Time to Get Honest About These Title Reigns Brehs

[Mantis Toboggan M.D.]

I see where you coming from. I was 12/13 during that time so I can't really remember certain things. Alot the hate came from cena winning all the time tho, Like u said he would get beat up all match then come back to win towards the end.

They completely blew it with how they elevated him to the main event too. They had JBL beat literally every other face on smackdown during his awful run with the belt while every single match he had featured a screw job finish as opposed to even him winning on his own but cheating to do so, so he never established any credibility as the heel they’d have cena winnthe belt off in the first place. Then when he won the belt the first time, he held it for 27 of the next 31 months while going over every established and credible wrestler on raw clean in a manner that just made everyone look bad. It still amazes me just how badly they blew it with him. Even when it became clear the crowd was turning on him, they left him the exact same guy and just had the announcers start calling him the most controversial champ of all time . Lawler even tried to claim the crowd in Italy on raw one week was booing because they don’t like his fashion sense

 

[Dreamzeedream]

Hes not a draw and he's a bytch. Dude gets paid millions of dollars for being lesser than RVD in history. White privilege.

BREH WHAT?


you gotta explain that to me please

 

[CJ]

Wish they went harder with the total days reign instead. Amount of reigns seems so backwards as you lost it that many times also.

 

[R=G]

BREH WHAT?


you gotta explain that to me please

Randy Orton has bombed since 2002. His ratings as champion are embarrassing. He cant even sell out St Louis as a headliner. Hes a true, blue loser as a pushed top star.

 

[Dreamzeedream]

They completely blew it with how they elevated him to the main event too. They had JBL beat literally every other face on smackdown during his awful run with the belt while every single match he had featured a screw job finish as opposed to even him winning on his own but cheating to do so, so he never established any credibility as the heel they’d have cena winnthe belt off in the first place. Then when he won the belt the first time, he held it for 27 of the next 31 months while going over every established and credible wrestler on raw clean in a manner that just made everyone look bad. It still amazes me just how badly they blew it with him. Even when it became clear the crowd was turning on him, they left him the exact same guy and just had the announcers start calling him the most controversial champ of all time . Lawler even tried to claim the crowd in Italy on raw one week was booing because they don’t like his fashion sense

Yo lowkey bro the bold is a big reason why the booking is so fukked up today I think. They pushed and put cena over EVERYBODY except the undertaker and this is the aftermath. You telling me you had all those established and credible wrestlers during that time and cena was the only star that was made(and randy). Roman is/has been booked the same way. They've made the same mistake with roman. They just got lucky because braun turned out to be a superstar but look how they booked him since he lost to lesnar

 

[Dreamzeedream]

Randy Orton has bombed since 2002. His ratings as champion are embarrassing. He cant even sell out St Louis as a headliner. Hes a true, blue loser as a pushed top star.

I think alot of that has to do with booking tho. Dint hbk bomb as champion back in the day? As far as being a draw. Other than the legends/part timers. Who is drawing? Bryan has the biggest ratings on smackdown

 

[Mantis Toboggan M.D.]

Yo lowkey bro the bold is a big reason why the booking is so fukked up today I think. They pushed and put cena over EVERYBODY except the undertaker and this is the aftermath. You telling me you had all those established and credible wrestlers during that time and cena was the only star that was made(and randy). Roman is/has been booked the same way. They've made the same mistake with roman. They just got lucky because braun turned out to be a superstar but look how they booked him since he lost to lesnar

They had everyone lose clean by submission in the final match of the feud or lose a gimmick match of their specialty or lose an I quit match clean, frequently with people interfering for them. After seeing that strategy fail for a decade straight, it’s pure :flabbyvince: to think that doubling down on that method with someone far greener, infinitely worse on the mic, and with nobody clamoring for a main event push for someone that Vince would decide to go that route. Obviously he doesn’t care what the paying customer wants, but I wonder if anyone is personally telling him these ideas are terrible.

I think alot of that has to do with booking tho. Dint hbk bomb as champion back in the day? As far as being a draw. Other than the legends/part timers. Who is drawing? Bryan has the biggest ratings on smackdown

For anyone to be a draw, the product as a whole has to be good. 1997-2000 is really the only point in the last 22-23 years where that’s been the case.

 

[Saysumthinfunnymike]

Let's talk about what would have happened in a different era. If WWE in the 2000s was booked like previous WWE eras..

I'd say from 2005 to 2018 John Cena would be a 5x champion. He probably would have had a stranglehold on the belt a few different times.

I imagine after the Benoit tragedy and they went to PG Cena probably could have very well held the title from 2008 to 2010 no issue.. Probably a two year reign.

I think Batista would have held it a couple times. I think Orton would have held it a couple times.

I think guys like Edge and Punk would have had maybe on run.. Edge's only significant run was his RATED R run after he cashed in on Cena. I could see that reign happening in any era.

Punk would have never held the title as a babyface. He'd have a run as the leader of the straight edge society tho.

 

[boriquaking]

He's still a GOAT. I know he has his ways but yall underrate/disrespect that man's talent so much

Bias aside,hes not ahead of michaels even within the continuity of the show.

He’ll go down as an all time great sure, but

Michaels
Taker
Rock
Angle
Austin

All have less World Championships than triple h, and i really cant see anyone ranking triple h ahead of them.

