 free after he was shook by Pacquiao vs Cotto. Machida vs Shogun 2 was too much of a money maker so instead of making it free on Spike, this turtle moved the date to avoid getting killed by Mayweather vs Mosley.

And if UFC doesn't have the fighters to make ppv caliber events doesn't that mean they are flopping?
 

Jutt

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This is true, but you tell me how you build a mercurial nutjob like Nate Diaz (I love Nate, but this is true).

Of course, you could go safe and end up with a total pretender like Roger Huerta. :scusthov:

It's an easy thing to say, but in no way is it an easy fix, especially when so many of these guys are completely nondescript.

I was talking about this to Lukie the other day on twitter, and i think were gonna eventually have a round table about it on the podcast, but i think the marketing strategy around UFC has to change, but it wont until the fighters start to create their own brand. Theyve been trying to promote UFC, which is fine and good,but at some point in time people are gonna tune in for the fighters :manny:

They need more shows like 24/7 imo to expose some of these guys. Not all of em are superstar material, but it gives the fighters some foundation to stand on instead of having them hide behind the shadows of the promotion(UFC)
 

TheNatureBoy

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The UFC will be fine, being on network TV hasn't caused a major jump in popularity for them but the recent poor ratings isn't anything to immediately panic at. A lot of promotion went into Jones/Rashad which did well on ppv that the recent Fox event didn't receive the level of hype as the previous shows.
 
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over saturation is the problem...

too many sub par cards... Lombard-Stann should be an opening fight... or a co-main event at the most..

I also believe these are key issues, UFC events use to be great cause they had alot of time to build now they have one almost every week and then you got shyt like TUF UK, Brazil and USA... It feels like all so much
 

TheNatureBoy

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Most mma fights boring as fukk, holds with no movement on the ground, baby taps elbows

Some fights can be boring, but every show has at least a few fights that deliver action. The last FOX show had action throughout the main card, all finishes and the fight that went to decision wasn't boring.
 

Another Man

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Another reason why.....too much fukking wrestling....and the fact that the rules, scoring system and the cage pretty much caters to wrestlers.

No kicks/knees to the head of a downed opponent = low risk/high reward takedown attempts. Wrestlers can pretty much keep shooting for takedowns while only having to worry about being sprawled/darced/guillotene'd and nothing more. Taking away the risk of eating knees or kicks coming in gives them a distinct advantage flat out. Kicks/knees to the head on the ground is one of the things that made pride way more exciting.

The scoring system favors wrestlers heavily as well. Because of this, you have "gameplan" fighters coming in with the intention to simply get dominant position while throwing love taps here and there. I know this is a sport, but come the fukk on, this is the ultimate FIGHTING championships. I miss the old days where dudes came in laying it all on the line ready to either knock someone the fukk out, or make them tap knowing damned well about the risks while not being too scared shytless to lose. Don't get me wrong....I'm not asking for ppl to come in wreckless and can appreciate a good technical battle, but just as long as fighters are actually trying to finish the fukking fight, not doing just enough to get by on points. Once again, pride was more exciting, because simply having a dominate position wasn't enough, you had to actively be going for a sub or finish with strikes, else the ref would stand your ass up or penalize you for inactivity.

Now as far as the cage....I think they should make that shyt smaller. In the pride ring, a striker could close you off and wreck your shyt if you tried to run, so you'd have no choice but to engage. The size of the UFC cage allows fighters to run from strikers a bit too much.

Oh, and I also think that championship fights should have 10 min. first rounds...giving fighters an incentive to go for a finish in title fights instead of leaving it to the judges.

I miss Pride. :wow:
 

Roman Brady

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over saturation is the problem...

too many sub par cards... Lombard-Stann should be an opening fight... or a co-main event at the most..
To hardcores yes.But Joe blow cant tell anderson silva from blanco brimage..From a narrative stand point this headliner can be sold on the back of stann being "an american hero" :rolleyes: and hector bein a champion from another org makin his debut with a staggering 20 fight win streak
The UFC will be fine, being on network TV hasn't caused a major jump in popularity for them but the recent poor ratings isn't anything to immediately panic at. A lot of promotion went into Jones/Rashad which did well on ppv that the recent Fox event didn't receive the level of hype as the previous shows.
Its amazing how this is lost on so many pessimists screaming for bigger headliners next time.There aint a fukin difference between davis/evans and miller/diaz to the general public they are all unknowns.The only reason the 2nd show did numbers was becaus fox marketed it like hell
 

TrueEpic08

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Another problem that hasn't been explicitly commented upon here is just how much shytty kickboxing has come to dominate UFC fights.

Yeah, the rules are heavily geared toward wrestlers. But I would almost take that over watching match-up after mediocre match-up default to 10-20 minutes of circling, all for a leg kick or a slow-ass, impossible to land clean head kick. I grew up watching kickboxing and K-1 Grand Prix on ESPN a few years back, so none of these guys either impress me or are even that good at it. More importantly than that, do you really think that any of the casual audience want to watch a bunch of "strategic" circling?

You could probably count the number of really good strikers in the UFC on two hands. You could count the number of EXCITING ones on one. These guys seriously need to stop with this crap, because it's not helping.

Oh, and by the way? This is another thing we can thank that cro-magnon Dana White for, with his emphasis on finishes and "exciting fights". Has everyone fighting not to get embarrassed and fighting for the moment instead of fighting to win. For old Pride faithfuls like me, this is just utterly galling, one of the worst developments in MMA ever.

But it's not going away any time soon, so :manny:.
 

Majestic Pape

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I was talking about this to Lukie the other day on twitter, and i think were gonna eventually have a round table about it on the podcast, but i think the marketing strategy around UFC has to change, but it wont until the fighters start to create their own brand. Theyve been trying to promote UFC, which is fine and good,but at some point in time people are gonna tune in for the fighters :manny:

They need more shows like 24/7 imo to expose some of these guys. Not all of em are superstar material, but it gives the fighters some foundation to stand on instead of having them hide behind the shadows of the promotion(UFC)
Dana White is too much of a control freak and wants to be the star himself too much. I don't think he wants anyone to be seen as "bigger" than the UFC, even though that would probably be a good thing in the end.
 

Another Man

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Another problem that hasn't been explicitly commented upon here is just how much shytty kickboxing has come to dominate UFC fights.

Yeah, the rules are heavily geared toward wrestlers. But I would almost take that over watching match-up after mediocre match-up default to 10-20 minutes of circling, all for a leg kick or a slow-ass, impossible to land clean head kick. I grew up watching kickboxing and K-1 Grand Prix on ESPN a few years back, so none of these guys either impress me or are even that good at it. More importantly than that, do you really think that any of the casual audience want to watch a bunch of "strategic" circling?

You could probably count the number of really good strikers in the UFC on two hands. You could count the number of EXCITING ones on one. These guys seriously need to stop with this crap, because it's not helping.

Oh, and by the way? This is another thing we can thank that cro-magnon Dana White for, with his emphasis on finishes and "exciting fights". Has everyone fighting not to get embarrassed and fighting for the moment instead of fighting to win. For old Pride faithfuls like me, this is just utterly galling, one of the worst developments in MMA ever.

But it's not going away any time soon, so :manny:.

Breh, MMA kickboxing is different from standard kickboxing. You gotta change your whole stance and everything.(ex: Wide feet, wilder punches) In standard kickboxing, you don't have to anticipate someone shooting a takedown. If you come in MMA doing standard kickboxing/boxing footwork, you're going straight to your back immediately.

...and as I mentioned before, if the UFC cage were smaller, or a ring like pride, you'd see way less circling going on cuz too much circling would eventually get you cornered.
 
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