tough times in 2013 due to tax hikes and rising prices.

[Outlaw]

The education system has been on a steady decline for quite some time, this persisted through the "next big thing" that was the dot com boom.

Wealth gap has continually widened, again inspite of "the next big thing".

It's the overall system that is flawed. You can turn your freefall into a glide from time to time but you're still moving downward. The next big thing will only help for a time, the underlining problems are still there and are being reinforced.

Education
An ingrained corruption in politics
Corporatism

Those three things will be the ultimate end to the USA, i'd venture those three things are ALWAYS the end to "empires". History repeats itself when people don't learn it, and as we have already established our education system is , so no one is learning it...looks like we're destined to repeat.

1) The education system can be improved
2) For every corrupt politician, a "benevolent" (IMO) politican like Obama can be elected - Politics in the Roman Empire were a hell a lot more corrupt, in fact the "republic" was crushed by a dictatorship yet the empire lasted for hundreds of more years.
3) Corporations is a problem but can be regulated, Corporations were more of a problems in the earlier 1900's

 

[Brown_Pride]

1) The education system can be improved
2) For every corrupt politician, a "benevolent" (IMO) politican like Obama can be elected - Politics in the Roman Empire were a hell a lot more corrupt, in fact the "republic" was crushed by a dictatorship yet the empire lasted for hundreds of more years.
3) Corporations is a problem but can be regulated, Corporations were more of a problems in the earlier 1900's

oh sure they can be fixed. they could have been fixed 50-60 years ago too. They haven't ergo the use of the word "trend" (Let me google that for you)

There is always the outside shot that it could change but IF HISTORY has taught us nothing it has taught us that the only way to root out corruption is revolution.

It's also taught us that those 3 potentially fixable situations aren't going to be fixed, else they already would have been.

 

[Yuzo Lightheart]

you think that generations are becoming less and less capable of replacing the former? lol

yes they are. all over the entire developed world, they are. this creates a condition where society is composed increasingly by the elderly, exploding the amount of healthcare that is needed within it, and yet decreasing the amount of money available to pay for it ie the elderly dont work, and so cant create this money for themselves, and spend much less money in the economy than other people, and thus overall spending decreases in a society as it gets clotted with more and more old people.

that creates an intense austerity debate.

should this dwindling amount of money go into the exploding social security and healthcare of the new elderly that are starting to dominate society - or should it go to other things: like low income welfare recipients.

someone will clearly have to take the short end of the stick. this is the crisis that all developed countries face today. no clear solution has yet been found for it.

 

[Outlaw]

yes they are. all over the entire developed world, they are. this creates a condition where society is composed increasingly by the elderly, exploding the amount of healthcare that is needed within it, and yet decreasing the amount of money available to pay for it ie the elderly dont work, and so cant create this money for themselves, and spend much less money in the economy than other people, and thus overall spending decreases in a society as it gets clotted with more and more old people.

that creates an intense austerity debate.

should this dwindling amount of money go into the exploding social security and healthcare of the new elderly that is starting to dominate society - or should it go to other things: like low income welfare recipients.

someone will clearly have to take the short end of the stick. this is the crisis that all developed countries face today. no clear solution has yet been found for it.

Doesn't the amount of immigration, and once this is recognized as a serious problem, simply having more kids counter-react that?

 

[Brown_Pride]

Doesn't the amount of immigration, and once this is recognized as a serious problem, simply having more kids counter-react that?

what?

Why'd you bring up immigration?

 

[Yuzo Lightheart]

except the economy has no place for these minority births, or new immigrants, the economy would need a huge boon to give them work to offset that fate, as you were accurately saying, some sort of new technology like the internet in the 90's

failing to have this, they would simply settle at the bottom of society and permanently require social welfare programs to stay alive

 

[Outlaw]

what?

Why'd you bring up immigration?

He said we aren't having enough kids to support old people, I said immigration helps solve that problem

 

[Outlaw]

except the economy has no place for these minority births, or new immigrants, the economy would need a huge boon to give them work to offset that fate, as you were accurately saying, some sort of new technology like the internet in the 90's

failing to have this, they would simply settle at the bottom of society and permanently require social welfare programs to stay alive

So basically you're saying the death of a whitey majority = the death of America, sorry but that simply isn't true, Whites will become a minority eventually, and America won't die when that happens, it may become stronger.