Throw in people like Jericho, Cena and Booker T and it becomes even harder.

He gave himself titles, and he could give himself 14 more and he still wouldnt br #1 on anyones list.

:edit:

Triple h hasnt been entertaining in like 18 years

 

[Dreamzeedream]

Bias aside,hes not ahead of michaels even within the continuity of the show.

He’ll go down as an all time great sure, but

Michaels
Taker
Rock
Angle
Austin

All have less World Championships than triple h, and i really cant see anyone ranking triple h ahead of them.

Throw in people like Jericho, Cena and Booker T and it becomes even harder.

He gave himself titles, and he could give himself 14 more and he still wouldnt br #1 on anyones list.

:edit:

Triple h hasnt been entertaining in like 18 years

Triple h is a better character and better on the mic than Hbk. And he's over booker T and Y2j. Y2j should be mention with the all time greats but he was always missing something. You can make a case for booker as well. Cena's one is one of the GOAT but prime HHH is a better wrestler

 

[Dreamzeedream]

They had everyone lose clean by submission in the final match of the feud or lose a gimmick match of their specialty or lose an I quit match clean, frequently with people interfering for them. After seeing that strategy fail for a decade straight, it’s pure :flabbyvince: to think that doubling down on that method with someone far greener, infinitely worse on the mic, and with nobody clamoring for a main event push for someone that Vince would decide to go that route. Obviously he doesn’t care what the paying customer wants, but I wonder if anyone is personally telling him these ideas are terrible.


For anyone to be a draw, the product as a whole has to be good. 1997-2000 is really the only point in the last 22-23 years where that’s been the case.

Vince started to think that any reaction is a good reaction and that changed everything. This is the question tho. After all the crazy booking, in the end cena became a legend...will we be saying the same thing about Roman 10 to 15 years from now? No matter what when you take away the part timers he's the most over person in the company that draws the biggest reaction. I think thats how Vince and hhh looks at it



EDIT: Vince probably has alot yes men around him. Triple h is probably the only one that challenges him. You know guys like taker had their say so to

 

[Dreamzeedream]

Let's talk about what would have happened in a different era. If WWE in the 2000s was booked like previous WWE eras..

I'd say from 2005 to 2018 John Cena would be a 5x champion. He probably would have had a stranglehold on the belt a few different times.

I imagine after the Benoit tragedy and they went to PG Cena probably could have very well held the title from 2008 to 2010 no issue.. Probably a two year reign.

I think Batista would have held it a couple times. I think Orton would have held it a couple times.

I think guys like Edge and Punk would have had maybe on run.. Edge's only significant run was his RATED R run after he cashed in on Cena. I could see that reign happening in any era.

Punk would have never held the title as a babyface. He'd have a run as the leader of the straight edge society tho.

Pipe bomb punk would have. He anti authority like Austin and was over as hell.
Rated R/Ultimate Opportunist Edge would have to

 

[R=G]

They had everyone lose clean by submission in the final match of the feud or lose a gimmick match of their specialty or lose an I quit match clean, frequently with people interfering for them. After seeing that strategy fail for a decade straight, it’s pure :flabbyvince: to think that doubling down on that method with someone far greener, infinitely worse on the mic, and with nobody clamoring for a main event push for someone that Vince would decide to go that route. Obviously he doesn’t care what the paying customer wants, but I wonder if anyone is personally telling him these ideas are terrible.


For anyone to be a draw, the product as a whole has to be good. 1997-2000 is really the only point in the last 22-23 years where that’s been the case.

Nah they drew huge in 2001 and Rock/Hogan carried one of the worst WMs ever. Rock basically made Brock Lesnar what he was in 2002. 2003-2005 wasnt big money years. The Trump WM made money. The Floyd WM in 2008 made money. Shawn vs Taker 1 didn't work. Neither did Shawn vs Taker 2.

 

[Dreamzeedream]

Nah they drew huge in 2001 and Rock/Hogan carried one of the worst WMs ever. Rock basically made Brock Lesnar what he was in 2002. 2003-2005 wasnt big money years. The Trump WM made money. The Floyd WM in 2008 made money. Shawn vs Taker 1 didn't work. Neither did Shawn vs Taker 2.

For the third consecutive year, WrestleMania broke the record for the highest-grossing pay-per-view in WWE history, grossing US$6.9 million in ticket sales, which included fans from all 50 U.S. states, 24 countries, and seven Canadian provinces.[1] WrestleMania XXV generated approximately 960,000 pay-per-view buys, grossing $21.0 million in revenue.[9][10] The event pumped an estimated $49.8 million into the local economy and generated $5.7 million in local tax revenue, equating to 600 full-time jobs for the area. With an attendance of 72,744, it is the 8th largest attendance in WrestleMania history.[11]






Shawn vs taker 2 when they main eventer

WrestleMania XXVI generated approximately 885,000 PPV buys, grossing US$49 million in revenue.[10]With an attendance of 72,219, the event grossed $5.8 million in ticket sales, making the event the highest grossing and attended entertainment event held at the University of Phoenix Stadium.[1][11][12][13]

 

[8WON6]

Orton and Edge are the two guys that really should not be anywhere near double digits.