 

[Yuzo Lightheart]

you'll still be here to find out for yourself if your theory is true

 

[OsO]

lol every single successful economy in the modern era was built through manufacturing.

manufacturing jobs=working class jobs.

two working class people in one household can live a decent life, and thats all most people want. do you know how many unemployed would kill for a 60-hour a week factory job pulling in 40,000 plus benefits?

if we manufactured of all the products we consume that would create an IMMENSE amount of wealth. but as it stands now only the top executives are getting rich in this equation. the CEO is getting rich, the common man is becoming poor.

this is like the most straight-forward thing ever. once the manufacturing jobs started leaving the middle class started deteriorating, and it was not a coincidence.

the education is this country is ass plus there are not enough highly trained-high education jobs to employ everyone. you need layers to an economy... you need the part time/low wage jobs for a certain population. you need the manufacturing working class jobs for a certain population. and you need high-training high education jobs for a certain population. and then you need the bosses. and all of these coexist to create economic balance and economic prosperity.

but currently we have gutted the working class jobs creating a huge gap for that particular population, most of whom have descended into the part time/low wage job category.

and now we're even outsourcing the technology manufacturing, especially to india, so what are people's excuses for that? i guess we dont need those jobs either

please go read and learn how every country in the history of the world built their economies on the selling of manufactured goods... because you sound like idiots. we consume more than any other country on the planet, but none of the shyt we consume are american made products... economically thats fukking retarded.

and brown pride is the only one who wants to talk about our entire system being unsustainable... so what do folks think is gonna happen at the end of this road? get your heads out of the sand and look around, because once you have to be reactive as opposed to proactive youve already lost.

 

[Dusty Bake Activate]

lol every single successful economy in the modern era was built through manufacturing.

manufacturing jobs=working class jobs.

two working class people in one household can live a decent life, and thats all most people want. do you know how many unemployed would kill for a 60-hour a week factory job pulling in 40,000 plus benefits?

if we manufactured of all the products we consume that would create an IMMENSE amount of wealth. but as it stands now only the top executives are getting rich in this equation. the CEO is getting rich, the common man is becoming poor.

this is like the most straight-forward thing ever. once the manufacturing jobs started leaving the middle class started deteriorating, and it was not a coincidence.

the education is this country is ass plus there are not enough highly trained-high education jobs to employ everyone. you need layers to an economy... you need the part time/low wage jobs for a certain population. you need the manufacturing working class jobs for a certain population. and you need high-training high education jobs for a certain population. and then you need the bosses. and all of these coexist to create economic balance and economic prosperity.

but currently we have gutted the working class jobs creating a huge gap for that particular population, most of whom have descended into the part time/low wage job category.

and now we're even outsourcing the technology manufacturing, especially to india, so what are people's excuses for that? i guess we dont need those jobs either

please go read and learn how every country in the history of the world built their economies on the selling of manufactured goods... because you sound like idiots. we consume more than any other country on the planet, but none of the shyt we consume are american made products... economically thats fukking retarded.

and brown pride is the only one who wants to talk about our entire system being unsustainable... so what do folks think is gonna happen at the end of this road? get your heads out of the sand and look around, because once you have to be reactive as opposed to proactive youve already lost.

As usual, you don't know what you're talking about. Stop calling people idiots, calm down, and listen to reason for a sec. We didn't stop manufacturing stuff. Our manufacturing output has been on a steady incline for decades. And it's increased sharply in the last 4 years.

We just manufacture different products and do it with more automation and less manpower. That's obviously very problematic, but it's a result of the natural progression of the global economy. There's no space in our economy to make toilet seats and tables anymore. No corporations is going to keep jobs in America and pay their workers exorbitantly more wages and benefits, when they can drastically cut their labor costs by manufacturing overseas. And large-scale government protectionism would ruin our competitiveness and increase costs which would lead to poor economic growth.

We're now competing with workers in China, India, Brazil, Singapore, and elsewhere. There's no real solution to this problem of lack of decent-paying everyman and everywoman work other than people need to step their education and skills game u (and government needs to have a role in helping to foster that), and if you don't, you're going to get left in the dust. I think it may be beneficial to raise tariffs in certain areas or on certain products, but every economist regardless of ideology knows protectionism as an overall approach isn't a viable option in today's world. If you're running a startup businesses, venture capitalists will look at you like and walk out of the room if you tell them you're not willing to outsource any work.

The uncomfortable truth that a lot of people don't want to seem to accept is that we've gotten spoiled and enjoyed living conditions far better than almost everyone else in the world. That's flattening out now. We can't maintain this standard for ever. Other nations are gonna come up. A lot of people want to invent boogeymen be it the Federal Reserve, or secret elites or whoever because they don't want to accept that we're going to fall off some because when you're on top for over 150 years, there's nowhere to go but down. America will still be aight though...just not as dominant.

 

[Spatial Paradox]

As usual, you don't know what you're talking about. We didn't stop manufacturing stuff. Our manufacturing output has been on a steady incline for decades. And it's increased sharply in the last 4 years.

We just manufacture different products and do it with more automation and less manpower. That's obviously very problematic, but it's a result of the natural progression of the global economy. There's no place in our economy to make toilet seats and tables anymore.

We're now competing with workers in China, India, Brazil, Singapore, and elsewhere. There's no real solution to this problem of lack of decent-paying everyman and everywoman work other than people need to step their education and skills game up, and if you don't, you're going to get left in the dust. It may be beneficial to raise tariffs in certain areas or on certain products, but every economist regardless of ideology knows protectionism isn't a viable option in today's world.

The uncomfortable truth that a lot of people don't want to seem to accept is that we've gotten spoiled and enjoyed living conditions far better than almost everyone else in the world. That's flattening out now. We can't maintain this standard for ever. Other nations are gonna come up. A lot of people want to invent boogeymen be it the Federal Reserve, or secret elites or whoever because they don't want to accept that we're going to fall off some because when you're on top for over 150 years, there's nowhere to go but down. America will still be aight though...just not as dominant.

I agree with your post overall, but I often wonder how far the bolded can go. If a larger number of people get an education and skills in in-demand fields, wouldn't employers simply start being a bit stingier with the pay and/or even pickier about who they hire?

 

[Dusty Bake Activate]

I agree with your post overall, but I often wonder how far the bolded can go. If a larger number of people get an education and skills in in-demand fields, wouldn't employers simply start being a bit stingier with the pay and/or even pickier about who they hire?

Perhaps. But right now we have a situation where we bring in immigrants to fill positions in fields like engineering and IT because we don't have enough skilled workers here.

People need to step up their skills and education even if it's learning a simple trade. My boy who was a slacker/weedhead who didn't give a fukk about school got an apprenticeship in pipe fitting from a community college, came up with that and now he works on a nuclear submarine and makes well over 100K.

Government needs to step do the job of reforming the education system, making education more affordable, and providing people with access to training for jobs that are out there. And investing in science and technology to keep our innovation, and modernizing our infrastructure, which will create jobs in the process, just like every other nation that's serious about being competitive in the future.

But at the end of the day, people need to step their game and get education and skills. fukk complaining about jobs that have gone and are never coming back. Tell your little niece and nephew to go get a STEM education.

 

[Broke Wave]

Perhaps. But right now we have a situation where we bring in immigrants to fill positions in fields like engineering and IT because we don't have enough skilled workers here.

People need to step up their skills and education even if it's learning a simple trade. My boy who was a slacker/weedhead who didn't give a fukk about school got an apprenticeship in pipe fitting from a community college, came up with that and now he works on a nuclear submarine and makes well over 100K.

Government needs to step do the job of reforming the education system, making education more affordable, and providing people with access to training for jobs that are out there. And investing in science and technology to keep our innovation, and modernizing our infrastructure, which will create jobs in the process, just like every other nation that's serious about being competitive in the future.

But at the end of the day, people need to step their game and get education and skills. fukk complaining about jobs that have gone and are never coming back. Tell your little niece and nephew to go get a STEM education.

Competitiveness is two fold. Do you want to attract foreign investment and be competitive in that sense (which America doesn't need), or do you want to be the economic superpower (which America wants to be). If its the latter, then you can't worry about attractive investment or keeping your existing businesses "competitive" with tax rates. What you need to do is force and foster innovation and infrastructure. Numbers on a sheet can only go so far, competitiveness is being created in the labs and not by private equity or accountants.

 

[Dusty Bake Activate]

Competitiveness is two fold. Do you want to attract foreign investment and be competitive in that sense (which America doesn't need), or do you want to be the economic superpower (which America wants to be). If its the latter, then you can't worry about attractive investment or keeping your existing businesses "competitive" with tax rates. What you need to do is force and foster innovation and infrastructure. Numbers on a sheet can only go so far, competitiveness is being created in the labs and not by private equity or accountants.

Which requires long-term commitment, investment, sacrifice, and agility of government, which is hard to come by in the broken political system we have.